lights (if you are looking) why pay so much

[get-a-fish]

I have just recieved my new lights from oceanproaquatics.com it took me about 3 hours to find the price I wanted to pay but boy what a pay off... heres a little insight if you are rich and just want to throw money away go to about the reef they wanted 72.50 for each bulb (wow). If you are still rich but dont want to throw your money away go to pets inc (49.99)each bulb or aquarium arts(59.99) or az sea bottom(48.00) and if you are just a average guy trying to pay a decent price for a compact bulb go to oceanpro(29.90) each bulb a far cry from 72.50 come on guys we all have internet acces now a days put it this way i had to buy 4 lights 72.50 x 4 =290.00 or 29.90 x 4=119.60 what makes you think we can't fiqure out the total savings of a woping 170.40 not bad for 3 hrs work. the problem is fellow reefers it's not just bulbs it is everything they sell.check it out

[jerryz]

So let me get this straight. You went to the local LFS and goe enough information about your lights to figure out what you needed and then ordered online and take them to task? Or did I miss something?

[azmarine]

And while we're at it, why don't we just insist that all the local fish stores sell their products @ Internet pricing.

I mean after all, it's not like they have any overhead. They're just gouging us to death.. Right?


Of course the internet is cheaper. It's always been that way. But you can't get advice from a shopping cart, and returns are more rof a hassle, and well, the list of detractors goes on and on.

If you want it now, and aren't quite sure what you need, a LFS is the way to go. If you are a savvy shopper, and can afford to wait for the guys in the brown truck to stop by your door, then of course internet or mail order is the cheaper route.

This isn't news. In every business it's "CHEAPER" online.. Not just fish.

Why do you think Sam's club and Costco do such good business?? It's all about overheard my friend..

I wouldn't however go on condeming the local stores for trying to keep their lights on..

[SahuaritaMike]

Although what you are saying is somewhat true LFS have an overhead and demand to keep products on the shelf for all of us to buy when we need it, not to mention the advise we all get and the help.

Where would oceanpro be when you need something asap to save your coral or fish? Probably on the phone telling you to go to your local fish store and get something to save your fish.

I get what you are saying but everything in this world is cheaper on the net and unless you buy everything (groceries,toiletpaper,gas,reef stuff) on the net your really kinda contradicting your post.

IMO and just an opinion not to fight or have answered just putting in my 2 cents.

[get-a-fish]

No I already knew what I was looking for..and for the most part everyone has there own opion on how to run there particular tank why ask for advise from someone you don't know and probably doesn't really care as well. I know how to read up on the information I need and I'm sure everyone does the same this is a hobby and a passion why wouldn't you do your own research thanks again not trying to affend anyone just tryiong to save them a couple of bucks ..

[Garage1217]

I would rather pay Paul at Az seabottom to have a light for $48 on the shelf EXACTLY when I need it than pay an online store $29.99 + shipping to wait for it, hope it does not get broken while all my livestock dies a black death.

That money which supports local the LFS also keeps the lights on in the store for fish that I want, Killer live rock, Hardware when I need it, Advice when I need it, Service if or when an item goes bad etc...

I admit I buy some items online to save cash, but supporting a LFS is KEY to our hobby.

How much did you pay for shipping..?

Was the bulb the exact brand offered by the local stores?

Which bulb was it..?

[get-a-fish]

and yes I understand a LfS must make a profit to stay in business but a mark up of more than 50 % is a bit much don't you think most stores run a 5% to 12% mark up. Also there are only a couple of stores in this valley that can give you the advise you really need and yes one of them is about the reef

[Garage1217]

Um no *LOL* most stores do not run on a 5-12% markup. Any storefront than runs off those numbers will have a large "closed for business" sign on the door within a month.

If you are an internet business with no storefront, most likley drop shipping from a warehouse and selling $20K in product a day whoreing it out, then yeah those numbers are workable.

If a local store sold $2K worth a day which most smaller shops do not come close, on your numbers that would work out to be $100-$240 profit *LOL* Store rent usually runs around $2500-$4000 a month depending on the size of the store. Then you have to pay an employee or two, cover all expenses and your own wages... Running your own business is a VERY hard thing to do in this day and age with the internet.

[hermanx7]

Thanks for the heads up on the cheap bulb replacements.

I dont think that he is trying to dis any of our LFS. Just letting people know of a place they can get a good deal. He did his research and is sharing.

I am all about supporting our LFS. I spend alot of money at them. But on scheduled things like bulb replacement I order on the net. If one happens to go out, then I make my way to the store. Unless ofcourse somebody has a midnight madness sale with the 12k reeflux bulbs on sale.

[get-a-fish]

bulb was the exact kind, shipping was 12.00 bucks and it was a 96watt square pin 10k compact fluorcent it is also one of the most used bulbs. also as I was calling around I would let the help know what I wanted most of them did not even know what I was talking about. boy I'm glad I did not need advise on bulbs from them..something to think about

[get-a-fish]

Thanks hermanx7 that is all I'm trying to do and I also spend alot of money in LFS but sometimes enough is enough

[Garage1217]

$12 per light or for 4 lights..? Good deal on shipping if it was $12 for all 4 lights.

And yeah, not trying to sound like I am bashing or flaming, I just hate it when we loose a good LFS because of smaller purchases that could be made through them +/- a few bucks are given to product whore houses.

Also if you plan to purchase online, Always ask if the LFS can come close to matching it or sometimes they can beat the prices, a lot of times they can have the stuff in the same day or next.

[relaxednature]

thanks get-a-fish , I'll add them to my list of online people to shop from.

[Philwd]

Biggest issue I have with the OP is the statement

"it's not just bulbs it is everything they sell."

Couldn't be more wrong. I've gotten several fish cheaper than on-line. Dry goods too. Yes there is markup. Want a real eye-opener? Price out furniture markups.

We need to support our LFS. They are the ones that grow the hobby; not the on-line tailers. Whether it's AT or ATR or Azsea we need them all. Yeah I've bought on-line but the vast majority has been for items I couldn't get locally. Deltec skimmer, Vortech pumps, Icecap ballasts etc. My latest frag tank was almost completely bought locally for cheaper than I found on-line. Only the lighting was on line as I found a 60 day old unit for 30% of new on ebay.

You know if you tried to foster a relationship with your local LFS rather than bashing them you might be surprised at the results.

[Doglover_50]

Nice post Phil.
On rereading the original post, it is not the factual information about cheaper goods that strikes a cord--it is your tone, which comes across as more than bit haughty, less than fully informed (12% markup?), curiously and highly judgemental in implicating us fellow reefers and how we choose to buy things (perhaps we do know what the internet is?), and finally illuminative that the problem with LFSs seems to be simply, "everything they sell."

I'm not offended, and I don't think anyone is offended--more like sadly shaking their heads at the cheap shots you take in your post. IMO, your point on cheap goods is well taken (we've all enjoyed the triumph of scoring a great deal), your tone--not so much.

[jasonh]

I think we all know it's cheaper to buy stuff online, so I really see no reason for this thread. Now if you wanted to make a thread for "hey, check out this online shop I had a good experience with," then that's cool.

I personally try to support the LFS when it's feasible. I buy most things at AZSB now, and shop at AT now and again (I get water every few weeks from AT). The only time I really rather shop online is when it makes a significant difference. Like, if I could find a light fixture online for $150 less than in the store...sure, I'll go online. I don't work at Burger King, so I'm not going to turn up my nose at the thought of spending an extra $20 or so on a purchase.

[Frizz]

Originally posted by get-a-fish
and yes I understand a LfS must make a profit to stay in business but a mark up of more than 50 % is a bit much don't you think most stores run a 5% to 12% mark up.

ahh, the words of someone who has no concept whatsoever of how much it costs to run a buisiness.
Frizz

[evolust]

This thread is going to go the way of so many other threads have gone in the past, down. I'm not agreeing with either side but give the guy a break, he was trying to help everyone save a few bucks and it seems like most people are giving him a hard time. If you dont agree with it shop at the LFS. I dont believe he ever bashed any of the LFS, he just said they are expensive compared to online, which they are, but for a reason. I wonder why people hassle others pointing out a way to save them a buck?

[JMCAquarium]

You need understand somthing there bro it's cool to do online ordering I mean check out my thread I post every other month never once have I heard anything bad about it if you want somthing "cheaper" and can wait for it then it's great you need somthing now then it sucks.You don't need to go around making it seem like everyone taking you for all your worth it's over head it has to happen or no business would make it.
Go to LFS chit chat wonder around check out all the stuff you can't afford and go home happy (can't do that online) hell I take entire days devoted to LFS "running" going and checking out all the stores and what they have.
This is how most people feel you have to support the local folks, in order to get better "in house" deals shop their more the larger the volume the cheaper the prices since the store owners can get the things in, in larger bulk orders at once rather then scattered to the 4 winds.
Myself personally I purchase all my equipment and stock from LFS only my clients orders are posted online to give them the better cheaper deals and I can get everything in one shot. everyone has Got to support the little man then the little man will hook ya up with stuff in return.
ATR ----Free educational classes
AZSB ----Midnight madness sales
they can't do this stuff if they are not supported by us.
Not talking bad about ya hell when I first started I never shopped local but then I was told the same thing I just told you, now I do shop local.

[jasonh]

Originally posted by evolust
This thread is going to go the way of so many other threads have gone in the past, down. I'm not agreeing with either side but give the guy a break, he was trying to help everyone save a few bucks and it seems like most people are giving him a hard time. If you dont agree with it shop at the LFS. I dont believe he ever bashed any of the LFS, he just said they are expensive compared to online, which they are, but for a reason. I wonder why people hassle others pointing out a way to save them a buck?

Originally posted by get-a-fish
I have just recieved my new lights from oceanproaquatics.com it took me about 3 hours to find the price I wanted to pay but boy what a pay off... heres a little insight if you are rich and just want to throw money away go to about the reef they wanted 72.50 for each bulb (wow). If you are still rich but dont want to throw your money away go to pets inc (49.99)each bulb or aquarium arts(59.99) or az sea bottom(48.00) and if you are just a average guy trying to pay a decent price for a compact bulb go to oceanpro(29.90) each bulb a far cry from 72.50 come on guys we all have internet acces now a days put it this way i had to buy 4 lights 72.50 x 4 =290.00 or 29.90 x 4=119.60 what makes you think we can't fiqure out the total savings of a woping 170.40 not bad for 3 hrs work. the problem is fellow reefers it's not just bulbs it is everything they sell.check it out

This doesn't really sound like it's just "trying to save us a buck" it sounds like trying to tell everyone they should shop at oceanpro instead of the LFS for everything. Had this person not joined in Nov 2005, I would've guessed it was someone that just hops on forums, advertising for his website.

When it comes time for me to replace all my PC lights, will I spend $50-70 each in an LFS? Probably not. I'll probably get them online for cheaper. I think quite a few people would. If I had a bulb burn out tonight, where would I get a quick replacement? AZSB.

I don't think the issue people are having is with the actual subject matter of the original post, more just the tone I would think.

[30reef]

I agree with the OP about great online deals. I buy most (umm, all) of my equipment online. I do still buy livestock locally though. And food too. My biggest gripe (and it's no one's fault except for living in Phoenix) is all of the LFS are on the East side of town. To all of you that live on the East side, you have no idea what I'm talking about. I would love to be able to visit Paul's new place, but it is just too far to justify the drive. So for me, it's buying online or do without. I would think lots of Westsiders feel this way. Once in a while, I will travel to AT after work to get something small or just to see what's new in their reef display. ATR would be better but I couldn't get there before they close. (or AZSB)

So I say give the OP a break will ya. I didn't take what he said as a LFS bashing, just a price comparison of some lights he found online at a much better deal. Alot of the things I have posted in this forum lately have gotten me in hot water. I don't think we need to be so harsh on each other, we all have opinions and that's ok. I also don't think that every sentence needs to be broken down and analyzed as they are frequently here. This is not such a freindly place anymore. Just my opinion though.

Keith

[evolust]

Originally posted by 30reef
I don't think we need to be so harsh on each other, we all have opinions and that's ok. I also don't think that every sentence needs to be broken down and analyzed as they are frequently here. This is not such a freindly place anymore. Just my opinion though.

Keith

I agree! We are all here to be friends and be part of a group. My .02

[JMCAquarium]

Well if I came accross harsh or judgmental I did not mean to. In the end Order how ever or where you want weather online or LFS. Just watch how you speak of the locals they are only trying to make a living is all I was trying to say I guess.
I am freindly but also long winded at times my apologizes

[azocean]

I also agree leave the guy alone let the man have a brain so we all dont thinkkalike big deal. I have bought from both online because they are cheaper and LFS because I like my stuff sometimes now. I agree with get-a-fish. Leave him alone.

[brentsharp]

Thanks for the heads up on the lights get-a-fish. I see a lot of people slamming you but I see a lot of threads for online group buys hum thats kind of strange. I understand about staying in business but some stores do mark up way more than 5-12% yesterday I went to buy a lawnmower one store had them for $25 dollars and another had it for $12 thats 100% price difference why.