sump, fuge plumbing questions

[rockwyld]

Hi people, maybe somebody could help me out. I'm setting up my new 90 gallon (36x24x24) tank and have a few plumbing questions. I am running a seperate sump and refugium.
1)-- Can my Phos reactor be placed in the fuge at the pump-out section?
2)-- Can the fuge (elevated higher than the sump) drain back to the pump-out section of the sump?
I am running an external pump but dont have room to plump both sump and fuge returns together on same pump. So as I have it now- water from tank overflow goes down to a T. One side of T goes to sump, the other side of T goes to fuge. Slower water flow from fuge and faster water flow from the sump meet at end of sump (mix) and then is pumped back to tank. Is this going to work?
3) I have two external pumps, which one should I use for the return? Iwaki 100 pressure pump or a Gen-X 40. There will be NO closed loop, only 3 powerheads inside tank. thanks

[KMP]

sorry - no help; but those are interesting (nice) tank dimensions. is it acrylic?

[kevin95695]

Do you have pictures or diagrams?

[MrMikeB]

1) You want to place your Phos reactor as close to 'clean' water as you can. So the pump-out section, and I am assuming this is where your return is, would be ideal. The less you can clog the Phos media, the better you are. Especially with the refugium - let the algae eat the PO4 before its stripped in the reactor.

2) Personally, I think it best that ALL your water at least get filtered through your mechanical/chemical/filtration/etc. at some point before hitting the return. Bypassing that for half of the water seems counterproductive to me. I would recommend your overflow hit the fuge, and then go to the sump for filtration. Elevating the fuge higher than the sump should work nicely IMO (no extra pump). It will also allow your refugium to do its job and naturally 'filter' the water before your equipment have their go at it.

And if possible, you might do well to put a filter sock directly on the overflow to catch the larger bio-matter. If not, you might accumulate the larger stuff in your refugium over time. You would not believe how many chromis I have pulled out of the filter sock at one time or another.

3) High pressure pumps should only be used when you have a lot of head pressure to deal with or need very strong and direct flow. You want water volume for a return, not pressure. The Gen-X are good pumps, but in my experience, you might want to be sure to T off the return to keep from blasting your livestock all over the place.

Hope this helps!

[rockwyld]

thank you MrMikeB for responding, but that leads me to another question- Shouldn't the flow thru rate be different for sump vrs fuge. I thought you wanted you water flow thru the fuge to be slow, somewhat of just having the water barely moving. Then i thought you wanted a high turnover ( 6x ) through your sump. If I follow what you are advising, water from tank to fuge to sump back to tank, how do I control the flow?
KMP-- tank is glass

[MrMikeB]

If you are putting together a refugium to export nutrients (via macro algae, filter feeders, etc.) then the more water you have passing through the system, the more nutrients have the opportunity to be exported. Pass the entire water stream through it. Use baffles, or other means to keep from dumping your refugium contents into your sump of course.

Some sumps have actual compartments in the center for water to flow through a refugium like compartment. My 150 has such a compartment - the water flows in off the overflow, where it meets the skimmer, and then flows through the fuge area, onto the return area where I run my reactors and other chemical filtration methods. In that fuge section I will run reef mud, algae, and a plethora of other type of nasty looking stuff that does great things for the water.

[JJ4417]

If you put the mechanical media after the fuge, don't you strip the pods out?

I'm planning mine to go remote dsb, (maybe uv), skimmer, sump, tank. The fuge will have macro algae, but mainly want to use it for a food source. Put 80% of the water through the main line, maybe 20% through the fuge. If the tank turnover is high enough 5-10x, would it really matter that 20% goes through the fuge?

[rockwyld]

exactly what i was thinking jj4417

[reefer334]

Originally posted by MrMikeB
In that fuge section I will run reef mud, algae, and a plethora of other type of nasty looking stuff that does great things for the water.

What else do you put in your fuge?Sorry I did not meen to hijak this thread,I am just getting ready to set up a new sps tank and I like your idea of the sump/fuge.Thanks,Chris

[JJ4417]

Rock, I still need to run over and see your tanks. What are you working on?

I can see why Mike puts his mechanical last...reef mud in the tank would be bad.

Mike, does it just depend on the purpose and contents of your fuge?

[rockwyld]

jj4417- I work nights and am home in the days, so come over when you can or the weekends also work. Just got this cubeish 90 and am setting up first in the garage. LMK Lance cell 916 749 8119

[JJ4417]

Sounds good, I'll catch you on the weekend.

[MrMikeB]

Originally posted by reefer334
What else do you put in your fuge?Sorry I did not meen to hijak this thread,I am just getting ready to set up a new sps tank and I like your idea of the sump/fuge.Thanks,Chris

Well it definitely depends on your goals for your refugium. Mine is to act as a nutrient export, so its chock full of macro algae, small clams (not the pretty types), xenia (yeah even xenia), sponges, and a bit more live rock to provide surface area for stuff to live on. I also grow baby snails down there - not by design, it just kind of happened that way.

[MrMikeB]

Originally posted by JJ4417


Mike, does it just depend on the purpose and contents of your fuge?

Exactly. Just like anything else you have to be clear on what your goals are, and build to it. Some goals may be mutually exclusive to each other - or at least counterproductive, so start with a plan, and keep focused.

[reefer334]

Ya I would like my fuge to be a nutrient export aswell.Do you think all of this could be done in a 36 inch sump.I am planning on putting a asm g-3 in it aswell.My thought were the first baffle section is for water from the overflow with filter socks on them and in the same place the skimmer,next the fuge baffle section.and last the return and phos reactor.Would it be better to have the skimmer in its own baffle section after the intake section?I am a rookie at this reef thing so any help is greatly appreciated.Is it better to do the baffles so they overflow into the next section or is there a better way to do it?Thanks Chris

[Marko9]

Chris, I will let you take a look at mine when you come over today. I have mince set up that way and it is only 29 long. I will also show you a great link to a sump design that I am thinking of using, in fact, check out Melev's different designs. Marc is really knowledgeable and has a some good ideas. I plan on doing 36 inch sump that will have 18 inches for skimmer 6-8 inches for my return area and the rest as my DSB/refugium. It will be 20 inches wide.
http://www.melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/f/sump_f.html

[reefer334]

Thanks Mark,I will see you around 3 pm, Chris

[Marko9]

Here are a couple shots of my DIY project from a few months back. It has worket out fine so far, but I definitely have a better idea what I am looking for this time around.