pumps for 180 gal

biger · #1 11/14/2007, 07:09 PM

Hello, I built 2 sump/refugiums for a 180 gal tank in my basement and am trying to decide which pumps to run insump. I am thinking about 2 Eheim 1260's or 1262's or 2 Ocean Runner 3500's or 6500's. I have read good things about both. Just wondering which ones you guys would suggest. Also these pumps aren't on the head loss calculator so any suggestions are appreciated. ( I have approx 4.5 feet of head to consider and 2 feet of horizontal for each pump.)

Thanks, Gary

sjm817 · #2 11/14/2007, 07:48 PM

Submersible pumps are not a good choice for a basement pump. They are not meant for high head use. You are better off with an external.

biger · #3 11/14/2007, 08:09 PM

I meant to say that the aquarium and the sumps are all in the basement. I have about 4.5' of total head distance. I built the sumps so that I don't have room for external pumps. Sorry for the confusion.

sjm817 · #4 11/14/2007, 08:17 PM

OK. Thats different. If you want to use two pumps, a pair of Eheim 1260s would be good. I have a friend with a 180 that uses a single 1262 that works out very nicely. Is the layout such that you need two pumps? What is the layout, and how are you keeping it balanced?

biger · #5 11/14/2007, 09:22 PM

I have two 1 and 1/2" drains and two 3/4" returns. I built 2 sump/refugiums and figured I'd put 1 pump in each sump. I have the 2 sumps connected with a 1" valve in case one pump quits. I plan on having each pump on a separate circuit.

sjm817 · #6 11/14/2007, 11:28 PM

If each sump has its own drain and return pump, there needs to be plumbing between them or else one will eventually overflow.

Can you post a diagram?

biger · #7 11/15/2007, 03:22 AM

I am not computer savvy so I don't know how to do diagrams but the sumps are plumbed together with a 1" true union ball valve.

WDWDen · #8 11/15/2007, 10:30 AM

I have 2 seperate sumps and have been haveing issues getting them to balance out. I'm curious to see how you make out.

biger · #9 11/15/2007, 10:57 AM

Hey WD, do you have your sumps plumbed together. I have mine sitting about 5" apart and plumbed to each other with a 1" ball valve. I figured that way if one pump stops the other will still be able to draw water from both sumps.

sjm817 · #10 11/15/2007, 12:13 PM

They have to have a balance tube in between them. The two pumps wont pump the same amount, nor will the two overflows drain back the same amount.

biger · #11 11/15/2007, 12:39 PM

Hey sjm, what exactly is a balance tube? The 1" ball valve connection I have set up is connected between the two pump chambers. It is right next to where the pumps will be. Just another quick question. I have been able to find a flow chart for the Eheims but not the OC's. Looks like the 1262's would be about 600 gph after head loss and the 1260's would be about 450 gph. I am no longer considering the OC 6500 as I think it would be too much but still considering the 3500's or now maybe the 2500's. Obviously the OC's are cheaper and the 2500 is only 38 watts but I want to get what is best. What do u think of those? Do u still think the 1260's are best?

Thanks for ur time with this.

G

sjm817 · #12 11/15/2007, 01:09 PM

Balance tube is just a pipe between to two systems. If the ball valve was open, and water could flow between the two sumps, that should work. A diagram would really help.

On the pumps, both Eheim and OR get good marks. I think the Eheim is a bit better in flow and durability, but they cost more too.

davocean · #13 11/15/2007, 01:16 PM

Both Eheim and OR's are so equal IMO.
I believe it was AZdesertrat that did a test on both and swears the OR is more efficient.
I have the 1262 and love it.
Eheim has an excellent rep/trackrecord, but OR's seem to be proving to be very worthy as well and they are cheaper.

biger · #14 11/15/2007, 02:21 PM

Ok thanks, then what I have is a balance tube. I plan on leaving the ball valve open all the time. It was just in case I need to take one sump out for emergency or maintenance etc. Trying to think of every possibility that I can. One of the reasons I am leaning toward Eheims is I have no idea how much pressure is lost to head on the OR's. Can't seem to find any info on them. I do like the price of the 2500 and the low wattage but not sure if the flow would be enough after 4.5 feet of head pressure. By the way how much flow do u guy's think I need? I plan on making these refugiums/sumps

davocean · #15 11/15/2007, 02:46 PM

3-5x total volume turnover after head loss is good for sump.

biger · #16 11/15/2007, 04:29 PM

Ok, I found flow charts for both brands. As near as I can calculate just based on head pressure at 5' the results are:

E 1262 - 600gph OR 3500 - 700gph
E 1260 - 450gph OR 2500 - 395gph

Of course none of this takes into account 3 - 90 degree elbows and 1 - 45 degree elbow in each return line. 2 of the 90's are due to the sea swirls on each return.

I figure after I allow for rock and not having the tank filled to the brim that I will have approx 150gals. So u can see that I am within the 3 - 5 volume turnover with all except the 2500.

Is it better to b closer to the 5x or the 3x?

I thought I read on here somewhere that it's better to go on the low side for refuges.

biger · #17 11/15/2007, 05:27 PM

Also not sure how easy it is to hook these pumps up to plumbing. I thought I read a post where someone said the OR's are metric threads. Do u guys know of any issues with either brand?

thanks.

biger · #18 11/15/2007, 07:24 PM

Davocean, thanks for the info. I just read some of AZdesertrat's posts and it sounds like the OR's are pretty good. Do u guy's think the 2500 would b enough they would save on elec and heat but not sure if they have enough flow. Maybe I should just go with the 3500's. Also have u heard if any of these pumps have issues with startup? I am often away for days and want to make sure they start back up in case of pwr outages.

davocean · #19 11/15/2007, 09:24 PM

I like mine more towards 5x, so go w/ the 3500 and you can always tune it down w/ a valve if needed(most likely not)
The Eheim's are known to have the goofy euro threads that usually require LOTS of teflon tape, but no big.
Never heard start up probs, just check your water level for power failure overflow.
My sump is about 80% capacity to allow for PF overflow, and my locklines are high up so I get an early siphon break.

sjm817 · #20 11/15/2007, 09:32 PM

I seen posts of people who have had 3500 & 1262. The claimed the 1262 had a lot more flow. Never seen a comparison between a 1260 and 2500 that I can recall. For a 180, I would use a pair of 1260s or 2500's.

biger · #21 11/15/2007, 10:45 PM

thanks for all the help. it is a tough decision

czerbe · #22 11/15/2007, 11:43 PM

dart, dart, dart , dart you can't go wrong with a dart, dart, dart

biger · #23 11/16/2007, 01:53 AM

I need to go submersible cause no room for external.