orca skimmers - Page 5

steve the plumb · #**101** 04/11/2007, 10:17 PM

I think you should be fine so you will be going with a wider neck "22 height "8 body and 3 modded pumps on a 90 gal.I think a skimmer like the one you are building can probably do a 200 gal tank.

skey44 · #**102** 04/11/2007, 10:23 PM

actually just one of the modded pumps... lol! he calls his version of the pump the (H3) but it is like the octopus 300. The aquabee pumps are outa my price range a bit and he thinks the single pump should be fine. i also think i could add pumps to this later on if i decided to up my tank size.

hahnmeister · #**103** 04/12/2007, 12:48 AM

If possible, I would do an Oceanrunner 3500 instead of a Octo. The octos, like other chinese clone pumps, run at higher than the mfg. spec wattage (heat, energy waste, etc). Besides, a stock OR3700 NW will do 800lph on a skimmer that tall w/o any mods even. Thats pretty much what the new turboflotor 'blue' is... 28scfh (800lph). If you mesh mod a OR 3500/3700, you will get over 1000lph.

skey44 · #**104** 04/12/2007, 01:20 AM

thanks hahn... i was hoping you would chime in, is the oceanrunner truly made in germany though??? and does it actually run true to wattage?

hahnmeister · #**105** 04/12/2007, 02:37 AM

It runs much lower wattage, and gets about the same if not better performance than the Turbines.

What I suspect is that in the reverse-engineering, the 'cloners' decided they could get away with less copper in the coils, as ORs, eheims, etc have more copper in the motor because they are also made to handle 220v. Well, 110v pumps dont need as much in the coils, so if the Octos are US bound only, they would use less copper to cut costs (copper has been getting pricey and unstable lately). This is okay, but too much means more heat, more amps, etc. Those Aqua Euro Gen-X clones run 50% over the 40 watt spec on the pump's label when run w/o air. The Octos have been recorded at well over 100 watts each.

My mesh modded Oceanrunners top out at about 60 watts. Much cooler and better.

skey44 · #**106** 04/12/2007, 05:36 AM

so are ocean runners really made in Germany or somewhere other than China? I also know in some european countries certain things can be as little as painted in the country and be considered "made in _______" I used to be a cyclist and some bicycles that were made in Italy used a Chinese frame and were merely painted and packaged in Italy and this qualified them for a made in Italy sticker. just a thought, but yeah if the ocean runner is more efficient then i should probably ask about getting one of these instead. Is the 3500 hard to mesh mod at all or do you have to get the 3700 to mesh mod it... im sure Shawn could put on his own venturi and send me the mesh to mod the 3500 if it is this simple.

steve the plumb · #**107** 04/12/2007, 09:06 AM

Shawn can mesh mod the pump for you.I wasn't sure how many and wich pumps you were going to use.3 pumps did sound like an overkill.I think he does have a skimmer with 1 pump.I was going to get the 3 skimmer pump(with aqua medic pumps) monster till I decided to go with a dart.I think the aqua medic pumps are great and have very reasonable prices.Hahn probably knows wich is a better pump.You can take a look at aqua medic skimmers to compare sizes if you like.I think the aqua medics are made in Korea.

steve the plumb · #**108** 04/12/2007, 09:17 AM

I see the model you want to buy.I think the wider body model that was more expensive has a stronger pump.The diff in price was $100.I think.More than likely you want the 3500 aqua medic pump.Modded both pumps are fine.Have you decided what body size you will go with.Both those skimmer look nice

skey44 · #**109** 04/12/2007, 10:21 AM

external skimmer with 8.5" body and 4" neck but a little shorter and stubbier- 22" total height. 1 pump recirculating w/ oceanrunner 3500 mesh mod. wider neck and body to handle bigger modded pump, future upgrade in tank size, and no need for the flanged top for cleaning (can fit hand in for cleaning and save $). 3/4" inlet and 1" gate valve outlet. he usually puts 1.5 gate valves on but i don't need that much flow through and have limited room so he is going to look for a 1" gate instead. shawn said he has stopped doing irreversible mods... ie trimming impeller for mesh mod, snapping off pins on needle wheels... but i think i can do this fine. he helped me with my budget also and we talked about every option and the pros and cons of it and the price increase factor.

btw has anyone seen the bubble master style skimmer he recently added in his gallery? that thing is awesome! one H 3000 pump as the nw inlet pump and an aquabee as a recirculator, cool combining of ideas in my perspective. the extra machining looks pricey though (bubble plate, and extra interior tube).

hahnmeister · #**110** 04/12/2007, 01:42 PM

Boy, that bubblemaster recirc design looks familiar...

kodyboy · #**111** 04/12/2007, 01:44 PM

it certainly does....remember imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

hahnmeister · #**112** 04/12/2007, 02:02 PM

Well, its all based on Royal-Exclusiv anyways...

andyjd · #**113** 04/12/2007, 02:11 PM

If I go for a custom skimmer, how tall can I go with an Eheim?

hahnmeister · #**114** 04/12/2007, 02:16 PM

I would go no more than under 30" of water. This doesnt limit you much though as far as skimmer height goes. If the pumps are mounted up on the skimmer body (rather than rest on the floor with the outlets going up and over to the skimmer with an elbow)so that the air intake is at the highest possible point, you could have a 4'+ skimmer still... only the pumps arent at the bottom. Also, keep in mind that I said 30" of water... so you have another good 12" or so of foam collection cup on there. I would say that beyond 48"-54" of total skimmer height though, you will start to see the pump performance go below what its worth though.

Look at Deltec like this one...
http://www.deltecusa.us/proteinskimmers/ap1006.php

Note that the pumps are higher up on the body, with the outlet facing down to blow the bubbles down into the body further, and that the pumps are a good ways up the side of the body. The intakes from the pumps below can be used to create a nice downdraft as well. On this config, the pumps are still getting rated at 750lph... so a 25% drop in output at 42" of total skimmer height.

Here, look at this older model that Spazz did... something like 6'tall...

look at how the pumps are so high on the body, and the intakes from the pumps are down lower... and all the bubbles that are being dragged down in the skimmer body from this. There is no reason you couldnt do this with eheims (those are OR 2700s only on that skimmer) and get the same effect.

steve the plumb · #**115** 04/12/2007, 03:37 PM

I was at my LFS yesterday.I did see a very nice RC style Beckett skimmer with 1 injecter.I have to say that it wasn't loud and it had very fine small bubbles.The skimmer was made here in Quebec.Owner had it running on his acro tank(about 8x150gal tanks) combined.The skimmer was rated for 1000 gal.I should take some pics of it running.He told me he has had it running for 5 months and the injecter didn't need cleaning.He also has the Deltec AP 703 and it put that skimmer to shame.I like the way the bubble diffuser plat was made.The skimmer itself wasn't (in my opinion)a top notch build.

skey44 · #**116** 04/12/2007, 03:55 PM

I guess saying that is a big skimmer is an understatement (at least for me). why did he use or 2700?

steve i have never been too fond of the beckett design bc of the increase in pump size to get effectiveness and the reported finicky nature of these (just what i hear no experience). for a larger system though many swear by them and their ability to get the crud out. are you currently in the market for a skimmer?

andyjd · #**117** 04/12/2007, 03:59 PM

I cant go over 34" to the top of the skimmer cup...so what diameter can i go up too with the Eheim?

hahnmeister · #**118** 04/12/2007, 04:09 PM

34" tall... with one eheim 1262 you could get away with a 6" diameter, although 8" would be better... but with 8" on that height, you could accomidate two eheims almost. Its hard to say.... it really depends on how you set up the skimmer... pump up higher, or at the bottom with a bubble plate... etc.

andyjd · #**119** 04/12/2007, 04:13 PM

Excellent, the ability to add another pump later on is going to be important

Having the bubble plate is an interesting concept and not something I had considered.

More for me to think about!

E-A-G-L-E-S · #**120** 04/12/2007, 05:26 PM

Hahnmeister....have you tested the octo-3000's or someone else?
Just wondering about your statements about the octo's running at higher wattage. You may be 100% correct, but mine feels cool to the touch and is run externally 24/7.
Thanks.

hahnmeister · #**121** 04/12/2007, 06:01 PM

No, I dont have an octo myself. I was basing that off of RichConley's posts w/ a kill-a-watt, as well as others in the octopus skimmer modding thread. Im sure it depends on the impeller you use as well... mesh modding, clipping the needles, how many layers you use, what kind of material, etc... can all affect the actual wattage. From what I remember, these pumps are running about 40% over spec.

E-A-G-L-E-S · #**122** 04/12/2007, 06:04 PM

TY.

steve the plumb · #**123** 04/12/2007, 06:40 PM

I am getting a skimmer from ORCAI just was surprised to see this becket work aswell as it does.My LFS guy said the same thing he has never seen a skimmer work aswell as this brand.The company is C&C Marine out of Quebec but they don't have a web site.I swa the skimmer in action and I have to say it was pulling alot of nog.I wouldn't go out and buy it but it did work well.He was running a coralife pump on it.I liked to diffuser plate.I will try and take some pics the next time I go to the store.

andyjd · #**124** 04/12/2007, 06:41 PM

I've asked ORCA for a quote

smackwater · #**125** 04/12/2007, 08:20 PM

Quote:

congrats to whoever received that 3 pump beast it looks awesome and made it into the orca systems gallery!

thanks