Unpredictable MR-1

bashduo · #1 02/01/2007, 09:45 PM

I've had a My Reef Creations MR-1 skimmer up and running for over two weeks now, (one with the quick realease option), but haven't had much luck in getting it to consistantly skim. Water level and air needle valve look good, but it generally does not make foam for hours - then... when you least expect it, over skims and quickly fills or overflowsthe bucket or catch container. (I since constructed a catch container with shut off to prevent a dry sump.) I talked to Andy last week but have yet to get it ironed out. Any ideas?

Paulairduck · #2 02/01/2007, 10:11 PM

when I ran mine it worked well with the Genx pcx 30 pump and I had to make sure that the return from the skimmer was above the water level to stop surging in the skimmer.

When adjusting it, only 1/4 turns and wait for a couple of hours, to see the skimming results. It is a necessity to have the auto stop to prevent overflows, but once it was dialed in it worked great

cweder · #3 02/01/2007, 11:01 PM

This can be frustrating. I have had the same problem. Usually the overflow happens at night. I dont have any clear solutions, but I like to run mine with as much air as possible and make the adjustments only when the system is very stable: meaning you have not added any food or top off water or anything for at least 4 hours. I have noticed much better skimming and more consistancy of the bubbles when I drip kalk. Dripping Kalk seems to kick mine into gear.

SDguy · #4 02/02/2007, 10:33 AM

I had this problem when I first set up my skimmer, but after a few weeks, it just didn't happen anymore. I think my problem was making too large of adjustments and not waiting long enough.

bashduo · #5 02/02/2007, 06:21 PM

I'm hoping I've just been tinkering too much too often. I've got it to product nice fine bubbles, however, there are a few larger ones popping up every so often. The skimate is pretty wet, when I try to lower the water level or reduce air - it seems to want to quit skimming altogether. My MR-1 is sitting in the sump with sump water level about 1.5" below the top of the box. Driving it with a Mag 18 (Larger than the minimum Mag 12 and recommended by Andy at MRC.) The cotton "muffler" material quickly got wet - I removed it and stuck a tight fitting piece of tubing into the muffler opening so it won't suck spray. I kind of wish I hadn't ordered one with the quick release since it block view of a good portion of the bubble action. Do you all find it's best to run full or almost full air and then simply lower / raise water level to adjust bubble wetness?

Thanks!

manderx · #6 02/02/2007, 09:19 PM

you *must* sit it up on a platform so that the drain is not submerged in any way.

SDguy · #7 02/03/2007, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by manderx
you *must* sit it up on a platform so that the drain is not submerged in any way.

Um, no, you don't.

As long as the water level of the area where the drain is entering the sump is constant, and therefore not creating backpressure variations due to fluctuating water level, then you'll be fine (check with MRC for MAX sump water level for the MR-1 - I know it's 10" for the MR-2). My drain is well below the water level in my sump.

manderx · #8 02/03/2007, 12:51 AM

i don't agree (especially since he *is* having a problem). with it submerged, even something as subtle as random currents and eddies within the sump can affect the backpressure on the drain. it is simply much easier if you get it up out of the water and free-draining.

SDguy · #9 02/03/2007, 11:20 AM

Well, my sump is TINY, so the eddies and currents going on right where the drain enters the sump are ridiculous, so I do not think that is the problem. Besides, how many people have enough room under their tank to raise the skimmer above he sump water line

That would be a poorly designed skimmer if it were true, IMHO.

We agree to disagree I guess.

klasiksb · #10 02/03/2007, 11:28 AM

SDguy is correct in regards to the drain being submerged. Ran mine that way for along time without issue (in regards to the drain being the problem). Non-pressure pumps are the problem.

The problem with bashduo's skimmer probably has to do with the Mag 18 used to run it. You will not get consistant performance with a non-pressure rated pump, period. Been there, done that then got a pressure pump. Life was good after that.

SDguy · #11 02/03/2007, 11:41 AM

D'oh! Totally missed that post! Yeah, you need a good pressure rated pump to get full use out of these skimmers. Thanks for pointing that out klasiksb

klasiksb · #12 02/03/2007, 11:54 AM

I've ran an MR-1 with a Gen-X 3500 (I think) submersible pump and it was very inconsistant, needed constant tinkering.

I've ran an MR-2 with a Gen-X 6000 (I think) submersible pump and again, it was very inconsistant and needed constant tinkering. I then switched to a Gen-X PCX55 pressure pump and the difference was night and day. Very consistant and little tinkering. I tried a Mag 18 on it and again it was very inconsistant.

I've ran an MR-6R (dual injectors) with a Gorman Rupp Pressure pump (wasn't big enough for the skimmer) and then upgraded to a Blueline 70. Blueline was way better and the skimmer was extremely consistant.

My point? Get a pressure pump, you'll be much happier with the performance of the skimmer. Also, becketts can be a pain to tune until you get the hang of it, then it's a breeze.

BrokeColoReefer · #13 02/03/2007, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by manderx
i don't agree (especially since he *is* having a problem). with it submerged, even something as subtle as random currents and eddies within the sump can affect the backpressure on the drain. it is simply much easier if you get it up out of the water and free-draining.

Not according to the manufacture.
Aqua C ev series this is a true statement, MRC its totally false.
Belive what you want, but i have had mine up and running with the output in 10" of water with NO problem. Mine flooded the first time it broke in but that was my fault. I had to much air going in the skimmer.

manderx · #14 02/03/2007, 01:32 PM

all i'm saying is i've read lots of posts over the years from people who have complained of inconsistent becketts that have fixed it by raising the output out of the water...and yes i've run an mr-1 one too.

BrokeColoReefer · #15 02/03/2007, 02:02 PM

MRC is the first manufacture that i have seen that advertise there skimmers perform the same submerged or above the water line.
Aqua C and PM bullet say just the oppisit. Mabey its a design difference?

BrokeColoReefer · #16 02/03/2007, 04:57 PM

I want to restate my comment. If you have auto top off it works like a champ, if you dont then it would have to be installed above the sump. When i shut my return pump off and leave the skimmer pump on, the water level rises in the sump, and the skimmer rises with it. Then i have a problem. So, if you do not have auto top off dont consider installing this skimmer below water line. As the water drops off durning the day your skimmer settings will change with it.

bashduo · #17 02/03/2007, 06:41 PM

I definately see where lack of an auto water top off would cause problems as different water levels in the sump would constantly influence the skimmer internal water levels. Luckily I do use an auto water top off. Due to the size of the sump and what's in it, my returns from the display and refugium must enter the sump in the area where the skimmer output is located so there may be eddies, etc. I may try wedging a piece of lexan in there or something to seperate... I've got the skimmer working better now, but there are times when the nice tiny bubble mass that slowly rises in the 1st riser tube (when foaming correctly), becomes turbulent and the foam then stops. (Maybe normal operation?) Too bad I didn't know pressure pumps would be better when MRC recommended the Mag 18 over the Mag 12 listed in on their web site. Is there a submersible pressure - rated pump available that would run the MR1?

Thanks everyone for all the advice.

BrokeColoReefer · #18 02/03/2007, 06:58 PM

I would talk to andy about the pumps he recommends, if he says a mag 18 will work then it will work.
Here is a photo of my installation.

bashduo · #19 02/03/2007, 07:42 PM

Very nice set-up! The dry pump(s) set-up would be nice. I'll keep tinkering (and give it time between each adjustment). I've not heard back from Andy for a bit over a week. Hoping he's been out and will be able to get back soon. I've sent him plenty of pics. so he should be able to advise. In the mean time, I am getting some foam - just once in a while...

BrokeColoReefer · #20 02/03/2007, 07:51 PM

Thanks!

its only one pump, the other pump inthe photo is the return for the tank.

here is how i started mine. i put the water in the first neck about half way (3") with the air shut complety off then i opened the air to 4 turns open. I let it sit for 24 hours. Every 24 hours i opened it up one turn. About three days later i was getting the skimmate i wanted and i havent touched it since. I suppose its possible that you dont have enough pressure to run that beckett, but if andy says it should work i would give him the benifit of the doubt that he has tested it. Maybe sell it and put a mag 24 on it, but talk to him first. If the slow adjustment process doenst work then i would say the pump isnt right for the system.
When you adjusting the skimmer, dont feed the tank or touch the water untill you have it right.

bashduo · #21 02/04/2007, 10:57 AM

Thanks for the info! What you've described is pretty much what I've been doing. The quick realease on the MR-1 blocks a good part of the top of my first riser tube, but I've been working with it. Since Andy recommended the Mag 18 over the web site listed Mag 12 for the MR-1, I'd think it would be adequate - but...? Did you skimmer run with "larger" bubbles (1/16" to pea size), for a bit at each adjustment before switching over to the very fine, slowly rising bubbles? It seems either I'm getting the larger size wich aren't effective at producing skimate, or the nice small ones but what appears not enough air flow or water height to push the foam up into the second riser. Neverthe less, I too am an "equipment junkie" and will continue on! By the way - nice trout! And great picture! (I like to visit the Beartooth wilderness in MT yearly to catch a few.) Thanks!

SDguy · #22 02/04/2007, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BrokeColoReefer
I want to restate my comment. If you have auto top off it works like a champ, if you dont then it would have to be installed above the sump. When i shut my return pump off and leave the skimmer pump on, the water level rises in the sump, and the skimmer rises with it. Then i have a problem. So, if you do not have auto top off dont consider installing this skimmer below water line. As the water drops off durning the day your skimmer settings will change with it.

Your skimmer should be connected to the "skimmer compartment" of your sump, where thanks to baffles, the water level does not change with evaporation. Only the water level in your "return" section will change. Obviously if you have a DIY type sump with no baffles, this will be a problem.