Macaw and reef tank? What precautions to take?

[dc]

Hey it only hurts for a week or so. Been a long time since Oscars really bit me. I'd rather be bit by a Macaw than a Cockatoo, they shred more, Macaws crunch. If you handle big birds you will get bit. Another thing is a lot of people want them because they talk so well. But not all of them do. Oscar talks like crazy, even laughs like me, makes all the funny noises I do, but won't utter a single word when someone comes over.

[bmilam]

Cookie Monster our B&G's cage is approx 10' from our main display tank. His playstand is about 5' from it. He likes to watch the fish and tries to get them through the glass. There's nothing for him to get to with the aquarium, all of the wiring is in the canopy or behind it. We also don't leave him out unsupervised... just too much he can get into.

We have 4 parrots... we have to leave sometimes when they get going real good. Mostly it's been a real joy so far though. I would def. not recommend a macaw for a 1st bird though, they are stubborn and smart.. and they will test you and your patience plenty of times. Personally I wouldn't worry much about the bite factor with a macaw.. they're big on bluffing, you just have to pay attention to the body language. The ones that I hate the bite the worst from are the smallest, parrotlets. God they're pinchy little things.. hurts like heck.

If you have your heart sit on a scarlet, you need to talk to some people than own them. They're a bit more cockatoo-like in their neediness than many of the other macaws. And if you and your spouse work during the day, do yourself and the scarlet a favor and just say no.

[KarenHorn]

Having a macaw around children is no more dangerous than having a hot stove around them. We've had macaws around our boys since they were toddlers and we taught them the same thing about the macaws as the stove........don't touch! The boys only got supervised time with them and we never once even came close to an incident where they might have been bitten.

Not all macaws are screamers and in my opinion listening to the Illiger's mini macaw and green cheek conure was much more painful than listening to the greenwing yell. Parrots flock call in the evening, but that doesn't last and they tend to get loud when the rest of the house gets loud. It's like they feel the need to try to out do the existing noise.

My partner has had parrots for over 20 years and I've had them for over 10. We don't know everything, but I believe if someone is committed and does their research a macaw can make a wonderful family addition.

[Twister]

Having a macaw around children is no more dangerous than having a hot stove around them

I'd rather be bit by a Macaw than a Cockatoo, they shred more, Macaws crunch

KarenHorn and dc, you make very good points. However, as I stated in my first message, my intention here is not to slam macaws in general. I happen to think macaws can be awesome pets. Just NOT for someone who has never, ever had birds before. As you both know, they are very demanding birds and while I do admit that they can be loveable and cuddly, we're talking about a lot of biting pressure here if they decide to use it. If cakepro has three children and NO experience with birds, nevermind large ones, then it is my personal opinion that she will regret the decision to purchase a macaw. I have 20 years experience and my macaw bit me every chance he got. Most times my fault, but sometimes not. I was not willing to risk my young son's fingers on the one time that he decided to really bite, and that was my point. Young children and large birds with inexperienced owners, IMO, "can" be a dangerous combination.

My reason's for posting are because I have seen experienced bird keepers, such as myself, bite off more than they can chew (sorry about the pun ) with macaws...they certainly are not for everyone.

It is my hope that if I post as many negative things about the bird that I can, that her decision to purchase one will become a more informed one that she and her family are prepared for. In the end, one's own experience can sometimes be the only thing that they understand and she may well ignore my information. At least I can rest knowing that I've given the best advice I can think to give, IMO.

As an aside, I'm very jealous of your relationships with your macaws and terribly sad that mine did not work out.

Whatever your decision cakepro, I hope you make it with birds best interest in your heart as well.

wend

[KarenHorn]

Is it better to get an "easier" bird that she's not interested in having? Even the smaller parrots live a long time and in my opinion you shouldn't get them if you're only interested in gaining "experience". How fair is that to the "practice" parrot? You have to want a particular bird for itself and be completely committed to it. Besides the fact that I don't think there is another bird that can prepare you for a macaw. They have a very distinct personality that is like no other parrot.

[wee-reefer]

How fair is it to the macaw that you have no experiance with their care and needs and "personality" quirks?

You don't ride a bike, without having training wheels on it first.
You don't go sky diving without doing a tandam dive first.
I agree that the macaw should have a fair chance with a knowledgeable owner, and if problems do arise they shouldn't be blamed on the bird.

[Cakepro]

Okay, I'll buy some other birds I really don't like first.

When will I be experienced enough to own a macaw? When I have raised all these other birds I neither want nor particularly think are great, do I just put them up for sale in the classified section of the Chronicle and then get the macaw? Or do I have to commit to raising them for their lifespan? Hmm, if that's the case, I guess I better build an additional room onto the house and get a job since I'm going to need more room and money for all the birds and all the cages.

Guess I'll put my kids back in public school so I can get a job so I can build on to the house so I can buy some birds I don't want so I can gain experience to own the one bird that I do want.

Thanks for the advice!!

Sherri

[wee-reefer]

That little tantrum just shows that you are not really weighing the pro's and con's of large bird ownership. Nuff said. The bird wont mind if it gets put up for sale in the height of it's puberty because it gets a bit nippy and loud. Just please, for the sake of the bird, do much MUCH more research before you do anything. And get over yourself. The american way. I want what I want NOW and I'll get it anyway I can without thinking. SHeesh.

[hammerhead]

I have a African Grey and she is a great bird. These birds are the smartest Parrots. Before I got here I checked on a few differant one's I decided to get they gray because they are not difficult to take care of. They are not load and can be very loving. When I got her she was a baby still being hand feed. I was familiar with hand feeding I have raised lovebirds for a while now. Grays will repeat alot of what they hear. I also had a sun conure boy u talk about load these are one of the most beutifull birds there are but way to noisy for me. If u are willing to put in the effort of taking care of one of these birds be prepared to make a life long comitment and read alot of books.

[DT's_Reef]

Cakepro, I must say that Twister is right on the money with the advice.

The thing that first time parrot owners typically fail to realize is the amazing intensity of the relationship, and the resulting behaviors (usually screaming). At first, it's the most amazing thing you've ever experienced and then after a few months of it, you want a little bit of space for yourself, but the bird then gets very upset when you don't give it most all of your attention. Plus, the bird goes through long (sometimes years) developmental stages, stubbornness, testing boundaries, etc., and it just can wear you out, and even cause marital problems because it usually takes the entire family to correctly teach the bird how to behave properly.

Imagine getting up in the middle of the night to use the bathroom, the bird hears you, and lets out a blood curdling scream at 3:00 am that can be heard down the block, because he wants your attention. Although this circumstance is the exception, things like this do happen and you're lefting panicking, wondering what to do (gee, do you think I've ever owned a parrot?). Now you're afraid to use the bathroom in the middle of the night.

When considering a macaw as a first bird, red flags pop up because the potential for a disastrous relationship is usually much greater than one for success. I don't mean to be negative, but rather am just being honest. I'm willing to bet almost every long-time macaw owner has seriously considered finding another home for their bird one time or another, due to the stress of ownership. You end up asking yourself, "Why did I do this? Pets are supposed to relieve stress, right?".

If you get another type of parrot instead like a Solomon Island Eclectus (or Vosmaeri), you get great talking ability, amazing beauty, very sweet personality, and a much more quiet voice all in one package. They're not nearly as destructive as a macaw, either. As long as you observe their dietary requirements, I think they make a fantastic first bird for the conscientious owner. They usually will love everyone in the family too.

I think others are recommending you consider a smaller bird first so you'll see what you're in for. Believe me, going to an aviary and observing loud screaming birds for the day is nothing compared to living with one for months or years. I think people are just trying to save you (and the bird) a lot of frustration. I believe that most people are far from qualified to own a large parrot like a macaw or one of the larger cockatoos. Taking physical care of the bird is the easy part. The emotional aspect is what gets you.

Oh, and don't worry about thinking you need to handfeed the bird yourself in order to have it bond with you. That's bunk. I think it's best to receive the bird *after* it's weaned, as the weaning process and socializing at this point is critical for it's emotional development and feelings of security. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with handfeeding it yourself, but you should read as much as you can about the whole process if you choose to do so. I recommend looking up articles by Sally Blanchard, a parrot behavioralist.

Another option is to look for a bird that needs to be adopted. Amazingly enough there are some rather quiet adult birds out there. They're like people in that they all have different personalities. Some are much more vocal than others. I know of a woman who has a healthy lesser sulfur crested cockatoo that never screams. I think that bird is priceless! When you buy a mature adult, you usually know what you're getting. When you buy a baby parrot, you have to hope for the best.

Regardless, best of luck to you. It may turn out that you're the perfect macaw owner. Just be sure to do as much reading about behavioral issues and methods before you're committed to buying it.

[Cakepro]

Tantrum? LOL! wee-reefer, lighten up, hon, and remember what happens when you ASSUme things, like how seriously I am taking this adoption. Sorry for leaving off the smiley face to let you know my post was jokingly sarcastic but not caustic. Here ya go:

Thanks for the posts and the heartfelt advice, all. My next-door neighbor had a couple of Solomon Island Eclectuses (uh, Eclecti?). They're definitely beautiful and smart as a whip. I have quite a bit of time and quite a few issues we're still mulling over before this becomes a definite thing. Parrot-proofing the reef tanks is just one small issue I wanted guidance with in the myriad facets of contemplating big bird ownership.

~ Sherri

[grostanzo]

Best of wishes with your decision! My Macaw was my second bird, with a Yellow-naped Amazon my first. I worked and dated the Avian Vet I worked with (i know...never date anyone you work with) so, felt secure in my choice for a Macaw. The only reason that my former BF and Vet now has him is because where I work now I work up to 10 hour days. I didn't think it was fair to the bird for him to be alone for that long. Now, he is with people all the time and the love of his life the vets female macaw. I still get to see him all the time as I am still friends with him and alot of my friends still work there. By the way, I am still in line there to get my old job back as I hate where I am now.

I think that the fact you are at home is good. Your macaw (if you get one) will have lots of attention.

I did say to get a cockatiel first just so you could see what it is like to own a bird. Then if you find it acceptable move on to a macaw. But, I didn't mean for you to have to get another job or anything like that. If I came across abrupt in any of my post I apologize.

Just hear what people have said about messes, screaming and the big bite! Take everything in and make your decision.

Personally, I say if you have your heart set on one and have done your research go for it. But, have you considered a Blue and Gold by chance? I think Blue and Golds are a better choice for a first time macaw owner. But, that's just my opinion.

Good luck! I hope it works out for you!

[Cakepro]

Originally posted by grostanzo I did say to get a cockatiel first just so you could see what it is like to own a bird. Then if you find it acceptable move on to a macaw. But, I didn't mean for you to have to get another job or anything like that. [/B]

I was just kidding about getting a job so I could support some birds.

Thanks for your advice. Does your bird still recognize you now that he has a girl-bird?

~ Sherri

[dc]

Great advice good and bad points Sheri. Ultimately the choice is yours. I don't know if I would recommend getting something else first or not. But you can have more than one bird. Nor would I suggest a second hand bird, that usually means problems. Oscar came with lots. By the time his owners were tired of him, he was locked in a back room in a dog kennel. I'm friends with the pet store owner here and she always calls me to take animals. Oscar was my first bird ever, I never even considered a large bird, I did know how noisy they were tho. The bird was going to be put down, so I thought I would give it a try. He was mean, and loud. It took 2 years to even be able to handle him. He would attack as soon as I came close. The book by Sally Blanchard is a good one. He doesn't scream constantly anymore, but he does have his moments. Macaws are not inclined to go from owner to owner, a lot of them start plucking. Greys and Toos are notorious for this. My kids were 12 and 13. As with any animal there is no guarentee with personality, sometimes you have to work with what you have. Oscar is next to the TV, so he thinks he's always the center of attention. LOL He won't go on the floor, so when he comes out he has a large playgym, a three different type of gyms that hang from the ceiling. Getting him back in the cage is another story, I have to chase him around like a little kid, at least he doesn't attack me. Getting over that first bite is probably the hardest. I'm still trying to talk you into a mini Macaw, the people I know with them are not dissapointed. Good luck!

[Twister]

KarenHorn...I don't believe anywhere in my post did I say that cakepro should "practice" on another bird. My intention for posting is to help her make the most informed decision she can make. If she were interested in a cockatoo or even an eclectus, amazon or african grey, I would have done exaclty the same thing....listed every negative trait I could think of so that she knows EXACTLY what she is getting into. I'm not doing it to be mean or to say that these are terrible birds. I've owned or known all of the birds above and loved every one of them. I've also been frustrated beyond belief by them.

For example, my beautiful female eclectus, whom I loved so dearly. She was very bonded to me, tolerated other women and totally DESPISED men! (Probably didn't help that I got her right in the middle of a very nasty divorce! LOL!) When I met my current husband she attacked him every chance she got. She went from a bird that had total freedom to roam the house to one that had to be locked up constantly. I lived with guilt every day but loved her so much I could not bear to part with her. Then one day she attacked my husband and nearly took his eye...she literally missed his eyeball by less than a mm!! He would likely have been blinded in that eye if she had hit her target. I searched for a long time and finally she found a home where the people loved her as much as I did. It breaks my heart to this day!

So that's two parrots I have been responsible for and have had to find new homes for them...and I have experience! This is the point I am trying to make. I would never want another bird to have to be moved from home to home. It's just not fair. I would also never want another person to ever feel the sadness I feel over my parrots.

Cakepro...you, in the end, will do whatever you and your family decide is best for you. I just hope that I have helped to make sure that whatever bird you decide upon can spend it's entire life (and yours!) being happy with you and your family.

If I could just give one last piece of advice...whatever bird you decide upon...make sure that however you think you will interact with it in the future, that you start out that way. For example, if you think down the road that you will only be able to spend an hour or two a week handling the bird, then accept that and treat the bird this way from the moment you bring it home. I know it sounds cruel since they should have at least 2 hours of physical interaction with you every day, but the reality of life sometimes dictates that this can't happen. Also, be prepared, if one of your children develops a special bond with the bird, what happens when that child goes to college? Parrots are not usually allowed in dorms, too loud. Your child leaves home and the parrot can literally pine away to death. Although I admit this is extreme, and more common with a cockatoo than a macaw, but it can happen.

Once again, just make sure that you're making the right decision for yourself and the bird. By posting here and asking, I hope you're on the right track.

[dc]

LOL, well this is what happens when you ask for opinions. All sides have pretty much been covered. I survived it with no knowledge whatsoever. It's probably one of the biggest commitments you can make, next to kids.

[Steve_B]

[IMG] [/IMG]

We were attacked by them in Cancun

[grostanzo]

Thanks for your advice. Does your bird still recognize you now that he has a girl-bird?

Yes, he does! When I worked there and would take him to work with me so he could hang out with her, he would go after me if I went anywhere near her. The Vet was the only person who could pick him up at that point. I would bring him home and it would take about a day for him to calm down. I eventually quit taking him there because of that reason.

So, when I walk into the large room where he and his friend is. He immediatley comes over and raises both of his wings out letting me know don't get too close or else! Of course, I have to anyway! This reaction is very normal for a bird who has bonded with another bird or human for that matter. I have seen other birds go after humans if they got too close to their mate after they have reached maturity.

[DT's_Reef]

Get a Goffin's cockatoo instead!

Incredibly cute, fluffy, affectionate, gentle birds, with the funniest personality. One of the smaller cockatoos, but definitely one of the best.

[wee-reefer]

Originally posted by Cakepro
Tantrum? LOL! wee-reefer, lighten up, hon, and remember what happens when you ASSUme things, like how seriously I am taking this adoption. Sorry for leaving off the smiley face to let you know my post was jokingly sarcastic but not caustic. Here ya go:

~ Sherri

And don't call me hon, sweetheart.

[Cakepro]

Hi everybody ~

I'd like to introduce you to our newest family member, Sprocket. He is a rambunctious, hilarious, wonderful 2-year-old blue & gold macaw. He was a beloved member of a family with three children and a stay-at-home mom whose mom recently went back to work full-time due to some unexpected circumstances. He was very lonely and the family made the heartbreaking decision to find a new family for him. They only told the store from which he was purchased about their decision and asked the store owner to screen good potential families. A friend in my local reef club is also a bird enthusiast and she told me the name of a store in north Houston to visit when we were making the rounds looking and learning. I would never have found that store without her recommendation because it is not listed in my phone book. I happened to talk to the store owner when I called asking about what kind of birds they had for sale and after what felt like an actual interview of some sort (I thought it a little strange but answered all of her questions), she told me about Sprocket and his family. I left my name and number and later that day heard from Sprocket's mom. Long story short, three visits later, he was ours. They had turned down other families from buying the bird because the mom felt those families were not right for him. What a neat set of events/coincidences that led us to them! And guess what else this family has? That's right ~ saltwater tanks! LOL. So, not only did we get to adopt a perfectly delightful macaw, we gained a friendship with this wonderful family as well. Here's Sprocket with two of our children.

~ Sherri

[DT's_Reef]

Congratulations.

What's his personality like? Has he introduced the family to his "voice"?

If I were to buy a parrot, I would look for one that's beyond the baby stage and has had time to develop its personality. This way you have a pretty good idea of what you're getting. Ideally, I would want to buy a bird that's fully mature. I know of someone who bought a lesser sulfur crested cockatoo that was truly extremely quiet and loved everyone, including strangers. That bird is priceless!

[Cakepro]

He is just hilarious. He talks up a storm and constantly babbles in some jibberjabber (probably what all of our human conversation sounds like to him!). He has an okay vocabulary and speaks appropriately, like when he wants off his perch he puts up one foot and says "Step up" and says "Hello" when the phone rings and "Bye-bye" when we go out the front door. The greatest thing is his mimicking of all the laughter that was in his other family. They must have laughed all the time because when we play games like tug-of-war or when he swings out on his cage door, he absolutely cackles. It is so funny. He plays and says "peekaboo" and can roll his r's when he says "Arriba!" He like to "groom" my husband's arm by pulling out his arm hairs, and then he says, perfectly mimicking him, "Ouch! Don't do that!" When we leave the room he goes through all kinds of conversations in different voices and pitches. He sings a song that I keep meaning to ask his other mom what it is. He loves to be scratched and lets me pick a little at his feather sheaths in places like the back of his head where he can only get at them with his feet and not his beak. He transitioned just fine both from his other family and from an all-table food diet (!!!) to life at our house and a pellet diet (with lots of nuts and treats and fresh fruits & veggies, of course). When he doesn't want to be scratched or rubbed, he lets us know by holding our hand down with one foot or saying "no." We don't give him free reign on the floor like his other family did and he has a daytime perch/playarea and his cage for nightttime and when we're not home. He has always had his wings trimmed and we're going to stick with that. I think I would be quite fearful (for us and for his safety) to have a fully flighted macaw ruling the house. He hasn't had to have a timeout in his kitty cage yet but that technique worked well for his other family to teach him not to nibble on furniture or whatever. Oh yeah, and they had a dog and a cat, so this bird perfectly meows and growls and barks. And he whistles like his Cockatiel friend from his other home. He showered with me one day this week and it was crazy how much he loved that. He stayed in the water spray splashing off of me and the whole time screamed "Whee" while zipping his head around in a figure-8 motion with his wings outspread ~ quite a sight and a little nervewracking for me, but he loved it. I kept getting whacked in the face by his wet wing, but other than that, it was just hilarious. His other mom and dad showered with him almost daily and that's a favorite activity of his. I'm going to get him a shower perch so I don't have to hold him the whole time. He is just a barrel of laughs and a lot of fun ~ just an amazing creature. Great personality, not grouchy or nippy. Although he's still very much a baby, being only two years old, I think he was the perfect bird for us to adopt as his personality is well developed and he was raised by a very loving family.

Thanks for asking!
~ Sherri

[3_high_low]

Congrats Sherri! He's beautiful.

I inherited a Lorikeet (Hoppy) ten years ago who now runs my household lol. He's a very active little guy and lots of fun. His favorite roost was the overflow on my 55g tank. Hoppy was forbidden from this spot but every time I left the room he would make a b-line for the tank. He will climb right inside the canopy with the MH blaring. He's even wet his wings in there a couple times. On another occasion he pooped into a power strip and tripped the GFCI...heh. (I have him partially potty trained now lol.) I broke this tank down and set up another one that he wants nothing to do with - yet! A word of advice, keep your bird the heck away from your tank.

I hope you can keep Sprocket from becoming a one person bird. My bird is very possessive of me. I guess I am it's mate for life. He is very good about not biting me but everyone else needs to be careful not to tick him off (sharp beak/strong bite). He even attacks objects that he sees me use regularly like the electric toothbrush, the TV remote, coffee cups, and even a brightly colored pair of PJ shorts that I wear. My guess is he views these objects as a threat to our relationship. (I have no idea why he hates the boxer shorts lol) It's crazy! Hopefully your bird won't develop such strange eccentricities.

I gotta go now. It's shower time and the bird knows it. (I can't shower without bringing him with me or he'll have a nutty.)

I wish you all the luck in the world with your new family member. I hope you're ready for this, it is a huge responsibility. It's a lot of work to keep a happy healthy bird but if things work out he will be the best pet you've ever had.

Hoppy:

[dc]

What a great looking guy! Congratulations!