Black Percula from Australia?

[Pumba]

JHardman,
I got my pair wild caught from Darwin. I know they are wild caught for sure, because I caught them.

I have been trying to get some good shots of them today and I'll be buggered if I can get them to stay within focus long enough.

They are in my main display tank atm, but I did have them in a clown breeding setup, where they would regularly spawn, however the eggs would either fungus or get really poor hatch rates. I moved them to the display tank to see if I can improve hatch rates.

I have attached some of the better pics I have got so far. I will keep trying for a better pic.

Cheers,
Matt

[Pumba]

Here's Another

[badman]

Originally posted by Soccer
Hey Badman I see your in Ontario. Where did you purchase the pair? How much were they? I would really like to get a pair!

Thanx for any help

I bought them off a hobbyist in the Toronto area. I have seem them at PJ's at yorkdale a couple of times. I know that some lfs in the ottawa area also carry them. Expect to pay about 50 dollars cdn. each. PJs were selling them for 75 dollars a piece.

Jhardman, thanks for the clarification. A local LFS had a juvenile pair that they said were wc.

[Mako]

Here is a half arse shot of my pair of black A. Ocellaris. I got mine with a prize I won last Sept. I believe the fish originated from ORA though. They have paired and should be spawners before long. They have always had just that smidgen of orange on the snout. Never any bigger than that.

[intekhab]

Here's my Pair. But don't have an anemone in the Tank. I wish I could keep a Rose BTA for them, but now anemone is out of the question .... I plan to keep all sort of small fish (neon goby, side stripe goby etc)...

Anyway, back to the topic... I notice my pair to be extra long (from tail to mouth. They do not look like average ocellaris (if you take the color factor out).

I guess they are not ocellaris after all ?? (orange is almost gone but they originally had touch of orange)

[JHardman]

Originally posted by intekhab
I guess they are not ocellaris after all ?? (orange is almost gone but they originally had touch of orange)

What makes you say that?

[intekhab]

I notice my pair to be extra long (from tail to mouth. They do not look like average ocellaris (if you take the color factor out).

Just a guess though.... I am not clownfish expert, but playing guessing game so somebody will tell me what makes this Ocellaris (if they are) bigger and long body shape (head to tail) than regular ocellaris ...smaller and more round shape

[JHardman]

Originally posted by intekhab
Just a guess though.... I am not clownfish expert, but playing guessing game so somebody will tell me what makes this Ocellaris (if they are) bigger and long body shape (head to tail) than regular ocellaris ...smaller and more round shape

The ones in the picture you posted look like typical black A. Ocellaris to me...

[intekhab]

The ones in the picture you posted look like typical black A. Ocellaris to me...

That is correct. I purchased my pair as Amphiprion Ocellaris (Black).

But I am curious, “what are the differences between "Black Ocellaris" and "Typical Ocellaris"?�. That's what I really mean in my question. I notice they are little different in shape (Black Ocellaris has a long body shape than Typical Ocellaris). Also, my "Typical Ocellaris" were not as aggressive as Black Ocellaris are.

What if they are just different clownfish all together? At first, I am sure many have confused Amphiprion Percula and Amphiprion Ocellaris to be same species, but then found out they are two different clownfish. As I stated above, I am no clownfish expert, just speaking from my observation. Just thinking out loud.

[JHardman]

Originally posted by intekhab
That is correct. I purchased my pair as Amphiprion Ocellaris (Black).

But I am curious, “what are the differences between "Black Ocellaris" and "Typical Ocellaris"?�. That's what I really mean in my question. I notice they are little different in shape (Black Ocellaris has a long body shape than Typical Ocellaris). Also, my "Typical Ocellaris" were not as aggressive as Black Ocellaris are.

What if they are just different clownfish all together? At first, I am sure many have confused Amphiprion Percula and Amphiprion Ocellaris to be same species, but then found out they are two different clownfish. As I stated above, I am no clownfish expert, just speaking from my observation. Just thinking out loud.

No I think you hit the nail right on the head. All of the black A. Ocellaris I have had or seen have been longer and more "sleek" in form than all of the orange A. Ocellaris I have had or seen. The blacks gill structure also seems to be a bit more protruding than the oranges. The eye location of the oranges seems to be more towards to top of the head than the blacks.

Total speculation on my part, but I think what we are seeing in these fish are two things... First the early divergence of the species into two separate species and second in the TR fish at least the results of massive inbreeding.

Maybe Pumba can chime in here... He actually collected his fish from the wild. Pumba do you see orange A. Ocellaris in the same area as the blacks?

Maybe Dustin will also chime in on this... I would be interested in knowing how many WC pairs the guy in AU started out with? I am betting it is a pretty small number, <5?

[Pumba]

On the 'stretch' of reef that I got my guys from, I guess there were about a dozen pairs/ families in total over about the 100m area.

Of these, 3 of them were the black ones, but the other black pairs were not black yet. They were still that 'dirty orange' colour.

I was told that it was quite common to see localised areas of the same colour form dominating.

Personally I beleive what we are seeing is the result of inbred stock. But thats just my opinion. Although, the male of my pair doesnt have a full last white stripe, and he's a wild fish. So there must be some genetic imbalance there that results in mis- barring.

Cheers,
Matt

[JHardman]

Originally posted by Pumba
On the 'stretch' of reef that I got my guys from, I guess there were about a dozen pairs/ families in total over about the 100m area.

Of these, 3 of them were the black ones, but the other black pairs were not black yet. They were still that 'dirty orange' colour.

I was told that it was quite common to see localised areas of the same colour form dominating.

Personally I beleive what we are seeing is the result of inbred stock. But thats just my opinion. Although, the male of my pair doesnt have a full last white stripe, and he's a wild fish. So there must be some genetic imbalance there that results in mis- barring.

Cheers,
Matt

Well... The blacks start out orange and get darker with age, so seeing those dusky gray ones is not the best indicator of orange versus black pairs.

I wouldn't put too much salt in genetics playing a role in misbarring. Most of the people that breed clowns will tell you that misbarring is a result of poor food conditions in the early days of life. IME would agree with that. Now rather genetics plays a role in how easily they are affected by poor food and that resulting in misbars is a hole other subject.

It sounds like the area you collected your pair from is an all black section. Thanks for the information!

[Pumba]

I kinda worded that wrong.
I meant that of the 3 pairs of blacks that I saw, 1 pair was completely black, which is the pair I collected, and the other 2 families were that dirty orange colour. They were also in familes, not pairs.

Sorry about the misunderstanding...

Cheers,
Matt

[4runner]

Pumba, what anemones were your black clowns hosting in? I'm curious if the anemone species they are hosting in affects their coloration.

[Pumba]

They arent hosting in any anemone, I havent provided them with one. They were laying eggs in a terracotta pot, but are still deciding on a home in the big tank.

Cheers,
Matt

[intekhab]

Matt,
I am curious (I think that was 4runnerh's question too) what anemone those Black Clown hosting in the wild at the time you caught them?


My pair took up on the right side overflow box ... they haven't spawn or anything, but always making love to one another

I hope to provide them a Rose BTA one of these day. My last attempt didn't work.

[BlAcK_PeRcUlA]

They arent hosting in any anemone, I havent provided them with one. They were laying eggs in a terracotta pot, but are still deciding on a home in the big tank.

What were they hosting in when you collected them?

[SaltwaterNovice]

Jhardman:

What does WC and TR stand for?

Thanks,

Brian

[Skipper]

SaltwaterNovice:

WC = wild caught
TR = tank raised

[JHardman]

Originally posted by SaltwaterNovice
Jhardman:

What does WC and TR stand for?

Thanks,

Brian

Skip is correct, but frankly I miss use the TR term all too often, I should use CB most of the time.

TR = Tank raised, generally this is misused to describe CB (captive bred) fish. TR is where a collector goes to a reef and collects juvenile/larval fish and raises them to a saleable size in their tanks. I am one of the worst for misusing the term TR.

CB = Captive Bred; which are fish from fish that are captive at the time of spawning. They are 100% tank/captive fish never having been in the ocean. This is what most people call TR as far as clownfish are concerned.

When you see these terms tossed around by sellers, ask them exactly what they mean if it's important to you.

[SaltwaterNovice]

JHardman:

Thanks for the clarification.

Brian