quaratine tanks: help in setting up

[silvercvic]

Ok...so I have been battling ICK for a matter of weeks now and though the surviving fish in the tank are pretty stable as far as having the ICK, I just want to possibly add fish in the future and not affect the new guys. Only now, I have finally committed some space to hold a quaratine tank. But what is the possible best, fastest way to start the QT???

I was thinking about using the existing tank water (50%) + adding (fresh) pre-mixed RO seawater (50%) to the QT to help start a cycle before adding the fish. Also using some sand and a piece of live rock to help. Would that help speed process to add fish to the QT????

Or should I use completely new water and have the thing cycle for about 4 weeks, then add the fish??

Should I use live rock/sand?? I heard that defeats the purpose and obsorbs some medication (copper).

Should I do copper or hypo?? I heard that copper is not good for a tang (kills the enzymes for their vegetation digestion)

I was planning on QTing a Atlantic Blue tang, Porcupine puffer, Dwarf Lionfish, tomato clownfish, and (possibly) green-spotted puffer + black-finned shark (bracksih fish)

Any speedy suggestions would help, as I would like to set this up as soon as possible.

[lllosingit]

A quaratine tank and a hospital tank are not the same thing.

(Quaratine) set up much as you would a regular tank with sand and live rock, you may not need a skimmer but I would add an airstone to it.
I keep a 30 gallon quaratine set up at all time and use a Molly to keep the bacteria established.
If you medicate a quaratine tank you will most lilkely kill the bacteria.

(Hospital) I use a bare bottom 10 gallon with a rock and a piece pvc pipe for the fish to hide in. It sits empty until it is needed and then I fill it with water from the tank.
with a 10 gallon I find it easier to do frequent water changes.

[lllosingit]

To answer your questions a little further. I would add rock sand and some water from your tank to the quaratine.

I treated my fish with Hypo a few months ago and although I lost a lion fish I still consider it a success. I have been ick free ever since.
I have never treated with copper so I can't comment.

Some fish handle treatment with hypo or copper better than others so I hope someone can give you more specific advice.
Sorry I wasn't more help

[silvercvic]

this is pretty helpful...whjat did you use for filtration??

[ahhdui]

You should buy one of the air pump driven foam/sponge filters. They work extremely well. There is no need for live rocks and live sand in a Q tank. I would add a few pieces of PVC pipes so the fish can hide.

--Tony

[TaIk2Kevin]

How do you build a sponge filter?

[ahhdui]

you can buy one for $5 to $10 bucks. I bought one from drsfostersmith.com

--Tony

[lllosingit]

Originally posted by ahhdui
You should buy one of the air pump driven foam/sponge filters. They work extremely well. There is no need for live rocks and live sand in a Q tank. I would add a few pieces of PVC pipes so the fish can hide.

--Tony

The live rock and live sand will keep the bacteria alive to process the waste from the fish.You only need a couple rocks and just enough sand to cover the bottom.
I have a bacpak skimmer on my quaratine tank and do small water changes a couple times a week when it's being used. If you don't have a skimmer i'm sure the water changes will keep everything in order.
IMO you should try not to stress the fish, and a bare tank with just PVC would cuase stress in some fish, some are algae grazers and some like to eat copepods and amphipods and I can't see how you would have that with just PVC.

[ahhdui]

Your live rocks and live sand will be ruin if you use copper as treatment (i recommend hypo). A couple of pieces of live rocks and some live sand will not be enough to sustain bioloads from ( I was planning on QTing a Atlantic Blue tang, Porcupine puffer, Dwarf Lionfish, tomato clownfish, and (possibly) green-spotted puffer + black-finned shark (bracksih fish)).

--Tony

[Wilafur]

q-tank is different from hospital tank. in my mind, a q-tank is a tank where you place new fish to observe and fatten up prior to introduction to your display tank. no meds or hypo is ever conducted in the q-tank.

a hospital tank is where you place diseased fish and dose meds and/or treat with hypo.

[lllosingit]

You are not supposed to treat a quaratine tank with meds.
For that you set up a hospital tank.

[Wilafur]

Originally posted by lllosingit
You are not supposed to treat a quaratine tank with meds.
For that you set up a hospital tank.

beat ya to the punch lllosingit.

[lllosingit]

Originally posted by Emperator
beat ya to the punch lllosingit.

Well Kind Of

If you medicate a quaratine tank you will most lilkely kill the bacteria.

I just figured that would get the point across but evidently I was wrong

[ahhdui]

oops my bad. I assumed he was trying to treat the tank and referenced it with Q tank.

IMHO, i would treat all fish before it gets into my main tank. Sometimes we don't see signs and it doesn't mean the fish doesn't have ick. Putting a fish in a Q tank to find out a week or two later is something I no longer practice. If I'm already waiting 2 weeks, I'd rather wait another 2 more weeks to ensure nothing gets into my main tank.

--Tony

[Wilafur]

Originally posted by ahhdui
oops my bad. I assumed he was trying to treat the tank and referenced it with Q tank.

IMHO, i would treat all fish before it gets into my main tank. Sometimes we don't see signs and it doesn't mean the fish doesn't have ick. Putting a fish in a Q tank to find out a week or two later is something I no longer practice. If I'm already waiting 2 weeks, I'd rather wait another 2 more weeks to ensure nothing gets into my main tank.

--Tony

i usually place new fish in the q-tank for upwards of a month. this way you will know for certain if it is healthy or not.

[lllosingit]

Originally posted by Emperator
i usually place new fish in the q-tank for upwards of a month. this way you will know for certain if it is healthy or not.

I just bring mine home and toss them in the toilet
Thats where they all end up sooner or later (JK)
I had to stop buying fish from one place as they all would eat and seemed happy only to waste away. I think they were Cyanide caught.
I have since switched LFS and everything is peachy.

[john f]

I use Fritz Turbostart saltwater.
You can have a tank cycled in a week this way.

I also QT every fish in hyposalinity for 3 weeks before adding to the reef tank.

I use a 55 gallon barebottom tank, with a UV, sponge filter, and Quicksand for Bio.

The addition of the UV ( small Double Helix unit ) has done wonders in this QT environment.

I do not agree with the process of QT using live rock, sand etc.
You cannot prevent cryptocaryon introduction this way, so what is the point?



John

[ahhdui]

John, my point exactly. I really see no point in putting a fish in QT for a month and find out it has ich. Then spend another month in hospital tank. IMHO, wether a new fish shows signs or not it should be in hypo just to be on the safe side. There is no need to stress it in Q tank and then hospital tank.

--Tony

[lllosingit]

My point is
You can treat the fish with hypo salinity in the the quarintine tank and it will not kill off the bacteria and you have the benifit of pods and algae that will also survive in Hypo conditions.

[Wilafur]

the thing is that the ick life cycle is about 30 days right? assuming that you have the fish in a q-tank for over a month, then, theoretically, it will not have the parasite when introcuded to the display.

nothing beats buying a healthy fish from a good lfs.

[ahhdui]

correct ich does have life cycle for about 30 days. Just because we don't see signs on the fish doesn't mean that the ich is no present. It could be attached to the fish at night or every few days. The fact is that it is still in the water. Wouldn't it be safer if rid it from the start rather than guessing it should be ok.

--Tony

[john f]

Yeah,

The problem is cryptocaryon can exist on the fish at a sub-clinical level.
The fish have it, but you never know it. This condition has been reported to exist for up to 6 months on a fish.
So just because he passes a QT of 30- days doesn't mean he can't introduce Ich into your reef tank.

That's why I treat with hyposalinity during the QT period. This way you can eliminate the parasite totally before adding it to the reef tank.

Anything else is just wishful thinking.



John

[Wilafur]

Originally posted by john f
Yeah,

The problem is cryptocaryon can exist on the fish at a sub-clinical level.
The fish have it, but you never know it. This condition has been reported to exist for up to 6 months on a fish.
So just because he passes a QT of 30- days doesn't mean he can't introduce Ich into your reef tank.

That's why I treat with hyposalinity during the QT period. This way you can eliminate the parasite totally before adding it to the reef tank.

Anything else is just wishful thinking.

John

thanks for the clarification.

[silvercvic]

ok...so you do the hypo...and the fish is ready to go into the main tank...do you do an acclimation or throw the fish into the tank..or raise the hospital tank back to main tank salinity????

[Lilgrasshopper]

Nobody does copper anymore? I just setup a 25 gallon tank, thinking that it'll be a hospital tank. Will the copper kill the bacteria on the LS/LR in my hospital tank?