Diary of my LiL 40 Gallon Breeder(Intense)

[InsaneClownFish]

Well I'm moving right along...
The spot:
GFCI:
I painted the back of the tank the same color I painted my dining room walls. It's a 100% acrylic paint that is metallic copper....highly reflective...in the pics you can see what the tank looks like with 4 coats on... When I put the tank on the stand, and opened the doors, it reflected nicely downwards:

My girlfriend was patient enough to help me level the tank...I used plastic toilet shims. The tank was only off about 1/6 of an inch to begin with, and the shims leveled it out to about 1/3 off...unfortunately, that little difference translates into a 1/2 inch difference in the water line...ouch...crossin my fingers!
Trash Bag Tip(Thanks JP!):

Fill Er Up(The trash bag saved me from a significant amount of murkiness- you can see it floating on the water):

Ebo Jager 150W heater and 2 Mag 900s ready for action(I'll be adding a couple more Mag 900s in the next couple weeks):

[InsaneClownFish]

Picked up the live rock Friday afternoon:
-Box1
-Box2
60lbs. total of Brazilian....2/3 the weight of Fiji..
Cave:
Clam Shell!!:
Nice coralline:

[InsaneClownFish]

Finally:

....and God am I glad I decided to go with a much smaller tank:
I'll update here periodically...

[InsaneClownFish]

Here's a little update. I returned home saturday morning and the tank was pretty clear. I fired up both MaxiJet900s and that afternoon the tank was very clear. Last night and early this afternoon I took a few more pics.

I had mixed the salinity to 1.255, but after aprox. 1 gallon had evaporated, in a 32 hour period, the salinity jumped to 1.285, so I added another gallon of plain distilled..and it fell right to about 1.26.

Left Side:
Right Side:

[iCam]

Hey. It looks like you are off to a very good start. I really like your rockwork.

[Shoestring Reefer]

Nice place. I also like the rockwork, and the idea of painting ther back of your tank to match the wall.

If you need more shims, I've found folded up cardboard from food boxes (macaroni, cheerio's, pizza) actually works well. It's tough, as thin or thick as you want it, won't compress, smooth enough so you can slide it under a filled tank's stand, and you usually don't need to go to the store if you need more.

[LobsterOfJustice]

Looking nice, like the rocks. What kind of stuff are you planning on keeping?

[InsaneClownFish]

Here are a couple of quick error corrections.. When I said in the initial post I had mounted the "mag" 900s...lol err they're actually maxijet900s...:P I'll be alright. Also, if anyone from the CARS forum is curious as to why I decided not to put the tank on my kitchen counter it's because even though the counter accepted the weight, 510+ lb. test, and it seemed to level out, I noticed that the tank itself would only sit on the corners...so I did a little rearranging of my dining room..

nihonjin...thanks!

Mike..thanks for the continued encouragement....as far as the leveling thing, it's pretty unoticeable once the tank is completely full because the rim covers it. That's a great tip, but i think I'm going to leave it be for now....anyway my girlfriend would kill me...something to the effect, "you've gotten it that level stop messing with it!"

From my understanding, once the tank holds water initially, it is highly unlikely it will leak afterwords. I also called Oceanic...they told me they had 120+ gallon tanks in the office that the water line is off by 1/2 inch...

I'm going to take the...if it ain't broke don't fix it. Hopefully I'll host a mini meeting one day and you can tell me if I'm nuts..

The tank back came out so nice. Remember, these pics are with no lights...just a 60 watt lamp standing next to the tank so I can see..
I'm ordering the 36" 6 39wbulb T5 Tek fixture in about two weeks.
It will only be about 12-13 inches from the sand...should look very nice.

Lobster...I'm going to add a couple of more maxijet900s, so I should have an awesome amount of flow. I'd like to keep some lavender zoos...some purple and red shrooms....xenia...rainbow ricordia..some gonipora(sp)...maybe a leather...a few sps down the road to fill in(my club seems to be good at fragging this)..and a clam once I feel confident enough to keep one...basically a nice lil mixed reef. My girlfriend really wants an anenome; my lfs gets some really nice sebaes, but I have to do a bit more research on those before I decide to purchase.

I'd also like various snails, small hermits, and possibly a linkia star and a couple nudis. One fire shrimp, cleaner, and peppermint.

Fish List:
Yellow Goby"okinawe"
Midas Blenny
Flameback Dwarf Angel "Fireball Pygmy"
Mystery Wrasse

If I get really into this, I might install a 75-150w metal halide or PC fixture perpendicular to the right side of the tank and build a little sps pool...

[abfleck]

Looks great!

[AJP]

Originally posted by InsaneClownFish

I had mixed the salinity to 1.255, but after aprox. 1 gallon had evaporated, in a 32 hour period, the salinity jumped to 1.285, so I added another gallon of plain distilled..and it fell right to about 1.26.

Did you mean 1.0255 and 1.0285 and 1.026?
Also i don't think that a gallon should make that big of a dif in a 40 gallon. I have a 20 with a 10 gallon sump and mine only drops about .005 with a half gallon evap. What are you using to measure salinity?

[this is me]

Originally posted by adamjonpeterson
Did you mean 1.0255 and 1.0285 and 1.026?
Also i don't think that a gallon should make that big of a dif in a 40 gallon. I have a 20 with a 10 gallon sump and mine only drops about .005 with a half gallon evap. What are you using to measure salinity?

I was thinking the same thing...

[InsaneClownFish]

Thanks abfleck...

adam, lol...sorry..long day at work...yes, I did mean 1.0255, 1.0285, and 1.026.

The actual water volume in the tank is only 32 gallons. There is no sump. I'm using a hydrometer...and I may purchase a refractometer...

I'm not as worried about the hydrometer as most. I'm very careful to test twice, and I use a plastic fork to get rid of air bubbles.

There might be a few reasons for the readings.... first, the actual salinity...after everything settled, might have been closer to 1.0265.

The actual evaporation might have been closer to 1.5 gallons.

Remember, this was my first fillup, so after some of the undisolved salt moved around the tank(inevitable) the salinity probably went up a bit.

I'll do a couple of more tests tonight and see where I'm at. Of course everyone recommends a refractometer, but I am starting to believe that too many people 'trust' a refractometer TOO much. If they use multiple methods, they end up trusting the refraco over the hydro...when oftentimes, in actuality, the hydro may be right.

There were a couple of guys from my reefclub at the last meeting whose refractometers were way off when tested against the store's we were at.

I may get a refractometer, but I will carefully use both.

Sorry to ramble..but I knew this was going to turn into one of those..."get yourself a refractometer" tyrades...

[kenny77]

nice! it look like a good start.

im with you about the hydrometer and refractometer. so far i get the same reading that my LFS do with there refractometer. so im satying with the hydrometer

[AJP]

a hydrometer is fine as long as you calibrate it every so often. Same can be said of a refractometer. Got to zero it out with some ro/di every now and then. I have the $35 refrac from fosters and smith. I love it and think it might be one of my better purchases. I wont rant and all as I ran a hydro for almost 2 years, I am also thinking about keeping one in my sump 24/7 so I can do a quick glance salt check.

Oh and not to start another fight, but why no sump. You could ditch the in tank heater and atleast one maxi.

[InsaneClownFish]

Thanks Kenny! Cool little AV... "Hooter's Cook"

a hydrometer is fine as long as you calibrate it every so often

adam, first thing I did..

Cool info on the Dr. Foster refracto...was wondering about those! I might purchase the one from premium aquatics...their in house "blue" model when the time comes...$44.95 I think....pretty nice lookin. I'll definately take a better look at the Dr. Foster one..

adam, no fights here! I value the input... I just bought a townhouse condo back in July. I've had dreams of setting up a FOWLR, or even a reef, for over a year. In that time I've been doing alot of research(I wasn't going to set up anything until I OWNED property).

After doing alot of work in my condo, I decided now is the right time for the tank. When the reality of funding this project hit, I started to change my dreams of a 100+ gallon system....it's probably the best choice I could have made, because the truth is I haven't set up a salt water tank since I was a teenager...back in the day of the undergravel! Logic really started to dictate that I should start out with a much smaller tank. If I could care for those animals properly, then maybe in a few years I could tackle a larger system. So for now, my dreams of having a larger tank, custom built, have been put on hold. I had initially wanted a very shallow, yet deep(width) tank. So I just took this concept to a smaller scale.

I began a new line of thought, and I started down a new path of research. The more I looked into smaller setups, the more I admired these systems. Size truly does not matter....

In fact, some of the smaller reefs are the most beautiful I have seen. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing as awe inspiring as a huge tank, but I really took into consideration what was right for me and my 'space.' There are a couple of AGA 40 Breeder's that have been tank of the month, and I believe both are sumpless.

Initially, I was going to have James at Envision Acrylics build my tank. James is a class act. He took his time to talk with me about what my needs were, and even when we both agreed it wasn't the time for a larger tank, he still gave me invaluable advice. We chatted about some of his setups, and we were both of like mind...a reef should have four main elements:
1. Heat
2. Lots of Flow
3. DSB
4. Lots of Live Rock

I'm definately erring on the side of KISS...keep it simple stupid...



adam, I started looking into skimmerless systems. I found ones that would make your jaw drop(sumpless, skimmerless, and reactorless). I read as much of Dr. Ron's research about the value...or possible lack there of .....regarding skimmers. Alot of the no sump/no skimmer precept relies on the idea that both these actions may strip the water of valueable nutrients.

There are also alot of European systems developing this way, and the concept intrigues me.

Now without getting into the right, or wrong, of my setup... I will say, for better, or worse, this is the path I have chosen. However, I did not choose this path lightly. Just as the tank better fits my "space," so too does my sumpless/skimmerless tank fit my goals.

In my mind there is no right or wrong way to set up a tank. Oftentimes people on RC will 'preach' a method. If there is one thing that I've learned...there is no "right" way. The "WAY" should fit your expectation, goals, and life style.

In many ways I'm happy I am doing a smaller setup...moving away from the idea of having a FOWLR, with some softies, towards a truly mixed reef.

I'm interested in creating a miniature piece of the ocean....my own little biotype, and I am convinced that the most poweful filtration and stabilization for a smaller reef tank is bacteria and infauna. To me, biology, not technology, is the key.

I must also say that this type of setup demands some rules...a great deal of care....and a bit more maintanance. These are all things I am prepared for.

1. The bioload must be low...4 small fish for me...
2. There must be an abundance of live rock to work in conjunction with the dsb
3. The system should be on the small side...probably not over 40 or 50 gallons(that way maintanace is heeded)
4. The dsb needs to be restocked accordingly(no sand sifters)
5. Water changes must be done at the rate of 25% every 2 weeks
6. Flow must be strong
7. Aeration and dissolved oxygen levels must be more closely monitored.

I've definately become a fan of keeping a self contained system.."inside the box."

adam, tag along for the ride...we'll both see how it goes...for me it's a constant learning experience

Goodnight for now...I must get home and play with my tank...

[AJP]

Well said, I agree there is no right way to set up a tank. I ran skimmer less for about a year with no problems. I only started to run a skimmer because I like to over feed and over stock. I was starting to get hair algae and my fish werent looking happy. So for me a skimmer was the best thing I could do. I have now had the skimmer for about 2 months and the hair algae is gone. But I hate seeing the powerhead from the skimmer in my tank. So I now after a year am adding a sump as we speak. I only mentioned it because I wanted to maybe save you a step down the road, because I had to empty my tank and drill it, my fish are living in a rubbermaid till the silicone dries on my overflow. You have put a lot of thought in your tank and that is to be applauded. Well I have said enough and I will now go to bed. Good night.

[Shoestring Reefer]

God for you for doing some research and thinking it out. And, the last time I set up my tank, I didn't even think about leveling it untill a week after it was filled. Lucky me it's on a first floor with a level concrete slab.

[GregM779]

Looks real nice, a few comments though. I like the rockwork but highly recommend making room for a glass cleaner to go around the edges. Also have you put the light on yet? I'm curious if it will create any glare from the reflective background.

[InsaneClownFish]

adam, the overfeeding and overstocking is definately a temptation. However, when it comes down to it I can't keep 3/4 of the fish I had initially wanted for a 100+ in a 40, so that fact is making a lighter bioload easy for me..

Mike, I was about to go batty if I read anymore.... It was definately time to get my feet wet..

Greg, I think it's an optical illusion...the live rock is actually about 4 inches away from the front glass. The rock on the right side is sitting up against it, but the tank really isn't viewable from there. There is one or two small pieces leaning against the left side which I figured I could scrape around...or move if absolutely necessary...

I'm going to leave the lights off for at least two weeks...let the tank be...

That's an interesting point about the glare...hopefully the fact that the tank background is significantly dark, coupled with a the "bluer" T5s being placed towards the back, will resist glare...

I'll let you know!

[Project Reef]

Nice ICF! If you purchase a Litermeter/Kalk Reactor/FW Water Reservoir combination your life will be MUCH easier not to mention the added health benefits on the inhabitants.

My old no filtration reef had about 35-40 pounds or rock, 1" sand bed, fish load was low, pair of clowns, golden blenny, flame angel and a royal gramma. The tank was packed with corals and a few clams which soaked up nutrients as well. You are doing a good job with this tank, but as I mentioned above, if you add the kalk/litermeter combo it'll help things out tremendously.

[InsaneClownFish]

Project, thank you so much. Your setups are truly inspiring... I will definately look into the reactor. However, I'm currently using Oceanic salt, so my calcium levels should be VERY saturated at 1.0255. In fact, I really need to purchase a test kit for the calcium.

If I do go the reactor route, this would mandate me having to change salt brands.....eerrrrr I think? The Oceanic is pretty heavy in the calc/magnesium department...

As always...any insight would be greatly appreciated...

Oh and Project, can you post a pic of your old skimmerless tank here so I can follow a blueprint...

[masterswimmer]

ICF very nice job. I applaud your research. That's almost a pat on my own back. I also spent about 1 year on RC and books, slowly buying equipment over that year before I put any water into my tank. You've done your homework.

If I can add something to the suggestion of a sump without your asking me for input, it's one phrase, "the solution to pollution, is dilution". Basically the larger the water volume the more forgiving your system will be.

Good luck with your setup. Looks great. One other thing. Before you get too comfortable and start stocking your tank, heed the advice above by moving the LR at least from the left side, away from the glass. You will be soooooo much happier.

Again, good luck,
and post more pix,
Russ

[InsaneClownFish]

Update:

I really need to stop calling specific gravity salinity...

These are my readings from last night using salifert:

ph- 8
alk- dkh, 12.5 meg/l 4.46, or 4.56
ammonia- inconclusive...

sg- 1.0255
temp- 79.5

The tank is starting to smell like a warm caribbean breeze.. Actually, you can only smell it if you stick your nose right above it.

Here's a pic of the beginnings of some life in my tank:

I had frozen a cocktail shrimp from my house warming party. I added it to the tank directly after the LR. I wanted to really give the cycle a kick start. In the pic you can see the now decomposing shrimp has migrated from the sand. Little fleshy strands of this decomposing shrimp have almost 'attached' themselves to the LR.
Yummy....bacteria at play...

Tonight I added about 2 lbs. of southdown from my next door neighbor's established, and fairly pristine, tank. I cut the powerstrip switch right before I added the sand, and I let the new sand settle while my girlfriend and I had dinner. The tank was a tad cloudy. After dinner I kicked on the power and manually blew some sand and detritus off of the LR with one of the maxis. The tank clouded up more as I hit the sand in the front of the tank a bit, and more so when I rearranged a couple of pieces of LR rubble that had fallen...

[InsaneClownFish]

Update:

I tested both the ammonia and nitrite using salifert. Both were inconclusive/nonexistent. It's possible I'm doing the test wrong. Irregardless the tank is definately cycling.

The cocktail shrimp is now at the bottom of the rock....turning gray with tons of little holes in it....mmm bacteria.

I'm also starting to see my first real signs of life in the tank..
I could have sworn two days ago something jetted into a little crevice on the top of my LR. My girlfriend and I were checking out all of the little filter feeders and worms that are beginning to extend from the rocks.

Suddenly she says to me...."what's that thing?!?" I struggled for about ten minutes to see what/ where she was pointing at...."don't you see it...?" "the hole thingy" "looks like a hole going in and out of the rock?" I finally saw it....Aiptasia! LOL...I'm probably the only one who's excited to see this pest anemone in my tank ..

Hey it's my first real sign of substantial marine life...
When my cycle is near up, I'll be sure to add a couple of peppermint shrimp and some red legged hermits.

Aside- I was just on wetwebmedia reading all about aiptasia, and one of the "munchers" is the red hermit crab(hairy). I believe the author is making the destintion between the smaller 'scarlet' hermits, but I'm not sure if these are also considered "hairy legged." Anyone know if any of the smaller hermits also eat aiptasia? I know there are other solutions....fish...emeralds...specialized nudis...and concentrated calcium...

I've also started to notice orange and red specks forming on the rocks...I believe these are sponges... If anyone else has some suggestions I'd be grateful.

I also think I saw a little tiny snail, but I couldn't get a good pic of the little bugger.

On another aside...is it possible that the ammonia is still very low? The tank was born 2/11/05, and the peek of the "smell" so far was last night...a bit of carribean stank if you put your nose over the tank and really sniff....today....smelled like a warm breeze....weird.

My specific gravity is still jumping up to slightly over 1.028 after about 1.5 gallons of evaporation. When I add one gallon of distilled water back to the tank, it levels out right at 1.026. After my first water change this weekend, I'm going to keep the specific gravity closer to 1.025..that way if too much evaporation occurs it shouldn't jump pver 1.027.

[masterswimmer]

As you know, I've been following along. Keep up the good work. Since you have nothing in your tank at this time, I would take a turkey baster, fill it with boiling water and give your aptaisia a nice warm jacuzzi bath. Nuke that puppy before it has a chance to spread. There is a real good reason they call it a pest. BTW, I've also used this treatment with my tank cycled, filled with livestock to the max and it works great. I just have to make sure I have real good aim. Your setup is quite a bit more foregiving at this time.
Joes Juice works great too. As does a nice Kalk paste.
Keep up the good work,
Russ