Trying to Select Anthias Species

[matt-davis sq.]

I haven't posted on RC in ages, but I have a new system that is sparsely stocked, and I was interested in the possibility of a harem of anthias for color and activity.

I have a 125gal mixed reef system with canopy and a bright combination of MH and T5 lighting. The only current inhabitants are a Majestic Angel (~5"), a PBT (~5"), and a pair of True Percula clowns (~1.5"). There is some foot traffic. I would have to feed with an automatic feeder during the day as I'm only home for the evening feeding. Incoming fish would be quarantined for 10 weeks for hyposalinity in my 40L.

My concerns with selecting an Anthias species are (in no particular order):

• Whether they will all turn male and kill each other.
• Their ability to tolerate the bright light of a reef.
• Being too skittish with foot traffic in the house and/or jumping (although there is no escape through the canopy)
• Being harassed by or harassing the current inhabitants (the latter is unlikely)
• Most importantly hardiness.

I had narrowed my list down to the Bartlet, Lyretail, and Disbar Anthias.

The Bartlet Anthias seems to be a little less likely to be harassed and easier to care for, but I have heard they will all turn male and kill each other. I have heard the Disbar Anthias seems a little more skittish and difficult to care for, but may tolerate the high lighting of the reef better. I have heard no accounts of Disbar anthias all turning male and killing each other. I have heard the Lyretail anthias won't tolerate the high lighting of the reef, are delicate, and may harass other fish.

Does anyone have any recommendations? It seems like the Disbar Anthias might be the best Anthias species to go for.

Anthias experts please advise,

Matt

[Mr James]

Anthias Experts?? How about someone who has successfully kept a harem of Lyretails?? 1 male and 4 females. Ate like pigs, swam together, and the colors of the male are especially outstanding!! I kept them in a 180g tank and felt like I was cramping their style. I don't plan to keep them again unless I have a bigger system.

[reeferaddiction]

lyretails are hardy and actually quite bold i only have one but she is deff not frail or timid like most anthias

[CarlC]

My dispar have been with me for about a year now. Bartletts are the worst for keeping groups because they will eventually all become males. Dispar aren't as fast to turn all male. I started with 1.3 and after about 8 month's one of the females changed. This new male became the dominant fish and constantly pummeled the original male. The original was removed. They have no fear of me. Eat anything that hits the water and can easily hold their own against the bigger anthias I keep in the same tank but the dispar usually start the trouble. They are a shallow water species so they can handle the light. Give them high flow and good care in QT and they do fine. They can be tough to get eating and a round of treatment with PraziPro is a must in my opinion.

Carl

[SDguy]

Of the three you listed, I think dispars are the most delicate/hardest to get eating, and come in the most "wormy". The most "shoaling" of the three, IME.

I, along with others, have experienced bartletts turning male, but they seem to coexist OK. No killing from my experience or what others have posted. They are beautiful and hardy. New ones should be FW dipped for flukes. The easiest of the three to get to eat just about anything. Other people reported them jumpy...I never experienced this.

Lyretails are also great. Very hardy and beautiful. I think a 125g is plenty of room for several of these 4" fish. Sometimes they won't take to dry food right away.

hth

[matt-davis sq.]

thank you all for your replies. It's nice to get a good range of opinions. I have some follow up questions.

Do you think 1 male and 2/3 female Lyretails (3/4 total fish) would be okay in a 125gal system? Will the light of a reef bother them?

If my Bartletts all turn male, you say they aren't going to kill each other? How many Bartletts should I put in there? Should I even bother with trying for a harem, or just buy a few small ones and let them all turn male?

Matt

[Mr James]

No less than 1M:3F Lyretails IMO. I was running 3 x 250w MH's and no bother. They do like flow, that's for sure!!

[matt-davis sq.]

Thanks so much. Do I have to worry about female lyretails changing?

Matt

[Frankie1]

i agree the dispars are the hardest to get to eat and the bartletts the easiest. the lyertails were easy to get to eat also. the bartletts i have had for over a year now and yes 1 has turned male and i bought one as a male. other than chasing each other none have died. also the bartlets rule the roost. i have 4 bartletts, 3 dispars and 2 lyertails they pretty much school together. just my 2 cents.

frankie

[Mr James]

by matt-davis sq.
Thanks so much. Do I have to worry about female lyretails changing?

From what I understand, but not witnessed, YES, they can change sex. But I hear they do that if there are fewer females. Say 2 females to 1 male, from what I understand. I got my info from both RC and Dr's Foster & Smith website.

[CarlC]

It is possible for any of the species to change its just that Lyretails don't seem to be getting the trigger to change like bartletts. It's all about the social structure. If you have it right you'll keep females. If it is off you'll get a new male or males to replace the male that is not up to the females liking.

Welcome to the wonderful world of Pseudanthias!

Carl

[matt-davis sq.]

I'm really excited about trying them.

Does anyone foresee any interaction problems with either the Majestic Angel or the PBT? Both are of the size (and temperment) that I don't envision any problems.

Also, has anyone had any problems with hyposalinity? That's my only other concern, whether they can survive a 6wk course of hypo that I administer to all incoming fish.

Matt

[CarlC]

Your other fish should be fine with them.

The longest I have had a species in hypo was 7 weeks. You wouldn't know it was in reduced salinity by the way they were acting though. I don't think I would have gone any longer.

Like Peter suggested a freshwater dip is helpful also. Alot of anthias come through with some nasty flukes on the gills and under the scales. While in hypo a round of PraziPro will get rid of whatever the freshwater weakend. I also give them a week of Prazi Pro gut loaded adult brine to help clear the intestinal tract.

They are addictiive if they do well!

Carl

[matt-davis sq.]

Thanks for the heads up on flukes, Carl.

My hypo course is only 6 weeks at hypo, and two weeks of adjustment to and from on either end.

I really think I am going to go with the Lyretails.
I imagine I will need live brine to get them started. Thankfully they will be in quarantine so they can be much more readily coaxed into eating. Have you found it a challenge to get them to eat? I will not be making the purchase for several weeks, and not until I'm set up for them.

Matt

[CarlC]

I have not kept Lyretails so can't really comment on them. Of the others species I currently keep the parvirostris and dispar gave me the roughest time. Within a couple of weeks of QT they all started eating a regular diet though. By regular I mean the foods I feed every day.

Tuka's were without a doubt my biggest challange and I failed. I had them eating no problem but it was only brine nauplii. I lost 6 of 12 for unknown reasons and gave the 6 that were still eating back to the dealer I bought them off of becaue I just could not get them to switch to my regular foods.

Carl

[Frankie1]

lyertails were no real challenge to get them to eat.

frankie

[Wrench]

I just got a group of 6 lyretails yesterday and they were eating mysis and cyclopeeze within two hours.

[matt-davis sq.]

Beautiful picture. I can't wait to get mine now. I'm thinking of 1 male and 3 females for my 125gal. If I should add more females, let me know, but I don't want to overcrowd the tank. It's good to hear that they were eating Mysis no problem. Where di you get yours from?

Matt

[Wrench]

I get them from a local guy that has a small business dealing direct with the wholesalers. So those fish are about 3 days from the ocean

[matt-davis sq.]

That's the way to get them. I know a guy here who can usually do the same thing, but he hasn't been around the boards in a while...

So what else do you have in your 120 besides these Anthias? What's your M:F ratio?

Matt

[Frankie1]

i would order all females and let them decide the pecking order.

frankie

[Wrench]

Originally posted by matt-davis sq.
That's the way to get them. I know a guy here who can usually do the same thing, but he hasn't been around the boards in a while...

So what else do you have in your 120 besides these Anthias? What's your M:F ratio?

Matt

I've got 6 females. I'm going to let them fight it out

Besides the Anthias I've got a Powder Blue Tang, Yellow Tang, Tomini Tang, 5 Chromis, Watchman Goby and a true Percula Clown.

[mattyice]

may i recommend flavicauda anthias as well, they are a heavier body anthias, BRIGHT colors, and eat anything you drop in front of their face, i miss my trio

[Frankie1]

any pics of your trio?

frankie

[Julio]

go with lyretails, easy to keep and not fuzzy about feeding