220 Inwall - Plan

[bheron]

Thanks. No, youre right. I do need to be careful. I hate losing anything like that. So far, so good though. Im really glad it enabled me to clean out the literal pile of detritus in sitting in the depths of my overflows.

[bheron]

Well, I got the new skimmer! Picked it up on Friday and installed it on Monday night. Thanks so much for your help and input through my long and extensive search. Some details of the new baby!

Euro-Reef CS 8-3+

Rated: 200 gallons

Footprint: 13½" x 15½"

Height: 30"

Diameter: 8"

Pumps: 2 Sedra (huge, I forget the model)


Here's a shot of it next to my CS6-1. I had no idea how big this 8-3+ really was....and how puny it would make my 6-1 look!



Wow. I cant beleive I've been running my tank so long with such a small skimmer

First, here's a shot of the skimmer cup on my OLD Skimmer (6-1) after about a week or so (the lines denote measured cups of skimmate, so thats about 2 cups).



I didnt think that was too bad.

Well, in the first night of operation I probably collected the same amount with the 8-3+ ! I havent figured how many measured cups of skimmated it holds yet, but the amount I collected was alot. As soon as I pluged it in, within a minute, it was bubbling up with waste. Here's a series of pictures I took, all a few seconds apart:
















Continued next.....

[bheron]

....Continued...

So I started it up around 11pm (wife liked that - "what are you DOING down there?") And here's what collected by the time I checked the next day after work:




....compared to this after a week or so on my old skimmer...



Im a very happy person today. Again, thanks for all of your help and support!

[tgunn]

Hey Bryan,
Looks like the new skimmer is doing an awesome job! Wow, I can't believe how much bigger it is than your old one!

If that's one day of skimmate, you're going to need to build an external collection container!

I'm sure this will only serve to help things out in your tank.
How much twiddling did you have to do to adjust it? Or was it pretty much just start it up and let it go?

Tyler

[bheron]

Thanks Tyler. I know! When I looked at the specs on the ER site, I didnt see such the big difference. But its not even in the same league. Haha, well, if I have to build an external collection gadget, I will be a happy person!! Im not sure, but I think I noticed a difference in the amount of algae on my glass last after one night.

How much twiddling did you have to do to adjust it? Or was it pretty much just start it up and let it go?

- Great question. This turned out to be typical Euro-reef. When I unpacked it, I wasnt sure how to connect the gate valve thing. I went and looked at the pics the previous owner sent me and just winged it. I didnt touch the gate valve. I literally connected it, slapped the collection cup on, the two pumps, and plugged them in. Maybe 3 minutes of effort!!!


So, being that I dont know what effects the gate valve will have, maybe I can tune it to perform even better!!!??? I know the gate valve effects the output, thats it.


Also, I will surely be looking into this "Meshwheel" idea since Melev pointed me to the thread. With that said, this is what the impeller looks like when I opened it.



- Is this "Needle Wheel"?

WHooahhaah haa haa, I feel like a cross between a Mad Scientist and a Kid in a Candy Store! Dangerous.
- Can I mod this to a "Meshwheel"?

[tgunn]

I'm not sure if this helps, but here's my impeller modded:


It's nice when something "just works" out of the box like that. The mark of a well made product IMHO.

The gate valve is going to let you adjust how high the water level is in the skimmer. So if you want to skim wetter you can raise the water level up. If you want to skim drier, you can just lower the water level a bit. Once you find a setting you can pretty much just leave it be.

Really the big thing is to be able to tie the mesh to the impeller some how.. You should see if anyone has modded that particular pump before; I'm sure they could give you some pointers..

[bheron]

Cool pic! So, did you notice a difference when you mod'd yours?

About the Gate Valve - ah. Makes sense. Thats pretty easy - I remember people getting upset when they couldnt get theirs to tune properly. I'll have to tweak it - definitely dont want it wetter - who would? Right now, the skimmate looks to be a good consistency. Hmmm. Thanks for the guidance.

Yea, as far as my pump. I was planning on going either to that Monster meshwheel thread and asking, or trying in the Monster Euro-reef club thread I found. Thats a start. Thankx.

[tgunn]

Originally posted by bheron
Cool pic! So, did you notice a difference when you mod'd yours?

About the Gate Valve - ah. Makes sense. Thats pretty easy - I remember people getting upset when they couldnt get theirs to tune properly. I'll have to tweak it - definitely dont want it wetter - who would? Right now, the skimmate looks to be a good consistency. Hmmm. Thanks for the guidance.

Yea, as far as my pump. I was planning on going either to that Monster meshwheel thread and asking, or trying in the Monster Euro-reef club thread I found. Thats a start. Thankx.

BIG difference. The modded pump definitely pulls in more air. You can hear and feel the different at the air intake for that pump.

The one pump is probably performing just a little less than both the unmodded pumps combined.

It looks like you've got a perfect consistency there. I've never been a fan of super wet skimming. Just means I have to worry about salinity swinging in the tank and my collection pail overflowing..

Tyler

Tyler

[bheron]

Holy shnikees! Thats aol. I cant wait to try it out. If I can get even more out of this skimmer, my fish will actually like me!

Reminds me of another topic, to those who have a "recirulating" skimmer: what does it do different, exactly?

Without researching, Im assuming it recirculates already skimmed water, so that it goes through the cleaner twice?

[agarza]

I think it has to do with creating more turbulence in the water inside the skimmer body and keeping the bubbles longer in there so they can collect more while in it. I'm no expert and would need to do some research too, but sounds like a good theory

[BryanJ]

Alfonso

I would agree with that. I was going to post that answer but because I don't own one I chickened out and didn't post it. I didn't want to dispute it for the next 3 days

[bheron]

Hahaha. Thanks! Ok, thats different from what I was thinking then. Hmmm. Ok. More research needed!



Couple random pics...


Purple Fire Goby still going.



Atlantic Cucumber getting bigger.



Some nice colors

[tgunn]

Originally posted by bheron
Holy shnikees! Thats aol. I cant wait to try it out. If I can get even more out of this skimmer, my fish will actually like me!

Reminds me of another topic, to those who have a "recirulating" skimmer: what does it do different, exactly?

Without researching, Im assuming it recirculates already skimmed water, so that it goes through the cleaner twice?

Yup, it's definitely nice to get more out of the skimmer for very little.

The only downfall I have with the mesh mod on my particular skimmer is that when I plug the modded pump in it does not start sucking aim immediately -- I have to blow the air out of the venturi air line to get it started, then it works fine. If you mesh med you may want to check with someone who's modded a similar pump and see if this is the case for you. It's a minor thing but something to be aware of regardless.

With a recirculating skimmer, agarza has the right idea. It's all about contact time to allow proteins to attach to the bubbles. I'm not certain how much this gets you advantage wise though.

[agarza]

It made sense to me, thank you tgunn

[melev]

Just use the skimmer the way it is. Don't touch a thing, don't mod anything yet. Let it clean up your system for now. Later down the road, if you are adventurous, you can modify the impellars. Those things cost $100 each, and if you end up with a disaster on your hands, you'll need $200 for new impellars.

I've swapped out my impellars with meshwheels and it works great. Matter of fact, they start up every single time as they should, unlike what was occuring with the new version of the needle wheels Euro-Reef sent me a few months ago. So in my case, the mesh-mod was a huge benefit.

The skimmate consistency looks a tad wet, but again that was the first day on a tank full of dirty water. As it pulls out the waste, it will lower the DOCs in the tank. You'll notice less skimmate in the coming weeks or months as the water is more and more "pure".

Rather than a collection container, just wash your cup out daily. That's what you should be doing anyway.

[BryanJ]

Melev

I always heard every 3 or 4 days for cleaning the cup. What is the benefit of washing it daily? I have been considering stepping it up and now you seem to be confirming that I should be cleaning it more often.

[melev]

When I take it off, I pour it down the sink and 'wash' it with tap water and my hand. Once clean, it is back on the skimmer and pulling out more waste within minutes.

Think about what it is: poo, DOCs, etc... How often do you flush your toilet?

[BryanJ]

I wash it everytime I just do not empty it that often. I guess I will step it up to every other day at least. I thought maybe you heard of some biological significance other then cleanliness.

[melev]

I just find that the gunk in the neck builds up and reduces the collecting abilities of the cup, in my experience. A clean riser and rim inside the cup has nothing to pop the bubbles or stop the export of skimmate.

[Airman]

Today I found my fire goby behind the tank. It jumped out of the tank. I upgraded my lights from VHOs to MH/PC/moon lights. It is alot more light. My guess is the extra light spooked the goby. Has anyone else lost fish to a light upgrade?

[BryanJ]

Melev

It always seemed to pull more skimate after it got dirty, so I left it go for a week. I had a HA break out so I started cleaning it twice a week then I bought a bigger skimmer which is keeping it in check but I obviously need a phos filter as well to clear the problem up completely. I will try daily cleaning to see if I still need to buy a phos filter. Your sump pics have been of great influence to me. I know you do alot of research.

Airman

My fire goby lives in my refugium. I put him in the display tank he is in the overflow in less then 10 minutes and rides down to my basement sump within the hour. I did this 3 times and quit hence the reason he livesin the fuge.

[bheron]

Some good stuff here!


Tyler -

The only downfall I have with the mesh mod on my particular skimmer is that when I plug the modded pump in it does not start sucking aim immediately -- I have to blow the air out of the venturi air line to get it started, then it works fine. If you mesh med you may want to check with someone who's modded a similar pump and see if this is the case for you. It's a minor thing but something to be aware of regardless.

- ok. wasnt aware of that. hmm.

With a recirculating skimmer, agarza has the right idea. It's all about contact time to allow proteins to attach to the bubbles. I'm not certain how much this gets you advantage wise though.

- Ah. ok. THanks Agarza for the clarity! I wasnt sure. What I was thinking is that a recirculated skimmer took the outgoing water and pumped it back into the water column. Different thing. If that was it, then I was going to suggest using two skimmers, one right after the other. oh well, Samsonite, i was waaay off.


Marc -

Just use the skimmer the way it is. Don't touch a thing, don't mod anything yet. Let it clean up your system for now. Later down the road, if you are adventurous, you can modify the impellars. Those things cost $100 each, and if you end up with a disaster on your hands, you'll need $200 for new impellars.

- I hear you loud and clear. Im gonna let it sit for a while.

The skimmate consistency looks a tad wet, but again that was the first day on a tank full of dirty water. As it pulls out the waste, it will lower the DOCs in the tank. You'll notice less skimmate in the coming weeks or months as the water is more and more "pure".

- Well, Marc, youre right on. Thats what has happened. That huge amount of skimmate it pulled out on night, I havent seen that asgain. its slowed down a bit since then. so, is it safe to say that the tank is getting cleaner? or has the skimmer hit its limit? Am I "pure"?

BryanJ and Melev - interesting points. Ive never followed any rule, either, on cleaning. but i'll tell you that i've NEVER cleaned it once a day I usually just waited until it got full and then cleaned it out. Sometimes I've heard that it needs to "prime" - build up a layer of scum to operate better. But, like you said, Marc, it seems to skim better right after a cleaning. But...once a day...do i have to mom?

Airman -

Today I found my fire goby behind the tank. It jumped out of the tank. I upgraded my lights from VHOs to MH/PC/moon lights. It is alot more light. My guess is the extra light spooked the goby. Has anyone else lost fish to a light upgrade?

- Airman, that nuts. Im sorry for the loss. I can definitely see the jumps in these fish. My T5s cover most of the top of the tank. Maybe 85%. Thats not to say he cant make it out. When I went and bought my Royal Gramma from a local hobbyist, while he was trying to catch it, it hopped into the overflow. Amazing thing is that it was covered in some pretty heavy rubber matting. I dont know how it got in. Ever see the Matrix? Anyway, sorry for the loss.

Bryan J

My fire goby lives in my refugium. I put him in the display tank he is in the overflow in less then 10 minutes and rides down to my basement sump within the hour. I did this 3 times and quit hence the reason he livesin the fuge.

- That story tops mine Good decision. Some fish just insist on being different!


Well, even though my skimmate seems to have decreased, I definitely have noticed a big change in my tank. Corals seem to be opening up a bit more, and I no longer have to scrape the algae on my front glass EVERY DAY!!! I was beginning to see a green hair algae problem. Hopefully it will subside with better water quality

Also, my Pod population issue has also made a turnaround. About a week ago I reazlied my decision to throw my chaeto into my sump (instead of my fuge) caused a decrease in my pod population. Since moving the chateo back into the much slower water flow area, as well as a daily "catch and release" of pods from a fliter bag in my sump, Ive began noticing them in my fuge again! Yep, they definitely like low flow and a place to hide/forage. I also have been droppping some dry food pellets in. Im seeing larger Amphipods in the chaeto and now Im seeing the smaller Copepods beginning to form on the glass of the fuge - just like in a startup tank. Mandarin is still alive. I may have dodged a bullet here!

[melev]

Bryan, your tank is nowhere near "pure" yet. But after about a month, you'll notice the skimmer isn't pulling out nearly what you saw at first. When you scrape the glass or blow off the rockwork, the skimmer will remove those particulates as well, further cleaning the system.

Do you feed daily? Do you top off daily? Clean yer skimmer daily!

Think of it this way: If it is only a little dirty, it cleans up more quickly than if it is corrupted with mud n 'mate.

[BryanJ]

As I was cleaning my skimmer last night I was thinking about this. Why do we run a skimmer to clean poo and excessive nutrients out of the water. If I am not washing the neck of the skimmer daily it is no different then letting detrius accumulate in a dead spot in your tank. So if you won't let detrius accumulate in your tank why would you let it accumulate in your skimmer body and neck? So cleaning it more frequently only makes sense if you want to export the bad stuff. Daily maybe pushing it, but cetainly as soon as you notice the neck is covered in detrius. I look at my skimmer multiple times a day when doing maintenace in the sump and preparing meals for the tank so for me monitoring this will be no problem.

[bheron]

Marc - thats great to know that the junk that comes off from blowing the rocks will be picked up by the skimmer! Whohoooo!. And good illustration on the cleaning process.

BryanJ - also, good point about letting it sit in the water. ok, i get it now