Anyone compared T5 to VHO PAR yet???

[stereomandan]

I remember a few months back, I raised this question, and was shocked that no one knew the answer or had data, especially with so much talk of how good T5's are.

If you compare, say, a 48" 110W UVL Super Actinic VHO to a 48" 54W UVL Super Actinic T5, which would put out more PAR? The same could go for a "daylight" bulb comparison.

The T5 would have it's own individual reflector, like a TEK or Icecap, and the VHO would have it's normal internal reflector

The T5 would be driven on the spec T5 ballast (not overdriven on the IC 660), and the VHO would be on the Icepcap or similar VHO ballast.

...and I'm talking about real data, not a blanket statement the T5's are better...

BTW, I have both T5's and VHO's on my 90g.

Dan

[stereomandan]

Hmm, noone knows?

Dan

[printedpaper]

Good question, I was wondering the same thing

[luke33]

Goin on 9hrs and nothin?

[stereomandan]

Well, here is one last try hoping that someone will see this who's done some testing.

It still greatly surprises me that we don't have this data. Seems like something that would be in one of Grim Reefers threads about T5 PAR, considering how many are looking to possibly convert from VHO to T5.

If I had the equipment to measure PAR, I would gladly do it.

Dan

[K9]

Man, it's hard to leave VHOs though, especially with how cheap they are now. For example, the VHOs I'm considering for my 75g tank are only roughly $200 for 440watts. By comparison, the T5 Tek Light fixture (6-bulbs) I like is close to $500. That $300 could be used for lots of other things I need. T5's may be "the future" as far as flourescents are concerned, but VHOs have long proven their mettle and are now more affordable than ever.

[luke33]

Do many people use VHO and have sps and clam's on their sandbed? Just out of curiousity.

[markandkristen]

Originally posted by K9
Man, it's hard to leave VHOs though, especially with how cheap they are now. For example, the VHOs I'm considering for my 75g tank are only roughly $200 for 440watts. By comparison, the T5 Tek Light fixture (6-bulbs) I like is close to $500. That $300 could be used for lots of other things I need. T5's may be "the future" as far as flourescents are concerned, but VHOs have long proven their mettle and are now more affordable than ever.

if your doing a kit that goes into your canopy i just purchased one set (two) bulb setup tek with light bulbs from hello lights ( thier brand of bulb. >> in which i have them side by side to a g-man bulb and thiers is hardly any difference) for 130

so that would be 260

is the vho setup your talking about include bulbs and is it a a retro kit.

[K9]

Originally posted by markandkristen
if your doing a kit that goes into your canopy i just purchased one set (two) bulb setup tek with light bulbs from hello lights ( thier brand of bulb. >> in which i have them side by side to a g-man bulb and thiers is hardly any difference) for 130

so that would be 260

is the vho setup your talking about include bulbs and is it a a retro kit.

Well, I was looking at having 4 VHO bulbs (110w each) or 6 T5 bulbs (54w each). The $200 I mentioned above is for a retrofit kit from HelloLights.com and does include bulbs. I bought the same kit for two older nano tanks I had (2-24" bulbs for my 20g and 2-36" bulbs for my 30g). They're easy to assemble and make plenty of light for my needs. At $200 for 440w of light on my 75g, how can you go wrong?

EDIT: Two of these kits with bulbs is just a shade over $200...
http://www.hellolights.com/2laaroasbaki.html

[printedpaper]

How do the VHO's run as far as heat? Do they run hot or do they run cool?

[grwoolf]

They are pretty warm to the touch, but not hot like MH. Keep in mind that there is a larger surface area giving off the heat. I have 3 VHO's on my 72g and they heat up the tank pretty fast with the canopy closed and just venting out the back.

[thriceanangel]

T5's are better! Just kidding, but here is some info on 4' VHO. The Grim Reefer should be along any minute now and add to the T5 side of the discussion.

[stereomandan]

My T5's don't' run cool either.

thriceanangel,
Thanks for the chart. Is it PAR? Hard to tell.

Without knowing the bulb combination, or if it was tested through water..., I can't compare it to anything T5, but it is cool to look at how the light distributes across the length of the bulbs. It's weird that the highest light intensity is not in the middle. They must have a daylight type bulb towards the front of the tank.

Dan

[printedpaper]

I asked Grim Reefer about the comparision between a 4x110 VHO and 4x54 t-5 he recomended t-5 but I think by his response he likes VHO for actinic. Check out the T-5 thread.

[pjf]

I haven't found PAR figures for T5HO and VHO lighting but here are efficiency figures:
• VHO T12 lamps produce 49-55 lumens per watt: http://www.elliptipar.com/vertical/Vertpdf/VertGdLg.pdf
• T5HO lighting produces 83-93 lumens per watt: http://www.lrc.rpi.edu/programs/nlpi.../lat5/pc1a.asp

With individual parabolic reflectors, characteristic of many T5HO fixtures, more light is directed into the aquarium.

[stereomandan]

Originally posted by pjf
I haven't found PAR figures for T5HO and VHO lighting but here are efficiency figures:
• VHO T12 lamps produce 49-55 lumens per watt: http://www.elliptipar.com/vertical/Vertpdf/VertGdLg.pdf
• T5HO lighting produces 83-93 lumens per watt: http://www.lrc.rpi.edu/programs/nlpi.../lat5/pc1a.asp

With individual parabolic reflectors, characteristic of many T5HO fixtures, more light is directed into the aquarium.

Thanks for the reply.

Efficiency isn't what I'm looking for. I do expect the T5's to be more efficient. What I'm wondering is the actual light output for the 4' T5 or VHO bulb, regardless of the wattage. To do this comparison, someone would need to do the testing as I describe in my first post. It doesn't sound as though anyone has done that, which still surprises me.

You can't make your last claim without having data to prove it. Do we know that the individual reflector for the T5 is better than the internal reflector of the VHO? It may be, but until we have data to prove it, no claims can be made.

Dan

[HowardW]

I think I remember reading somewhere a test between a 110W 10K VHO, a 96W 10K power compact, and a 54W 10K T5HO using an SLS parabolic reflector, and they were all somewhat similar in PAR output. That would make the T5HO put out nearly twice the PAR per watt of the other two.

[thriceanangel]

Originally posted by stereomandan
My T5's don't' run cool either.

thriceanangel,
Thanks for the chart. Is it PAR? Hard to tell.

Without knowing the bulb combination, or if it was tested through water..., I can't compare it to anything T5, but it is cool to look at how the light distributes across the length of the bulbs. It's weird that the highest light intensity is not in the middle. They must have a daylight type bulb towards the front of the tank.

Dan

Yeah that graph that I posted is PAR at 12 inches with 36 different measurements at 6" intervals.

[pjf]

Here is some PAR data, collected by Dana Riddle, for a 4x110watt VHO system: http://www.coralreefecosystems.com/l...tion%20pattern
Unfortunately, there is no information about reflectors used on this system.

The VHO PAR intensity (225-300) in the center of the tank is matched by a 302 PAR 4x39watt T5HO ATI Powermodule system measured by The Grim Reefer (http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...02#post9381757):

Originally posted by The Grim Reefer
Well alright sports fans. I did the PAR reading in the tank with this selection of lamps

Front

ATI Blue Plus
AS Blue
ATI Blue Plus
ATI Blue
AS Sun
AS Duo

Sensor was 17 inches below the water, lamps were about 2 1/4" above. The thing popped 310 PAR. I feel much better about this unit. The 4x39 Powermodule with 1 blue plus, 1 actinic, 1 sunpro and 1 aquablue lamp only did 302 over this tank when I tested it. I can't wait to see what this thing does with Aquactinics reflectors in it.

While this is not exactly the apples-to-apples comparison that you are looking for, it does demonstrate that a 4x39w T5HO fixture can be in the same ballpark as a 4x110w VHO fixture.

[Scooter12ga]

Originally posted by pjf
[B]Here is some PAR data, collected by Dana Riddle, for a 4x110watt VHO system: http://www.coralreefecosystems.com/l...tion%20pattern

Can somebody please explain how to read these graphs? I don't understand what each of the axes represents. Is this the surface area at a given depth, or depth vs. something else?

[RoGeTa]

They seem to be the length and width of the tank with the color representing par values. Could be wrong though. At least the one up above is...I didn't follow any links.