LFS Emploee Inadequacies

[afishyonados]

I understand there is an overwhelming dislike for the assistance or lack thereof by LFS people. Have any of you had good experiences with yours? Tell me, please, for the general consensus is discouraging.
Those of you with legitamate gripes, I would love to hear them, to avoid making the same mistakes.

[KDodds]

Despite the occasional overheard faux pas, my LFS probably has the most knowledgable employees I've ever encountered. Better yet, if they don't know an answer to a question, they're not afraid to find someone who does. Today, for instance, during peak time, the owner was actually explaining how to use a power filter, in detail, with different media options, etc. and actually told them NOT to replace the bio-media. And he was spot on in his info.

[afishyonados]

This is where I say bump, right?

[crpeck]

I think my LFS guys are wonderful and I wouldn't have the tank I do without them.

Jason and Danny ... if you see this ..... I wouldn't have the tank I do without you both.

Thanks Jason for getting me started and coming to the house to change our my leaking pump when I was out of town. Even though you could use some social skills training at times, you're alright with me.

Thanks Danny for tank sitting and all your good advice. You've given me SO much of your time and help I can't even begin to thank you enough.

Thanks to you both for disagreeing with each other most of the time and so .... between the two of you .... giving me the information I need to work things out my way.

Anyone who says Dave isn't knowledgeable is a fool .... he may take strange to a new art form .... but he definitely knows what he's doing. You don't believe me about the strange part???? He says that attracting women is what got him into this hobby. Next time I have baby clowns, though ... we're definitely going to negotiate more than last time.

I value the relationship with my LFS and you will never hear me cut them down on this forum.

Cathy

[SaltandPepper]

From my experiences, a LFS has usuall 1 knowledgable professional, 1 idiot who thinks they know everything but do not, and 1 kid that is poking the fish in the sumps with a stick. You should avoid the last two. I usually seek out the most knowledgeable person in the shop.

[afishyonados]

That makes me very happy to hear!
As many of you who are reading this thread, why no responses?If I told you about my tang inside of my 2.5g tank, would that get a response?

[KDodds]

Well, I think that probably a lot are tired of the LFS bashing threads. And, it's only been ½ hour.

[afishyonados]

I'm sorry, I get a little excited.
This is not intended to bash anyone, just to help me understand the seemingly malicious undertones that I am reading.
Again, I'm sorry for my somewhat incessant behavior.
Please help me.

[zemuron114]

the guy i deal knows so much about everything. I love talking to him because i learn so much everytime. He knows his stuff inside and out

[afishyonados]

I am glad he takes the time to share it with you! Tell him I said, "Keep the faith!"

[yoboyjdizz]

last x-mas my lfs told my mom a queen angel , clown sweetlips , and imperator angel would all be fine in my 72...so i came home one night and was like what the hell... next day back to the lfs for some explaning ...

[afishyonados]

It is unfortunate that people sling fish that have no understanding of thier needs. That is why my fish selection is fairly limited. I'm trying to learn more everyday!

[yoboyjdizz]

yeah there are some good people out there that atleast try to get everything right but some people just trying to sell a product

[jwedehase]

Hot rod enthusiasts don't take their home-built street machines to a mechanic to have the oil changed. Why? You just don't trust someone else with the baby you built. I have a hard enough time just taking my modern Toyota pickup, let alone my blood/sweat/tears built hot rod. Or maybe a more familiar illustration would be taking your fully-optimized gaming rig to CompUSA for some repairs. Who, in their right mind, would do that?!

It's the same with reefers, and it applies even more to this particular crowd. The reefers here are generally some of the most knowledgeable and experienced aquarists in the world (as a group, not to discredit educated professionals). I would say it's fair to assume that anyone who is going to use a resource such as RC, and community-based learning, is going to be the type who has "jumped in with both feet" and gotten serious about this hobby and industry.

LFS employees, however, are genally younger guys who need a job, and don't have any marketable skills yet. They're possibly in college or even high school gaining those marketable skills.

As a very generic blanket statement: We're experts, and they're not. We get frustrated with their lack of knowledge, and expect that they should understand this industry, inside and out, as well as we do, even theough they're paid minimum wage... in general.

As the upper eschelon of hobbyists (please forgive the constant "nose in the air" I'm spouting), we need to understand that the overwhelming majority of hobbyists have no realization of the amount of information and technology out there. The last conversation I eavesdropped on was from a customer asking why he was having problems pouring 1 TBSP of kalk powder directly into his tank daily!

I don't go to JiffyLube and ask them how to fine tune my engine's timing and fuel curves for strong mid-upper RPM torque in light of the gear ratio I'll be using at some race track. But I might ask an engine tuner. Likewise, I don't ask the fish room lackey about setting up a Calcium reactor, but I might ask the owner of the store. Even then, his job is sales, not professional support.

I don't take my computer to CompUSA, either. But I'd buy parts from them (well, this is a whole 'nother argument about pricing, but you get the point).

[afishyonados]

Thank you jwedhase for a very eloquent reply. What you say holds near and dear to my heart. Specialists need specialists.
I admit, I have very much to learn about this hobby and any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

[sharemaster]

I have had so much bad advice from several LFS you have to find a good one and ask all the questiond you would normally ask them on here first then ask them. At the end of the day it is a LFS so if you say will this expensive new gadget help my xxxxxxx problem they think $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ sale and say yes.

I have now found a decent lfs where the staff are helpful and very knowledgable. They do exist you just have to look around and use your nouse.

[nam2212]

Originally posted by crpeck
I think my LFS guys are wonderful and I wouldn't have the tank I do without them.

Jason and Danny ... if you see this ..... I wouldn't have the tank I do without you both.

Thanks Jason for getting me started and coming to the house to change our my leaking pump when I was out of town. Even though you could use some social skills training at times, you're alright with me.

Thanks Danny for tank sitting and all your good advice. You've given me SO much of your time and help I can't even begin to thank you enough.

Thanks to you both for disagreeing with each other most of the time and so .... between the two of you .... giving me the information I need to work things out my way.

Anyone who says Dave isn't knowledgeable is a fool .... he may take strange to a new art form .... but he definitely knows what he's doing. You don't believe me about the strange part???? He says that attracting women is what got him into this hobby. Next time I have baby clowns, though ... we're definitely going to negotiate more than last time.

I value the relationship with my LFS and you will never hear me cut them down on this forum.

Cathy

I agree with your post completely. Danny, Jason and Dave have helped me out more times than I can count. They are always willing to answer any question that I have. Thanks guys.

[waterfaller1]

We help our customers with as much info as possible.We also tell new people about RC,so they can get other opinions and do the research.
I spend alot of time talking people out of livestock they are either not ready for,or don't have the set-up to accomodate.
I always make sure I know what lighting,how long set up,and how their tank is set up.{filtration,skimmer,sump,fuge,etc.}

[mofro]

could not agree more with jwedehase. After all LFS are there to make a profit. SELL!! How many times have i watched them sell unnesscary items to solve problems in tanks which they sold in the first place. Sure there might be some knowlegeable staff out there, but they are still going to sell you the products which give them the most benefits/kickbacks/profits. You want advice, you are at the right place. Just a bit of clicking and sorting through the info and the net can tell you exactly what to buy

[Saltz Creep]

The employees at both my LFSs are very knowledgeable, but the owner of one of them is a crook. Friendliest guy in the world, but he'll try to rob you blind. Oh, and he has his wife run the register during the day, but she is the only one that doesn't know jack about anything. You folks in Gainesville know whom I'm talking about.

[discocarp]

We help our customers with as much info as possible.We also tell new people about RC,so they can get other opinions and do the research.
I spend alot of time talking people out of livestock they are either not ready for,or don't have the set-up to accomodate.
I always make sure I know what lighting,how long set up,and how their tank is set up.{filtration,skimmer,sump,fuge,etc.}

SITC doesn't count. It'd be an insult to call you guys a LFS.

But seriously, I think if you go to the stores around town enough you start to learn who to trust, who to listen to with a grain of salt, and who to ignore.

[mm949]

your BEST bet is to find a "FISH" only store...their goal is to support "your" hobby...some are crooks...ITS up to you to educate yourself before a purchase..if NOT ...Buyer Beware!!! Thanks to Clubs like RC all hobbists can now share what works good for them and help you make better decisions concerning your aquarium....there are many ways to acheive your aquatic dreams and WE all have the same goal.....AWESOME chunk of the OCEAN...lol..
Best advice I tell you is know your customers needs, wants and desires...NEVER "feed" them a line of BS...solve their problems...and keep in mind "You cant please them All..."
good luck..feel free to pm any time you need

[crpeck]

So some LFS people are experienced and knowledgeable reefkeepers themselves. And some are students who need a job and are there to learn. And others are any number of combinations of the two extremes. Some are marketers who are focused on the sale and others, like one I know, will talk you out of something that you were ready to buy.

I think the message here is that you can't expect your LFS employees to let you off the hook from your responsibility to do your own research for your questions. It sounds like some people expect the LFS guys to all be Marine Biologists. Sure, some of the answers quoted in these threads have been pretty dumb .... but the person complaining believed it at the time, right? If the the answer was so obviously wrong, then the customer probably could have easily looked it up themselves in a book if they had bothered.

Bottom line is that I take responsibility for what happens in my tank. My LFS guys are one source of information, I have a library of books, Reef Central, and other web sources. Even if I get bad advice from any one of those sources, it was still my choice in the end as to what to do. Have I learned the hard way from some bad choices? Heck yeah! But almost every time that happened, it was when I made an impulse move without doing some research.

This is a complicated hobby. And, as someone else said, "The fish don't read the books." How many times have you heard of someone who either had an unusual problem or got away with something that most wouldn't have? If you're not willing to take the time to research and you want your pet store to have all of your answers, then you should stick to gerbils.

Cathy

[crpeck]

p.s. I hope you all know that in my post before about Dave, that I mean "strange" only in the best possible way ...

[toonces]

well, i have been to many, many lfs in my travels.

recently, i've been to two lfs local to where i live. one has ok customer service, and the employees are iffy.

the other has the absolute worst customer service of anywhere i've ever shopped in my life, but is close to work. the other day, i asked him about a certain angelfish. i had been reading up on this fish quite a bit, so i pretty much knew what to expect, but i wanted first hand experience. well, this guy was not only spot on, but we actually got into a fairly interesting conversation.

just today though, i stopped at petco on my way home to get some carbon. the poor saltwater department was just so sad. but, two things i give props to petco for. first, on every tank was a description of the fish with price, habits, and max size of the fish. maybe they're selling harlequin sweetlips and panther groupers, but at least they have a description that says they get 2-3'.
the second, i heard a customer either ask about getting a fish, or about how many fish she could get, and the first thing the lfs guy asked her was the size of her tank. nice going!

what i really, really hate (or love) is when an lfs employee doesn't know what something in the tank is, so they start making up prices for things. this can be very useful if YOU know what you're looking at and can get a good price. that's basically how i got my first two corals...