250w Radium 20ks on IceCap Eballast -- lifespan?

[tgunn]

Hey all,
It's nearing that time of year when I have to think about which bulbs I would like next.

In the past I ran:
Coralvue 14ks - okay for color, but super dim
Reeflux 10ks (current) - VERY bright, but not a fan of the color

I run 2x54w Blue+ T5s for supp.

After looking over countless spectral plots I was thinking I'd like to give the 250w SE Radium 20ks a try on my IceCap eballasts.

I've read that these bulbs have a low life span though, like 6 months or something like that. Any conclusive evidence for or against this?

Thanks!
Tyler

[luke33]

Not sure on the 6mth part but i really like the color of them and they have decent growth.

[tgunn]

Originally posted by luke33
Not sure on the 6mth part but i really like the color of them and they have decent growth.

Do you supplement them with anything like T5s of VHOs?
How blue is the color?

Thanks,
Tyler

[Blown 346]

Lifespan of the hbulbs will dopend on how long they are on for each day. But normal burn time before the light spectrum decreases etc is between 8 to 12 months before they should be replaced.

[luke33]

There fairly blue in color and no i don't supplement at all. Tgunn you have pm.

[PaintGuru]

Pictures would be nice

[luke33]

I tried the pics and my camera just won't show the true color so i don't post them, don't want people to get the wrong picture. There either waaaaaay to blue or waaaay to white. I guess my camera sux. The best way is to go to a lfs and see them there.

[oct2274]

i think bad lifespan on the radiums is only on the magnetic ballasts that drive them harder. I would think you could get atleast a year out of them on an icecap.

[tgunn]

Originally posted by oct2274
i think bad lifespan on the radiums is only on the magnetic ballasts that drive them harder. I would think you could get atleast a year out of them on an icecap.

That's kind of what I was thinking.

I guess I can just get 'em and find out.

Tyler

[PaintGuru]

I've just seen that 250W Radiums were designed for HQI's, so I assume they could go a full year on those as well.

[DarG]

I think that the SE Radiums are actually a true HQI bulb in SE base. I could be wrong but if that is the case, and I think it is, you may very well get better lifespan out of them on a magnetic HQI ballast. There is something referred to as spatter and I am not a guru but I think that it is essentially what occurs when a bulb is run below spec. It's an incomplete firing of the gasses inside the bulb that ends up shortening the usuable lifespan and it often occurs with DE bulbs run on electronic ballasts. They dont supply enough wattage to fire up all the gas/halides. If the Radium is a true HQI then it could be that using them on electronic ballasts is what gives them the short lifespan reputation.

The experts can feel free to correct me or expand on my limited understanding of the phenomenon.

[aclos3]

I've been thinking about the same bulb, but I have an EVC e-ballast. The EVC runs a bit harder than an Icecap, would I therefore be ok, or at least better off in terms of lifespan than if I were running an Icecap ballast?

[Emster]

From what I have read DarG is right.

[twon8]

i have not run radiums' but know people who do, and on hqi they need to be changed out at 6-9 months as they lose a lot of intensity

[tgunn]

Hmm, I guess the operative question for me is whether or not I could get 1 year on them with my icecap eballast...

I really don't want to have to replace at 6 months.

[DarG]

I think if you can find out if they are a true HQI rated bulb or not, you would have your answer.

[twon8]

from http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...02/feature.htm


The term “HQI” has become a source of confusion – it is being used by the aquarium lighting companies to specify ballasts for the European (primarily German made lamps), the single ended 400W and double ended 250W and 150W lamps. HQI is a registered trademark of OSRAM GmbH. In some cases, the “HQI” ballasts sold within the aquarium hobby are standard ANSI ballasts recommended for the lamps by the manufacturers (e.g. ANSI-M80 and M81 ballasts for the doubled ended 150W and 250W double ended lamps). In other cases they are ballasts not specifically designed for these lamps, but sold as “HQI” because they are claimed to match the operating specifics of the European lamps. This confusion is brought on in large part by the fact that the lamps are being made in Europe under European specs and there may not be a direct match with the ANSI ballast specifications. There is considerable trial and error required to find ballasts for these lamps, and the issue of whether these ballasts are in fact suitable for the lamps is open to debate.

[hahnmeister]

The Radium AquaStars that dont last as long are the 400's, because they are really just 360 watt bulbs, not 400's. Thats why they dont last so long, even on e-ballasts.

The 250's will last you just as long and well as a DE bulb though, because they are actually HQI bulbs, something normally reserved for the DE format.

http://www.radium.de/e/produkte_over...1855,2498,2569

[hahnmeister]

Originally posted by DarG
I think that the SE Radiums are actually a true HQI bulb in SE base. I could be wrong but if that is the case, and I think it is, you may very well get better lifespan out of them on a magnetic HQI ballast. There is something referred to as spatter and I am not a guru but I think that it is essentially what occurs when a bulb is run below spec. It's an incomplete firing of the gasses inside the bulb that ends up shortening the usuable lifespan and it often occurs with DE bulbs run on electronic ballasts. They dont supply enough wattage to fire up all the gas/halides. If the Radium is a true HQI then it could be that using them on electronic ballasts is what gives them the short lifespan reputation.

The experts can feel free to correct me or expand on my limited understanding of the phenomenon.

Originally posted by Emster
From what I have read DarG is right.

I can clear this up. HQI bulbs start with a 'pulse', a high voltage arc which ignites the whole bulb contents at once. They are higher pressure as well, to aid in starting, as well as longevity. A HQI has the starting mechanism in the ballast.

Probe start bulbs have a sort of 'short circuit' inside the bulb... a shorter arc, as well as the full circuit. The bulb starts by this smaller arc igniting first, since it covers a smaller distance. Then, as this smaller arc heats up, it disconnects, and the main circuit through the tube takes over, at this point hoping that the rest of the tube has heated up enough to carry the current.

The probe start bulbs have this 'spattering', not unlike how a phosphor based bulb starts and leaves black rings in the bulb. The problem with the 'spattering' is that it is the burning of some of the halide contents, and since a halide has a much smaller space, burning the contents to the side of the bulb means you end up blocking part of the light that is made as well. This is where electronic ballasts come in... they use a higher frequency to minimize this spatter.

HQI bulbs dont spatter... the entire contents of the bulb is ignited at once, evenly, without burning. This is also why hooking a HQI bulb to a probe ballast (like a M58) wont even fire the bulb usually... there is no starter mechanism.

So no, its not what happens when a bulb is run below spec, although it is true that running a bulb below spec will result in a lower lifespan... not that an e-ballast is always going to run a HQI bulb under spec.

250watt Radium SE bulbs will work fine on HQI ballasts as well as e-ballasts. The reputation is from the '400 watt' bulb... which isnt a 400 even.

[aclos3]

Thank you hahn, I think that settles it for me. I am going to try a Radium next.

[tgunn]

Yes, thanks. That definitely clears things up!

[gastone]

Hahn,

do you know of anyone using the "European" ballasts to fire their 400w Radiums?

Garrett.

[Timinator]

I just got the 20000k German Radiums and love the intense blue and white spectrum it gives out. Hahn I had the pleasure of reading the long post you had awhile back on tank lighting and am still wondering if you are still not a fan of the 20000K for coral growth? Thanks...

[oct2274]

thanks for the info hahn

[DarG]

Thanks Hahn ... But I think the question still remains ... is the 250 watt SE Radium actually an HQI rated bulb in a SE form? Or is it just a high quality, lower pressure pulse start.