Nw Or Beckett

[Johan Susanto]

I got tank 180cmx90cmx75

i got a dart pump for return & a hammerhead for beckett.

i know that dart now got nw pump.
i got confuse should i go for

dart nw skimmer & hammerhead as return or...
keep dart as return & hemmarhead for beckett.

PLEASE please advice

[E.Smith]

The hammer head will consume much more electricity than the dart so if you have no regard for electricity then go with a becket style skimmer. They do thier job much better than most nw skimmers can, but if you are conscientious about electricity you might want to go with a nw/recirc style skimmer.

[Nick A]

Also needlewheels can be more costly up front. Some people claim that becketts are pretty loud, but the ETSS I looked at when picking up my AC Jr was actually pretty silent. All I could hear was his reeflo pumps going.

[Rizing]

ive owned both and prefer coming home to see what looks like my beckett horking chunks out. then the watery stuff my first 3 nw skimmers did and it runs on a 40w blueline pump.

[RichConley]

Originally posted by Rizing
ive owned both and prefer coming home to see what looks like my beckett horking chunks out. then the watery stuff my first 3 nw skimmers did and it runs on a 40w blueline pump.

The NW skimmers of today are VERY different from the ones of even 2 years ago.


Typical needlewheels are now pulling MUCH MORE air than becketts.


You're going to need a big 3 beckett skimmer to pull as much air as that sequence needlewheel.


The Reeflo Skimmer looks pretty decent for $1200.

[Rizing]

id say just cruize the board and look at the skimate shots.... then make a decision

[RichConley]

Originally posted by Rizing
id say just cruize the board and look at the skimate shots.... then make a decision

Skimmate shots are about the least useful thing around. Theyre totally useless without know time frame, exact fish, exactly what was fed, whether or not a different skimmer was running before, how the skimmer is fed, where the skimmer is in the sump, whether water level is consistent, etc.


Its like buying a car because someone told you they got home in 15 minutes from work today, without them telling you how fast they were driving, what road, whether there was traffic, or how many miles the commute is.

[jtarmitage]

RichConley, how much air are the NW's pulling? I have an AO beckett, based on the Barr design, and it can peg my flow meter at 50 SCFH if I let it, and that is a single beckett. I didn't think many NW's could do that. I do understand though that the pump I am using is pulling a bit more juice than the NW's.

[Rizing]

i was referring to the color/quality of skimmate , not the time frame

[RichConley]

My needlwheel skimmer pulls 65 scfh at about 50w. Its a $200 skimmer with a $75 pump on it.


The idea that needlwheel skimmers are expensive, and dont pull much air is only valid if you're talking about Deltec.




A sequence dart is pulling 120+.

[RichConley]

Originally posted by Rizing
i was referring to the color/quality of skimmate , not the time frame

Thats exactly my point.


Any skimmer that isnt an absolute piece of junk can be tuned to pull pretty much any color or quality of skimmate. What is important is how much of that it can pull in what timeframe.

I can get my CPR bakpak to pull baby poo. It just takes forever toget a couple ounces. My octopus, on the other hand, will pump out a gallon of baby poo in a week or two if I let it.

[jtarmitage]

RichConley, Wow, that is impressive, 65 SCFH! I would feel silly with my beckett now, but the pump I use also supplies water to a seperate frag/fuge tank in another room, so I needed to move some water, along with head loss, so I combined the water transfer and skimmer into 1. Works well as I killed 2 birds with 1 stone so to speak. If I didn't need to move the water to another room, I would likely look into a NW. Thanks for the info.
Also, I assume you had to mod the OTP to get to 65 SCFH?

[RichConley]

I had modded the OTP to pull 50, but I was having some trouble with it pulling too much wattage, and I think I burned it out. (not all that sure, the impellar magnet may be the problem. )


I replaced it with a Laguna PowerJet 5000, that is also meshmodded, and is a much nicer pump. Essentially, the pump is the same one Royal Exclusive uses on the bubbleking (they use a custom volute, etc). They run about $70 on ebay, and pull 1400gph or so on 75w or so. The PJ5000 is the old model, I think the 1500 replaces it.

The older models need the impellars replaced because of a brass pin.


If you want a real monster, a meshmodded PowerJet 2400 will pull 120+ scfh for roughly 70w.

[jtarmitage]

120+!!! I think I would need a much larger skimmer to handle that much air!!

Sorry for the hijack Johan.

[oldimpala]

JT-

You can get that from a Beckett, too. I run a Sequence Wahoo on a Dual-Beckett MRC-MR2, with a 12" extension, and tune down to about 100....

I like the high turnover; it's nice to get a lot of water through the skimmer, quick, especially if some sort of bad mojo happens in the tank. Yeah; I know it pulls a bunch of watts to get there, but what is the actual cost? I'll bet it's about as much as a replacement needlewheel impeller when spread out over that item's lifecycle.

I think the NW/Beckett/Venturi/etc debate is all open to personal preference. They all get the job done; it's just how you wanna get there. I love my Beckett, Rich loves his Octopus, there are guys that'd take a bullet here for a LifeReef, or a Deltec, or whatever.

I do agree with Rizing; I can pull a LOT of gunk out with this skimmer... I don't think I'll ever go back to a Needlewheel, and I'm thinking about upgrading my tank, not even looking at any other types of skimmers....

But, I also think you can do the same job with a lot of other skimmers.... I just dig Becketts...


-Andy/Oldimpala

[RichConley]

Originally posted by oldimpala
JT-

You can get that from a Beckett, too. I run a Sequence Wahoo on a Dual-Beckett MRC-MR2, with a 12" extension, and tune down to about 100....

So you spend 270w to get 100scfh, and I can do over 120scfh for 70w....


Honestly, it doesnt matter how the air is created. Just that it gets there, and the skimmer is designed properly.

This idea that NWs can't pull chunks like becketts is based on old, innacurate information, and is completely incorrect.


Thats 200w, so, running 24 hours a day, at $.15/kwh, $22 more a month in electricity to run that pump. Replacement impellars for lagunas run about $30, so I'd have to replace them every..40 days or so, for the cost to even be similar.

[oldimpala]

Rich-

Those assumptions would be true; if it were drawing 270w, and if you don't count the fact you have to mesh-mod 'em. That time in, and of itself, to not have to mess with, source, replace pumps, expieriment, is worth $240/year to me. (I'm actually pulling more watts than that, and it's all good.) I don't want to mess with meshmods, or gate valve mods, or any of that stuff. I just want a skimmer. And the Becketts do that pretty well.

I save a little on my lighting (Solar Flare), over my old MH rig, ditched my chiller, and now it's even more unimportant. I'm happy, the corals are colored up, and the world is good.

My experiences with NW skimmers have been underwhelming, but I know they can work. And, when I say that, I know you'll say "It's they type of skimmer.", Or "Tuning Error", or "Mod it", but I've witnessed many a Venturi style skimmer skim circles around the G3, and Euroreef I used to have. And, I think a Barr (Especially) or MRC is better tech than the old-school Lifereef-esque basic Venturi.

I just don't have time for that stuff, and I think a lot of people here are the same way. Buy it, set it up, and go. It's why I have 3 Tunze's in my tanks, and no MJ Mods, it's all about what your time is worth to you...

And my beef with discount NW's still stands: If it's well designed, it shouldn't have to be modded.....

Like I said before, any decent product will skim just fine for most users; learn it, keep it clean, and tune it correctly. You'll be OK, especially if you do regular water changes, and have decent husbandry skills. Period.

-Andy

[Johan Susanto]

according to my friends own nw w red dragon & beckett w hammerhead.
nw red drg got very fine bubble zize compare to beckett, but beckett got very full bubble in the chamber.
well i allready got the dart & hammer on my hand, just need to be decided.
with skimm capacity is good to handling my tank system
nw with dart or beckett with hammerhead??

[RichConley]

Originally posted by oldimpala

My experiences with NW skimmers have been underwhelming, but I know they can work. And, when I say that, I know you'll say "It's they type of skimmer.", Or "Tuning Error", or "Mod it", but I've witnessed many a Venturi style skimmer skim circles around the G3, and Euroreef I used to have. And, I think a Barr (Especially) or MRC is better tech than the old-school Lifereef-esque basic Venturi.

I

-Andy

Andy, if you havent used a NW skimmer in the last year, you havent used a modern NW skimmer. Theyre completely different at this point. The ERs pull 3 times the air they did 2 years ago.

The G3 has always been a piece of junk. THe ERs from 3 or so years ago were pieces of junk. I agree with you. Needlwheels/Meshwheels today are a different story.

[Johan Susanto]

nw dart spec review:

capability 300g-800g + system
airflow 2500+ lph
waterflow 400-600 gph

is this spec enough for my 300g+ sps tank??