Solomon Island zoanthids just a little talk-no pics

[geoxman]

This is not another typical zoa thread where people are showing their corals.

I have been keeping Solomon zoos for some time now and they seem to be the most finicky of all of the zoos. They are effected by the pox the most, they fade the most, they melt the most, and they are the some of the hardest to keep VS polyps from other places. Why is that?? I have about an 80 success rate with them which is WAY better than most!

Over the years I have found that much higher light is needed for these . I do not know if it has something to do with the depth of the islands, but when I went a number of years back the waters between each island was very shallow-maybe 15 feet at max, from what I remember?? I was not keeping a SW tank then.

I would be interested to know what other success stories their are on Solomon zoanthids. Please only respond if you have them for over 3 months in your tank. ie..
1. What lighting and how deep do you keep them? Most of mine are less than 4 inches under the water under (2) 250 PFO Phoenix 14k
2. What are the tank parameters-mainly Alk and Nitrate? I keep mine at about 20-30 Nitrate 11 dkh
3. Flow does not really matter to me because they are very tight shallow polyps and can take most anything, but I would like to hear!
4. What is you coral feeding like? I feed a multitude of homemade foods.
5. Has there been a drastic color shift? If so what color zoos and when did it happen? Was it for the better? I have great luck with most colors if kept up high. Even blue??
6. Do your Solomon polyps seem to get infected with disease more than other Indo polyps? pocks melting etc..


Thanks all and good luck with your reef!

[MUCHO REEF]

I'm standing and applauding you for asking this question. It is an excellent question and I am glad to see such an in depth concern.

The hardiest of Zoanthids and Palythoas, and their adaptability in our ecosystems is often confused with, "hey, just put them all together in your tank, give them light and current and they'll grow". This is not always true. Everyone of us has experienced a colony or frag that simply won't grow. I've followed the thread on the Envy Oranges, which I don't envy at all, and it details many accounts of their rarity and their inability to reproduce. I don't know what region they are from and I'm not a betting man, but if one truly researched their zones of collection extensively, and made specific attempts to replicate that environment, you would see the growth that so many are lacking.

OK, back to your question. The polyps we collect are found and collect in so many reefing zones around the world. From the Caribbean to Africa, from Figi to the Pacific and most recently those from Australia. It is seldom if ever discussed, but it is nearly impossible to duplicate these regional requirements in our captive systems to match the specific regional parameters of ( ALL of our colonies) that they were collected from and use to. You will easily find shallow water collections near the shore as well as those deeper water polyps at nearly 70 feet. Variations in water current have been well documented and there is proof that those that are collected from milder moderate currents, will fair even better in captivity with an increase in current. It is nearly impossible to keep every colony from so many depths, diverse regions and varying types of current completely happy. With a water depth of 19 inches and dual 250 watt DE 14 k lighting, I'm really not that concerned with placement in my tank. As long as they are exposed and not hidden under a ledge, I'm not too concerned.


The shallow water zoanthids from the Solomon's could very well need more specific requirements to sustain them in captivity. I've had a few issues with them but I have found that stronger lighting was what they needed most in my tank. When I upgraded to MH a year ago, my collection of Solomon polyps never looked better. Was it the MH's? Don't know. Was it the overall increase in PAR and illumination? I think so. Can I prove it? NO.

I think trying to slowly adjust your parameters and tank temperatures to see how the totality of your tanks appears might be the trick. I said, MIGHT, LOL. I've kept mine under the exact same lighting as you have and I am very pleased.

My trates are nearly 0-10 and my dkh is 9.

I think random or oscillating flow is better in any enclosed system. I try to shoot for medium to slightly higher flow throughout my entire tank, keeping in mind those colonies which can not tolerate the higher flow and placing them in the appropriate spot.

I feed Coral Frenzy, some green water periodically and a little ground mysis as this covers everything in my tank. I don't do any target feeding. Since they are photosynthetic, I try to keep my feeding minimal.

I try to keep all shallow water collected frags and colonies exposed to as much lighting as possible to prevent any possible bleaching or color shift.

I truly believe that zoa pox somehow is related to stress. The only time I have ever seen it is when I have moved a colony for some reason, or when I have unfortunately done something drastic in my tank, which is seldom. The last time I had it, I did a water change and left them alone, and it went away on its own. There was another time I had it, I dipped it and it still succumbed.

I know I have babbled a long time, but I think finding a happy equilibrium with tank temp, salinity, brighter lighting, persistently documenting all parameters and any fluctuations, will yield the answers we all strive for in keeping Solomon Island Zoanthids.

Mucho Reef


PS, thanks again Geo for a great question. We would love to hear from as many reefers as possible on this subject.

[Ursus]

I'm still new to zoanthids so I can't really compare Solomon Isle colonies to others I have, but I have had no problems with the three colonies I got from Solomon. I bought two colonies as soon as they got unpacked from the boxes at my LFS. They weren't open all the way at the time, but I soon found the larger frag had two different varieties on it. I just threw them in and they've had good growth and no sign of disease or parasites. I've had them since January.

Lighting is 6 x 54 watt T5 HO's. My bulbs are about two years old.... so yeah, I really need some new ones. Both colonies are about 16" below the surface and 19" from the light.

My nitrates are below 10 usually, but I let the tank go this month and they got up to 30. Need to test alk again as im unsure.

Approx. 45x turnover rate.

I don't feed my corals so whatever they get is left overs from my ten fish that I feed lightly.

As for color shifts, I haven't experienced any, but maybe when I get new bulbs I can report back.

I'm not sure where my other colonies came from, but I did notice that they all experienced a lot of growth this past month which I think is a result of my tank being reaallllll dirty. Even my eagle eyes exploded with growth which im happy about.

Sorry I can't help more.

[DEEC77]

Interesting question. I have never really had a problem with my Solomn Island zoanthids. Carribean's seem to give me of problems. Back to your question.

I use 250 watt MH and mine are located around the tank at verying depths but all are fully exposed.
nitrates btween 0-10 dk is 9
I feed cyclopezes (sp?) about once a week and I blow off the rocks twice a week.
I've had no color change even the ones closer to the bottom have kept their color.
No melting-no zoa pox. I do belive that stress is one of the main cause if melting -I've never had zoa pox. I'm a firm believer in once you put the zoa in the tank don't mess with them. I've had zoanthids I thought were gonners only to have them reappair after time.

Great question hope this helps.

~Dee~

[Dr. Mac]

I have been to the Solomons and collected zoos there along side native collectors.

The area where they come from is in one relatively small location just a few feet from the beach in an area where raw sewage can enter the water. They are found everywhere in this location covering the rocks for miles in every direction and are only a few inches to no more than a few feet below the surface, as a matter of fact in this area there are very few found below about 5-10 feet. Large sections can be left out of the water at low tide and waves crash on the colonies constantly. The rocks in this area are covered in hair algae and other macro algae--those that get these colonies direct from the Solomons will often see the colonies are covered in silt and algae. Algae blennies are common in the area, other corals growing in this area are Acropora and Pocillopora, both not so colorful in this area.

When the zoo colonies are cut from the rock often the new exposed rock on the base is black with anaerobic bacteria and all types of worms and other critters. These colonies are held for a relatively short period prior to shipment to the US. The colonies are held in shallow tubs under diffused natural sunlight with minimal water flow.

Upon arrival in the US I always dip them in freshwater for about 10 minutes and then saltwater with Tropic Marin Pro Coral Cure. Usually on a weekly to monthly basis I will import 50-100 4-6 inch colonies. Unlike zoos colledted from other parts of the world, these colonies are sort of shaved off the rocks rather than whole chucks of rock with some zoos on it such as those shipped from Fiji or Bali. Most colonies have an assortment of pests and hitchhikers that fall off in the dips. I then keep them in a shallow vat with intense direct water flow and lots of large Turbo and other assorted snails for 1-2 weeks before doing anything further with them. This works very well in preventing fungal infections and other common problems with these zoos.

Overall, I think the Solomon Island zoos are collected and handled well and the native folks work hard to get us some awesome corals and overall do a great job. They handle lots of different types of corals in volumes, so individual care for each individual colony is not practical, but overall they do a excellent job. Having attempted collecting them myself I can tell you it is difficult. The variety of colors is incredible and blues, reds, and pinks found regularly in this area with most colonies having a mix of colors, multi colored colonies with tightly packed polyps are typical for Solomon zoos.

So, the area where Solomon zoos we get in this country are collected from is a specific shallow tidal pool with intense tropical sunlight, very intense regular wave water flow, high nutrient murky water, the colonies can often be covered in algae and there are relatively few fish in the area so some pests can be allowed to flourish in these colonies growing with tightly packed polyps. I was diving in many other areas in the Solomons and never found zoos in any other areas this leads one to believe that they do need these specific conditions to thrive in the wild.

Growing in this environment explains how hardy these corals can be, but also may explain why some don't do well in certain captive conditions. In my facility I have one SPS system and one soft coral system, the water in the SPS system is more pristine and the zoos definitely do not do as well in that system. This is an observation based upon several years and many hundreds of colonies, not specific individual pieces, ie. these corals are quite adaptable and individual colonies can do exceptionally well under a wide variety of conditions. Someone here will likely say they have some thriving zoos in their SPS dominated tank, but this may not be the general rule for these corals. Colors will fade without intense lighting IME. IMO the most ideal captive environment for these corals is a less heavily skimmed tank that is fed well regularly with very intense lighting and water flow. Definitely most of these corals are sold under the idea that they do well under less lighting and water flow, some colonies can adapt, buy IME to thrive in terms of maximum genetic potential growth and color they will not do their best under low flow and light and too pristine water quality.

[AIMFish]

Nice thread! I'll admit I usually prefer to just relax and glance at some pics but this thread was a really good ready. The majority of my zoo's are about 4" from the surface and the 4-54w t5's are about 4-5 " from that. Currently there is only a turbofloater on the system and algae is doing well! From Dr Mac's post I can tell people that the algae is there to better simulate natural conditions!! I'm moving my tanks so I can access them better and will start spending more time w/ them and can monitor growth rates better.

[ct_vol]

Great topic geo...

I've had Soloman's for a bit over a year... I agree that they are some of the most finicky of zoanthids... IMO they LOVE light and like pretty high flow as well... I used to keep them in my SPS tank, but they didn't fair as well, as Dr. Mac mentioned... I found they did better in my 75g Zoa dominated tank... However, even in that tank, they aren't as content as I'd like them to be... It seems that they will grow REALLY fast and then recede... Then grow back again... When I had problems with them fading away in my SPS tank, I would take them out and dip them in TMPCC and then they would recover... Since moving them to the 75g I've just left them in there to see what would happen, and they would recede about half way through the entire colony, and then after a couple weeks they would grow back and fill in the gaps they'd left and spread out even more... I've thought about fragging more frequently, so they don't get as crowded... I think this might help... I've just been too busy/lazy to do it...

Oh, on my 75g I have 8 x 54w T5HO's (2x10k, 3x420nm, 3x460nm)... The nitrates are somewhere between 10-25 ppm... I don't feed my corals in that tank, but I feed my fish mysis and cyclopeeze... (the tank is heavily stocked w/fish) And my Alk is about 11dkh... I keep the Solomans in the top half of my tank... From a couple inches from the surface to about 6 inches deep...

[bobafett]

I don't seem to have a problem with Solomans (or most zoos for that matter) but I can't keep paly's alive for more than a year. I have had several different types and no matter what I do they melt away either immediately or they seem to thrive for about a year and then suddenly melt away. On the otherhand as far as Zoa Pox is concerned, I used to get it when I dripped Kalk into my tank. I have stopped dripping Kalk for over a year and use an MTC calcium reactor. I have not had a trace of the Zoa Pox since (may be just a coincidence).

[melev]

I need to read up on this Zoa Pox you mentioned, as that is a new one to me.

Can anyone post a few pictures of zoanthids from the Solomon Islands? I've got all kinds in my tank, but have no idea of their origin. I tend to get them from local reefers, so they are all "made in the U.S.A."

These are what I've called Bytor Oranges for years. And they LOVE light and tons of flow:


They were slow growers and didn't do well when placed in other tanks as I continued to try to frag and share them with locals. Only recently I had a huge SPS die in my reef, and I ended up with about 20 frags that I shared with a bunch of DFWMAS members. I need to see how they did.

bobafett, I've found that zoas are sensitive to salinity, and the higher the salinity the more they close up and wither away. This happens with lowered salinity of course, but usually if the tank is 1.028sg, you'll see zoas shut down tight. Double check your readings and get a LFS to verify that your numbers are accurate.

[geoxman]

WOW some great info! As most of you might know my tank is almost all zoanthids and I am always looking to improve their life.

Dr. Mac that is very interesting information on the raw sewage and the wild colonies! The over exposure to high nutrients could very well explain their high coloration from the wild as well as a loss of color in our closed low nutrient systems.
Just being able to see a field of zoanthids that spread for miles each direction must be rather breath taking!! I can only imagine.

Ct-Vol Have you experienced the receding/finicky behavior with Indo/Fiji polyps? I have not and it was one of the reasons for the post.

I have noticed that Caribbean polyps like lower temp, but that is another subject.

Bobafett-that is very strange indeed about the palys?? They seem to be the hardiest of all of my polyps. Can you explain your system a little more as far as a comparison as to why your Solomon's do so well and your palys do not. There might be a happy medium between some of these closed systems and other info would be great!

Melev, those appear to be from Fiji and are quite spectacular! Most Solomon zoanthids are smaller polyps, than your pic, and are very colorful, both from the wild and in captivity. I will post some pics later.
That is a very interesting point on the salinity, I am at 1.026.

You can find info about zoa pox on zoaid.com under articles. For some reason I only ever have problems with this when the Summer hits, almost like a zoo ich?? The temp does not change much but that is when I get it? It usually only effects my Solomon colonies though, most other colonies remain uneffected.

Thanks all for the great information and I would also like to hear more.

[melev]

If there is a thread about how to figure out where zoanthids come from (Solomon, Fiji, fill-in-the-blank....) please point me that way. I love the variety of ones I have, but I've never tried to figure out where they hail from. I'd love to see those pictures, geoxman - be sure to label their origins so we can learn more.

I could post pictures of each of the zoanthid colonies I have in a new thread and we could work from that perhaps. (Sorry to wander off topic.)

[ct_vol]

Originally posted by geoxman
Ct-Vol Have you experienced the receding/finicky behavior with Indo/Fiji polyps? I have not and it was one of the reasons for the post.

I have noticed that Caribbean polyps like lower temp, but that is another subject.

No, I find that the Indo/Fiji polyps are the hardiest of them all... Everyonce in a while, they might spend a few hours closed up if I mess with my water chemistry, but they'll usually open right back up...

Since the Solomans always openned right back up after dipping them in TMPCC, I thought about starting to dose Iodine... That isn't something I do right now, because I hear it can really mess up your tank if you over do it... What does everyone else think about that???

Carribeans definately like lower temps... I was out of town and my timer decided to quit working, so my lights stayed on 24/7 untill I got home... The tank was at 88.7 degrees... All my Carribeans melted... Luckily it was in my SPS tank, so I only had one small colony in there... I also consider myself lucky in that it was my only casualty...

[geoxman]

Since the Solomans always opened right back up after dipping them in TMPCC, I thought about starting to dose Iodine... That isn't something I do right now, because I hear it can really mess up your tank if you over do it... What does everyone else think about that???

Interesting observation! I also concur with you on the Indo/Fiji polyps---but why is that? They are pretty close genetically, so why are they more stubborn?? ie.. receding and fading? How deep and do the Indonesian, Fiji polyps get the nutrients that Solomon's do?

Melev I will try and get pics of some of the different Solomon zoanthids that I have-up this weekend. You can usually tell by the polyp size, mat, and color. JMHO

There is no real guide line as to what morph comes from where-I only know from experience and shopping, but zoanthid origin might be another great thread idea. I see red Eagle eyes coming from Indo stuff I buy, while you only see orange EE out of Fiji for the most part?? I do not want to take this off topic so that will be another thread.

[ct_vol]

Well, like I said, I used to have my Solomans in my SPS tank, because I knew they liked intense light... However they would recede and wither more often than after I'd moved them to the zoa tank... But as stated before if I dipped them in TMPCC they would come right back... The reason I moved them to my 75g is because they are easier to access since I don't have as much lighting in the way of reaching into the tank... (I need to redesign my canopy) But since they don't do fantastic in either system, and there isn't much in common with the two systems, I'm thinking that the Solomans are missing some trace element that isn't in the water... Just a hypothesis... I'll check it out and get back to you...

Anyone know how much Iodine to dose in a 75g???

[bobafett]

My setup is quite simple. I basically have a 125 gal with about a 2" sand bed and I have no clue how many pounds of live rock I have. I use three 250W Radium bulbs and two 65W PC actinics. The lights are placed about a foot over the tank. As far as filtration goes I use a 55 gal tank that is half live rock and half calerpa. I also have an MTC calcium reactor and an MTC protein skimmer and a chiller for the hot summer months and a heater for the winter (both run through a temp controller). That is it for equipment.

As far as tank parameters go:

PH = 8.3
Salinity = 1.022 - 1.024
Temp = 77-79

Nitrates & Phosphates = 0

Like I said earlier I used to drip Kalk as replacement water but I believe the calcium would eventually build up in the zoas because after a certain point I would see the zoa pox form and some zoos looked like they would shrivel up.

[trottman]

both the blue ones and the copper ones are solomons. they started off real slow. But, after my tank crashed due to a cracked power head in which copper was exposed to the tank water, the solomons went crazy. since then they have been growing just as fast as all other zoos.

[geoxman]

It has been a while and I would like some of the newer zoa keepers to post on their success with Solomon zoanthids.
ct_vol was onto something-I switched to 0.10-0.12 mg/l Iodine dosing over the past 5 months and they are keeping very happy. I also switched to skimming only 1-2 days out of the week and nothing has suffered.
I would just like to hear some of the new blood on this board's opinions. TIA
PL

[mixed_reefer]

I have a bunch of zoos but i dont know where any of them come from. How can you tell?

[geoxman]

mixed_reefer it is just from years of collecting them and owning them. Most of our LFS in STL usually get get in INDO or CPE has a lock up on Fiji stuff as they are part owner of WS. Most of the Solomon zoos are very bright, tight polyps, and smaller. You can PM me with your # and since you are local I will gladly give you a buzz. Nice to have you in STL and on this board. good luck!

[MUCHO REEF]

Hey Geo, it would be great if you could post a few of those Solomon zoas to give everyone an idea what they look like my friend. Or, if you have a link to the web with some pics. Glad you resurrected this thread.

Mucho

[geoxman]

Mucho my man, you and I are in the same boat-as neither of us have a digital camera. I will get my fathers camera on Sat and try to shoot some pics of my Solomon zoos.
Is it OK if I post some pictures from zoaid on here? JLMK
PL

[Flybynight]

I just found out I have ID: Blowpop
Original Namer: imnotsure
Origin: Solomon Isls

They are growing like crazy. I got them from a lady who had a tank and they where almost all dead. I think the trick is I dose Idione. These guys grow from the top of my tank to the bottom. Places with no flow to places with alot of flow. The only coral I have not been able to keep is a Elgance. I got it as one of my first corals. The guy said I could grow it no problem. I had some PCs at the time. Every other coral I have ever had has just taken off.

[chris0942]

tag along to keep alive

[geoxman]

chris0942. I really need to address some problems but I have to get up early and I will get back tomorrow night with some new info. Thanks for the bump as they need some help in surviving long term in a reef. IMHO
PL

I would love yo see your set up! you can PM if you like

[ct_vol]

Originally posted by geoxman

ct_vol was onto something-I switched to 0.10-0.12 mg/l Iodine dosing over the past 5 months and they are keeping very happy.

Good deal... Mine have stayed happy as well... I was surprised to see this thread bumped back up... I haven't been checking this forum much in the past few months... Glad everyone is doing well...