Kong's Restored BB (90g)

[pito]

I've read some BB guys, if set up right, getting away with 5% water changes every couple of months

[Trigeek]

I'm with you on the whole "open minded" thing. The BB v DSB debates are ridiculous because both can work with proper management. I'm running a DSB, so following someone with a BB will be great for me. Who knows, maybe someday I'll go the way of BB (or even a reverse UGF like Paul B. runs!!) and having some experience, though vicarious, will prove to be very helpful I'm sure!! This hobby isn't a pi$%^ng contest for me. Although my way is working for me, other methods are very intriguing and I really enjoy following others in their journeys. I've enjoyed following melev's thread and Paul B.'s thread because they share everything, not just their best pics/times. Any system has its challenges and it's helpful to know how others have tackled 'em.

[Joe]

Kong, very nice!!! I'm going BB as well for my 120 gallon, and was toying with the idea of just placing my rock directly on the glass bottom. Other than rockslides cracking the glass, why would I need starboard?

Thanks,

Joe

[Dubbin1]

Originally posted by King-Kong
You mean the before with all the hair algae?

I mean the one where it had all of the rock work. Now it just looks like a fancy frag tank. Don't get me wrong, the corals are AMAZING but I personally don't like the way it looks now. Of course its YOUR tank so it doesn't matter a lick what I think

[plyle02]

Kong,
Here is my recently re-scaped pics. I like the true bb approach, and will be there soon. Thanks again, any advice or feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Perry

These pics taken today, 2 days after the new scaping. Thanks Kong for the nudge(LR removal)






Here is what my tank looked like a few days before LR removal, and all other non-sps corals. I really like the open space now, and will probably remove about another 20lbs or more with in the next coming months, as my corals fill out........

[pito]

Me likes the new scape Perry. You might wanna change your flow a bit as it looks like you got a lot of stuff settled on the bottom still.

[MountainReef]

I dont know much about the specifics of BB tanks but not having any substrate isn't it important to have more rockwork in order to colonize sufficient beneficial bacteria growth?

It looks really nice I am only wondering how long it will sustain itself without a crazy amount of water changes?

[Froggy]

Originally posted by MountainReef
I dont know much about the specifics of BB tanks but not having any substrate isn't it important to have more rockwork in order to colonize sufficient beneficial bacteria growth?

It looks really nice I am only wondering how long it will sustain itself without a crazy amount of water changes?

It is my understanding that minimal rock in a BB tank is beneficial as it allows for proper circulation. Set up that way with HEAVY flow to keep detritus in suspension to be removed by the skimmer. Rocks piled up will only build up detritus etc. over time. BB tanks also use large oversized skimmers to remove organics in the water before they are broken down. Any settling ( should be minimal if flow is set up correctly) can be syphoned out as part of regular maintenance.

I do not currently run a BB tank but am considering it when I upgrade my 75 to a larger tank so BB experts please correct me if my info is wrong. I am still learning the approach before I apply it to the new tank in the future.

[King-Kong]

Originally posted by Joe
Kong, very nice!!! I'm going BB as well for my 120 gallon, and was toying with the idea of just placing my rock directly on the glass bottom. Other than rockslides cracking the glass, why would I need starboard?

Thanks,

Joe

Starboard or a cutting board material only does 1, maybe 2 things, that I can think of:

1) protects the glass (but most tanks have tempered bottoms, and would require a lot of force to break)

2) reflect some light back up towards the underneath of corals.

oh.. and a third reason, which was mostly why I did it... while im busy looking at my fish and corals, I like having a white bottom


Going with just glass, however, will allow you to keep the bottom in pristine condition.

[King-Kong]

Originally posted by Dubbin1
I mean the one where it had all of the rock work. Now it just looks like a fancy frag tank. Don't get me wrong, the corals are AMAZING but I personally don't like the way it looks now. Of course its YOUR tank so it doesn't matter a lick what I think

I dont know.. I've seen a lot of frag tanks in my day, and I've never seen any that came close to looking like this. I think if you saw it in person, you'd change your tune a bit

[King-Kong]

Originally posted by plyle02
Kong,
Here is my recently re-scaped pics. I like the true bb approach, and will be there soon. Thanks again, any advice or feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Perry

These pics taken today, 2 days after the new scaping. Thanks Kong for the nudge(LR removal)






Here is what my tank looked like a few days before LR removal, and all other non-sps corals. I really like the open space now, and will probably remove about another 20lbs or more with in the next coming months, as my corals fill out........

..wow... the new style looks awesome. You see, this is what im talking about with rock layout. You took a layout that before didnt draw the eye in any particular direction. That seemed more like the fruit stand look. Then, you created character. You created channels and paths.

To me, this look more natural. This looks more like a reef with character. The kind of reef that when you're seeing it first hand stands out in your memory as unique.

I also like the dark color on your corals.. be sure to keep your bioload up and skimming efficient so you can maintain the good coloration on them (all in balance with how much light you give them). So many times we see BB tanks where the corals turn pastel and lose their coloration because theyre starving.

Honestly, the only thing I would suggest is to keep working on your flow, and see (money permitting), you can find a way of consolidating some of those power heads so that you have less, with more flow. I'm not a fan of having to look at powerheads (no matter who makes them).

The funny thing is, so many people think tank with fewer rock (whether theyre BB or not) unnatural, but I find it to be the reverse! I think original rock layouts with minimal amounts appear far more natural to me than fruit stands!

[King-Kong]

Originally posted by MountainReef
I dont know much about the specifics of BB tanks but not having any substrate isn't it important to have more rockwork in order to colonize sufficient beneficial bacteria growth?

It looks really nice I am only wondering how long it will sustain itself without a crazy amount of water changes?

Well, you can start counting now. Let's see how long I go without a W/C. Last one was Sunday.. did a biggie (20%) since I had just removed a lot of rock.

So far, all clams / SPSs are happy

Joking aside, we need a lot less rock than most hobby literature and fish store experts would lead us to believe.

Infact, I can show you a 92g SPS forrest with about 25lbs of live rock (I think about that much), and 20+ fish that looks just as good as most Tanks Of The Month. http://tinyurl.com/yqztxx

[King-Kong]

Originally posted by Froggy
It is my understanding that minimal rock in a BB tank is beneficial as it allows for proper circulation. Set up that way with HEAVY flow to keep detritus in suspension to be removed by the skimmer. Rocks piled up will only build up detritus etc. over time. BB tanks also use large oversized skimmers to remove organics in the water before they are broken down. Any settling ( should be minimal if flow is set up correctly) can be syphoned out as part of regular maintenance.

I do not currently run a BB tank but am considering it when I upgrade my 75 to a larger tank so BB experts please correct me if my info is wrong. I am still learning the approach before I apply it to the new tank in the future.

Sounds perfect! That's the gist of the export mechanism. Just remember we also import a lot by having lots of fish and/or feeding our fish a ton.

[Froggy]

Originally posted by King-Kong
..wow... the new style looks awesome. You see, this is what im talking about with rock layout. You took a layout that before didnt draw the eye in any particular direction. That seemed more like the fruit stand look. Then, you created character. You created channels and paths.

To me, this look more natural. This looks more like a reef with character. The kind of reef that when you're seeing it first hand stands out in your memory as unique.

I also like the dark color on your corals.. be sure to keep your bioload up and skimming efficient so you can maintain the good coloration on them (all in balance with how much light you give them). So many times we see BB tanks where the corals turn pastel and lose their coloration because theyre starving.

Honestly, the only thing I would suggest is to keep working on your flow, and see (money permitting), you can find a way of consolidating some of those power heads so that you have less, with more flow. I'm not a fan of having to look at powerheads (no matter who makes them).

The funny thing is, so many people think tank with fewer rock (whether theyre BB or not) unnatural, but I find it to be the reverse! I think original rock layouts with minimal amounts appear far more natural to me than fruit stands!

I couldn't agree more Kong. I am a big fan of less is more with the rock approach. I love seeing tanks with open spaces an channels betwen the rockscape and I even use this appprach on my tank with sand. I think it adds a lot more character.

[nsreefer]

It looks terrible....put some sand in there!!!!

I'm kidding, tank looks great!

[King-Kong]

Originally posted by Froggy
I couldn't agree more Kong. I am a big fan of less is more with the rock approach. I love seeing tanks with open spaces an channels betwen the rockscape and I even use this appprach on my tank with sand. I think it adds a lot more character.

Exactly.. to me, the arguement doesnt bring into play whether youve got sand or not. Just stop piling all that rock in there and make something with character!

[pito]

Originally posted by King-Kong
Starboard or a cutting board material only does 1, maybe 2 things, that I can think of:

1) protects the glass (but most tanks have tempered bottoms, and would require a lot of force to break)

2) reflect some light back up towards the underneath of corals.

oh.. and a third reason, which was mostly why I did it... while im busy looking at my fish and corals, I like having a white bottom


Going with just glass, however, will allow you to keep the bottom in pristine condition.

Points 2&3 are kinda null as most everyones starboard gets covered in coraline algea over time. Unless someone figured out how to stop it from growing there. I hear scrapping starboard is dang near impossable.

And I love leo's tank. I think he feeds Pappone

[King-Kong]

Pito: exactly.. eventually it gets covered anyways.. but that's why I have a longspine urchin :P

[pito]

Hey man Who the h3!! is Pita? It's Pito man. P-I-T-O

LOL..........

[King-Kong]

its a miracle it took me so long to type that and not fix it.. cause it's so hard not to!.. lol... sorry!

[pito]

As far as the longspine urchin goes, do you think it'll be able to keep up.

[King-Kong]

He was making a lot of progres on my old boards, before I pulled them. They are pretty impressive at eating away algaes.

If he cant catch up, ill just get more

[pito]

I'll have to look into those lil buggers as I hate coraline

[plyle02]

Kong,
Thanks.... The open look is so much more appealing, and I think helps the corals stand out, instead of seeing them all mashed together on one reef. Incidentally, it has made for more peace in the tank between fish, alot less fussing with one another. I feed very aggresively to a rather large fish population. I also supplemental feed my sps with DT's Oyster Eggs, Cyclopeeze, Aminos, and my refugium gets a nice shot of Phyto every 4-5 days. I think the refugium has helped to bring in some darker colors, maybe some additional micro feedings. As far as the statement of sand goes, it seems to me that if you are removing nutrients through skimming, than they are gone, instead of trapped in a sandbed or on the LR. I believe this is why it is so important to use large powerful skimmers when running a BB tank. Kong, I will update you as I continue to move forward with my SPS garden.....LOL... Thanks again..... BTW, I think it is important for me to mention that I value and respect all other approaches to such an awesome hobby....

[plyle02]

Originally posted by pito
I'll have to look into those lil buggers as I hate coraline

They do eat lots of corraline. I have one right now, but as you would figure, he has always gone for the LR. However, now that I am eliminating more LR, maybe he will work on the bottom....LOL....