Are engineer gobies good or bad for DSB's

kenbennedy · #1 08/02/2006, 07:08 PM

I am personally drawn to the aesthetics of a DSB over anything less than 3" deep, and am setting up my 90gal. My opinion of myself at the moment is that I am up to caring for a DSB, but am not sure how the Engineer Gobies might treat it. Will they gobble up all the critters necessary to help the sand bed be productive? My initial opinion is that they will churn the top layer of sand so readily that it will not be able to accumulate much in the way of detritus. I am not sure, however if this is in general a cooperative combination or a detrimental pair. If someone could chime in and help me out I would be grateful.

BK

LFS_worker · #2 08/02/2006, 07:59 PM

according to R. shimmek gobies and borrowing fish are one of the worst things you can add to a DSB..

Brian

kenbennedy · #3 08/02/2006, 08:11 PM

Is there somewhere you can point me where I might find that particular article or thread?

I guess I would rather have the engineer goby, but would want it to have enough sand to be happy. Any hints? I want it to have enough sand to lay in and enough sand to help with biological filtration, but maybe that just isnt possible.

Some more info/discussion would be fantastic.

BK

LFS_worker · #4 08/02/2006, 10:04 PM

here you go :

"Sand Bed Secrets" the common-sense way to biological filtration
br Dr. Ron Shimek

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/096...lance&n=283155
I highly recommend this book ...

Brian

kenbennedy · #5 08/02/2006, 10:11 PM

Super, perhaps I should start a new thread then, exploring ways to make the engineer goby happy, but is there a happy medium between biological filtration with sand and a good habitat for the goby?

Or, will the goby interact with the sand bed in such a way as to cause harm to the reef, assuming I have sufficient live rock for filtration, or can I just have a lot of sand there for him to play in.... Id just as soon keep a couple of inches of sand to make him happy, unless that makes for a negative impact in the tank. Thoughts?

BK

sufunk · #6 08/02/2006, 10:32 PM

As far as i know, an engineer goby/convict blenny will NOT "gobble" up beneficial critters from the sand bed. They dont feed from the sand, i dont believe.
They don't "churn" the top layer of sand repeatedly like say a diamond goby would. An engineer will dig under your liverock and try to make tunnels under it thus moving some sand but this is not constant. My engineer may go weeks or longer without disturbing any sand at all or making any new tunnels.

kenbennedy · #7 08/03/2006, 06:17 AM

So is it your opinion then that my sand bed or deep sand bed would still function abpproximately the same as though the engineer goby wasnt there? I could buy that if he only disturbs parts of the sand bed every so often, and leaves parts of the sandbed at peace for a while....

Thoughts?

EnderG60 · #8 08/03/2006, 06:48 AM

if you have an established DSB then yeah it will disrupt things for a while.

Mine spends about 2 weeks digging tunnels after i rearrange stuff, but after that he pretty much stops digging.

Once they stop making the tunnels I dont see it being a problem anymore.

Cruella · #9 08/03/2006, 07:08 AM

mine only digs behind the rocks. he never bothers anyone

kenbennedy · #10 08/03/2006, 07:40 AM

Well I will be starting this DSB from thr ground up, hopefully with the engineer gobies in there from the start. Can I safely believe that they will come into balance with each other, and I will not have some overall negative impact from the pair? I can accept my DSB having less than optimal "filtering capacity", as long as the gobies don perpetually turn up nasty stuff from the bottom of the bed. Might that be a problem?

Thanks in advance.

bureau13 · #11 08/03/2006, 03:59 PM

I personally don't understand why a diamond goby would disturb a DSB, unless they act differently than the one I used to have. That guy would just sit and sift the very top layer of sand. All the "good stuff" in a DSP happens well below that. It seems to me that something like an engineer goby which does actually burrow deeper would be more likely to disturb pockets of nastiness.

jds

kenbennedy · #12 08/04/2006, 06:19 AM

What if he burrows regularly, churning the bed. Would it be reasonable to guess that there wouldnt be as much time for nasty pockets to develop before he finds them or turns them up?

I realize it wont really be a dsb any more, but what Im really after is the engineer gobies and having plenty of sand for them to play with. Maybe a better question is how much sand can I put in the tank for the engineer gobies before it becomes a problem?

NorthernCF · #13 08/05/2006, 11:30 PM

I don't have a DSB, but I do have an EG. 8". It is awesome. It's swimming patter is unlike any other fish I have seen. Some character (not quite a bleeny, but close). And when it decides to gobble, it will eat something 2x the time its head (not necessarily effectively, LOL, I just had an acro crab fight its way out of his maw).

very cool non-aggressive fish!

salty joe · #14 08/06/2006, 06:40 AM

Any problems with EG spitting sand on corals?

NorthernCF · #15 08/06/2006, 09:21 AM

I don't do sand in the display

They way he eats, I could see that as a problem though.
He mauls the food, spits it out, mauls the food, spits it out. I could imagine indiscriminate sand spiting. In some systems that could be an annoyance. Once again, I am just imagining, I do not have the experience.

pargolf · #16 08/07/2006, 06:08 AM

I had an eg in a 150 which was a great fish which never bothered anything. He constantly rearrange the sandbed though. I finally gave him away after he reached 10+ inches.

Chupakabra-King · #17 08/07/2006, 09:23 AM

WOW 10+ inches ?!?!?!?!

I got 2 ofem in my 110 , and they are about 4 inches now . I hope they dont grow much more or out they will come !

kenbennedy · #18 08/07/2006, 09:34 AM

so does anyone have any advice as to my question... how much sand might I safely keep in my display for the engineer gobies? After what point (if any) will the combination give my tank problems?

Chupakabra-King · #19 08/07/2006, 10:22 AM

I have a DSB in my aquarium with two EGs. They have only dug underneath the rocks and nowhere else. IME you will be fine no matter how deep a sandbed you have . Once they have made themselves a home they pretty much stop digging .

I would go with a 3 inch sandbed for a SSB and a 6" sandbed for a DSB . Just my .0000002

kenbennedy · #20 08/07/2006, 10:38 AM

Super, and thanks to all. I think my plan will then be to incorporate the gobies into the tank while the sand bed is as young as possible. It seems from everyone's responses that the gobies tend to dig more just after you re-arrange stuff. I guess what Ill do from here is settle on a substrate depth. Thanks again.

Chupakabra-King · #21 08/07/2006, 01:35 PM

That sounds like a good plan to me !

Good Luck with your tank !

Chupakabra-King · #22 08/07/2006, 01:38 PM

Double Post !

kenbennedy · #23 08/07/2006, 01:42 PM

Thanks, Ill get some more details and pictures up when I get the tank filled and "populated;" Im not going to get any engineer gobies until I move the LR from the 30 gal to the 90 gal.