Help Sick Maroon Clown

[marmari]

Our clownfish Lori has been sick for about a week. Looked like dying, didn't eat(still doesn't eat), when I put her into a Quarantene. I must mention, that within last week, I suddenly lost 3 fishes, most likely to some disease. As you can see on the picture there's some whitish big spot(not ich) shaped like a line, on her side. I am relieved to see that it's been improving a bit, after I started her on copper(cupramine by seachem) and aloe stress coat, and a bit of garlic extract by seachem. I've added a little bit of cyclopeze to the water and I've no idea if she ate any, I have a friendly Chromis damsel in with her who obviously couldn't ignore a treat. She refuses solids, tried bloodworms. If you look at her stripe, there's obviously something going on there! Some grain like growth? Please refer to the picture.
Please, please help save her life, she's been so brave fighting this, and I refuse to give up on her. What is this that she has? Anyone? Please, what can it be and what medicine will I need?
Thanks a lot!

[leebca]

I can't see what you're seeing from the photo. The fish isn't 'close enough.' Can you try another photo for us?

More information would be helpful. Would you care to provide the following information? Be thorough if you try!

How old is your tank? When did it originally cycle?
What kind of system do you have (tank volume, dimensions, bio-filtration method, the equipment you use, any carbon or other chemical filtration, kind of substrate, etc.).
List all specimens & sizes in the tank (fish, inverts, corals, clams, snails, crabs, shrimp, etc.).
If you have a refugium and/or sump, what is living in it?
Do you use a quarantine tank and procedure?
Foods you use and feeding schedules.
How long have you had this fish? If the fish was recently acquired (4 weeks), two more questions: Did you treat it or give it a dip before it went into the aquarium? How did you acclimate it – what procedure?
Do you use any vitamins? Fat additives? Any elemental or other additives? Please list all.
Chemistries – please give actual numbers (Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, Phosphate, Silica, Ca, Alk., and any others you have)
Water parameters – please give actual numbers (pH and your pH range, salinity or sp. gr. & range, temperature range)
Do you see any of the following in your system: hair algae; micro algae; cyanobacteria growths (red slime algae); dinoflagellate (zooxanthellae) growths; brown algae; diatom growth; slimes; off-colored patches on rock or substrate that are not coralline; etc.?
Water changes (how much and how often).
List what you added or taken out of your aquarium system (living, decorations, and equipment) during the past 6 weeks.
Maintenance schedule. What have you done lately?
Regarding the diseased fishes. . .What were they? How long did you have them? Can you tell us anything about their symptoms or cause of death?

[marmari]

Regarding the diseased fishes. . .What were they?

Cardinal went quietly the second day ( nonsymptomatic)Bicolor angel went next. No symptoms. Was gone overnight. Then a diamond goby(the next day) - our favourite - had labored breathing for 3 days before he died, refused food. Then, a source of the problem - an infected Dottyback, she harassed our clown and bit off her upper fin for a couple of days before she perished(she had a looong history of having some kind of infection, that was treated for a month in QT but reoccured...white patches on her body that cleaner shrimps cleaned pretty well,,,in the end it went to the gills) I think this might be a fungus with our Clown Fish because she was harassed so much by Dotty...i dont think its the same infection that other fishes got because they perished much 2 quickly to save them.
What I've done so far: quaranteened the clown w copper(cupramine by seachem) ...this helped somewhat...then gave her a Formalin3 bath for 45 min...after that I did a 25%WC. The next day she developed more whitish cotton like patches on her body. Gonna try a MaracynII today with formalin. Vitamins: yes, I use vitamin water in QT since the sick fish doesnt eat. Garlic extract. Aloe Vera.
Yes this is not something very striking - but if u look @ the pic, it's there! she now has more of the same stuff there.
Chemistry? 0 - o,25 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 40 nitrate, reduced salinity, heat ~81. Its in QT. In the main tank(55 gal, LR, LS, Rina canister+kent nitrate sponge, T5, skimmer, 2 powerheads) . My main mistake was adding 2many fish at the same time.(clown, goby, cardinal,
+dottyback from the QT) I still have 2 blue damsels let in the main tank, i can't catch them.
The foods I feed 2ce or 1ce daily dep. on water parameters: flake, granules, formula1, live brine shrimp(there's an automatic shrimpery in the QT), other frozen foods. The tanks are 3,5 months old. Have 2 astrias, 1 crab, 2 cleaners. What i see on my LR: some white grains round w hole, like calcium deposits? Algae: I have green "sticky" algae on my moonlights which is recurring(scrape it off and it grows right back) Yes, all fish had recieved a freshwater dip before going into the main tank. All 4 were recently(4 weeks) aquired. Also, recently added a Caulerpa grape plant from BAli(it doesnt go sexual) but didnt like it losing all these pieces in the water all the time(fish and inverts picked at it too)so removed it recently.

[leebca]

Labored breathing and fast demise fits a few diseases and parasites. The most notable is Marine Velvet. Sometimes the disease strikes so quickly that the aquarist just finds dead fish and doesn't see that the fish was stressed or having respiratory problems. A copper treatment would cure fish of that parasite.

It may be a couple of more or less minor things piling up to create a significant stress in the fish.

A friend of mine tried an experiment last year. He got his 180 gallon tank ready with LR, snails and shrimp and let the tank age for 6 months. So far so good. He added ammonia water to boost the quantity of bacteria to handle the bio load and then put in many fish at one time. Most the fish died in 10 days. I think the system, though the nitrogen 'handling' bacteria were numerous, couldn't handle the general organics introduced so quickly. There are many things on the microbe level going on in a young aquarium and these all change again when fish and foods are introduced.

Back to the anemonefish. . .This fish is an omnivore and needs at least 30% vegetable matter in its diet. If and when it does begin eating, have foods, vitamins, fat supplements and beta glucan ready that match the omnivore suggestions in this reference:
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...hreadid=785228

The cotton like patches. We need to be careful about trying to figure out what they are. Do you know Lymphocystis when you see it? If not check this reference out. It has a photo in it:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/viraldislymph.htm
Do the cottony things look anything like that?

The pale patches you mention make me consider tuberculosis. Not common. But if the patches have fibers in them, like cotton as you called it and it doesn't definitely look like Lymph, then I'd suspect an external fungus.

Very rare but fungus can occur. Usually it is secondary to a serious injury or severe stress or another disease/condition. It is very difficult to cure, but not impossible.

You have to make the diagnosis since I have no photo to go by.

If you're convinced it is fungus, then I would treat it like it was Saprolegnia. I'm only familiar with the 'old medications' for a fungal infection, which I don't think you'll have access to. Because fungal infections spreads quickly and usual fatal, I just put my fish down.

However, if it is fungal, you may try Nifurpirinol (which can be combined with Neomycin (a gram negative antibiotic)). This combo has met with some success to the best of my knowledge.

If you diagnose fungus, stop the copper treatment as soon as you have the above medications and then begin treating the fish that way.

Watch water quality including pH, ammonia, and nitrites closely. Your goal is make ammonia zero and nitrites less than 0.5ppm for this fish.

I'm sorry I can't be of more help. If you have more information or additional photos, I'll try again. Good luck!

[marmari]

Lee: this is some costly experiment ur fr had. Back to my woes: now other fish in QT has gotten infected. But the illness looks a bit different on my chromis: the spots are small, black-grayish, kinda looks like just the scales rotting. Obviously this is not velvet, because they are swimming in copper and its not helping. I will try Formalin+maracynII bath today and we'll c how it goes...(someone suggested Brooklynella...i am at a loss...what kind of antibiotic is compatible with copper and what broad spectrum antibiotic would u suggest in my case?)...
Well, u do have a photo to "go by", but its obviosly something that is not very common...there aren't any mucous, or strings, it's just grayish fog looking patches that look like a wound...it's IN the skin, not on the skin. As to other fish, the black scales aren't like clown's, they are just scales that turned a different color(black-gray). I hope this was descriptive enough and thanks for any help!

[leebca]

If the condition is Brooklynella (and that is possible with newly acquired anemonefishes) then the formalin dips you're doing, if you're following these recommendations:
http://www.marineaquariumadvice.com/...nd_or_foe.html
is the cure for Brook. But. . .I have not known Brooklynella to appear like cottony patches or that fits all the other terms you used to describe the condition.

The only picture/photo I see is the first one you posted of the anemonefish and I can't clearly see anything wrong with it.

Diagnosis is very important and I don't think I can help you beyond what you've described to me. So far you've reported the appearance as:
sick
doesn't eat
whitish big spot (not ich)
grain like growth
harassed by Dotty
fungus
'more' whitish cotton patches [your first use of 'cotton']
and the latest. . .
spots are small, black-grayish
greyish fog looking patches

all the above in a tank 3.5 months old that was hit with several fish all at the same time, which you said has good water quality.

I don't know anything that fits all the above. Sorry.


Maybe someone else can help.

[marmari]

[marmari]

Anyone??
Please, she is feeling worse and worse. Another symptom now she's got, is that she is itching and scratches herself all the time...I feel for her! The poor thing is getting this thing all over her, the mouth area, and now the other side, and its itching. Her treatment: copper, formalin bath, and now Maracyn for what we now think is a fungus...and a quickly spreading one, too, infecting other fishes.
PLEASE HELP!!!

[OzarksReef]

I have had a maroon clown for about 10 days that came down with what sounds like the same thing on the second day. She has not eaten since. I have tried freshwater dips, copper treatment (no response), and formalin/malachite green (seems better, but still sick). Mine has not displayed any scratching behavior - just sluggish and not eating. The white "cotton-like" patches flake off of her and look just awful. I'm currently treating with the formalin/malachite green and a broad spectrum antibiotic. I'm going to try some higher concentration "baths" with the same medication and see if she responds. If I don't get her to eat soon, I'm afraid she's done for.

I'll continue to watch this post for any other helpful advice.

[marmari]

Well I've posted this on another thread and was advise to euthanize my fish! :shock: I am now happy to report that my baby pulled through! I upped the level of copper in my tank and that did the trick. I also treated the water with Maracyn(not the Maracyn two) for 5 days. I added a fake anemone to the tank as well as some bigger pvc pieces, since the fish didn't like the narrow pieces. Guess what ? The white patches have covered the fake anemone as well - it now looks like a sick fish, hehe. Anyways Lori the clownfish started eating Cyclopeze and the next day, light Spirulina flakes. She is still not out of the woods yet, eats little, in small pieces, unlike my chromis who has to "chew" food for her... so I am knocking on the wood as i'm writing this. A little bit of the stuff left on her side, other patches are gone. Jerry the chromis still got dark scales but this didn't affect him much. I am going to try and do a WC tomorrow and maintain copper at 0,6 ppm for another week or maybe longer? But I don't know if i should stop with maracyn completely, since the stuff hasnt cleared up completely yet. What do you think?
ps - good luck, Ozarksreef, I am thinking that it's either a brooklynella(which is only cured with formalin bath ONLY, 3 one day skip bathes) or its a fungus from being picked on by other fish, and in this case, u need antibiotic, i'd recommend maracyn plus, or/and maroxy in case its a true fungus. With my case though, i am now convinced that Lori had some parasites and a secondary infection. What helped with starving, is Vitamin water and garlic extract.

[marmari]

My clown Lori has fully recovered and now she's constantly hungry. I gave her a seaweed to chew on between feedings but she will follow me wherever I go...heck, she will even nibble at my finger. I was wondering, could I feed her some bread crumbs to tame all this hunger? Has somebody tried or is this a no no?