Still not happy with my coloration.

[cwegescheide]

I'm not happy with my SPS coloration. Recently I have been meeting more reefers in my area, there's quite a few here in Tampa, and several have amazing tanks. I ask them what they do to have such beautiful corals. I'm definatley not doing something right. Not to say that my tank looks like crap but I have a few corals that I just cant get to respond the way I would like. I'd say 1/2 of my corals have excellent coloration. Its the other half that agrrivate me!!

Most of the frags that I have came from AtlantisAquarium.net or from friends tanks that when I got them had spectacular coloration.

I've been in the game long enough to know there are many variables that lead to nice coral coloration but still I am not satisfied.

A little about my tank:
90 Gallon rimless custom acrylic tank w 1" external overflow
Shallow Sandbed I guess you could say. Just enough to cover the bottom.
2x 6100 Tunze for circulation with ACIII and Aquasurf
Giesemann Eco 14K Pheonix lighting
T5 9:30am - 6:30pm
MH 11:00am - 6:00pm
Temp = 80 - 81 Aquacontroller
Salinity 1.026 refractometer calibrated with Randy's calibration solution
PH = 8.1 - 8.3 Aquacontroller
Nitrate 0 to 10ppm it varies a little from time to time Lamotte
Alk = 2.7 - 3.5 meq/L I'm trying to get this more stable and finally thinking I'm on the right track Lamotte
Ca ~ 420ppm Sailfert - I run a Geo reactor with the Korallin media (coral
skeletons) controlled by my Aquacontroller.
P04 = ? I don't have a reliable test kit. Need to find a local with Hanna meter. I do use GFO in a bag floating in my filter sock.

I use a lot of carbon in my system 2+ cups that I change every two weeks. I think the name is chem-gone, algone or namegone something like that. I put it in a bag and run it in my filter sock which I change 3x/week.

I have chaeto in my sump with a PC light. It grows but not that fast.

I do 10% water changes every other week. Sometimes every week with Tropic Marin Salt. I have an RO/DI unit that has an inline TDS meter. Output of Di is 0.

I have a EuroReef skimmer rated for 120 gallons and it seems to do a pretty good job. I did put a hopped up pump - sedra 5000 I think. Came with 3500.

I would say I have a decent bio-load. My list of fish is the following:
1 3+" Flatback Angel - Gorgeous fish btw..
1 4" Powder Brown Tang
1 4" Hippo Tang
1 5" Wrasse cant remember the type
5 or 6 Chromis
1 Coral Beauty
1 Anthia - The rest had a death wish. They jumped out of my tank.
1 < 2" (umm I dont know what he is but he's small and he's got REALLY BIG EYEBALLS)

I feed 2x/day via electric autofeeder which contains a mixture of pellets, cyclopeez, couple different types of flake. I'd say its the equivalent of 2 generous pinches of flake food. I'm out of town m-f so on the weekends I feed a little heavier and give Rod's food and a little more pellets and flake.

One thing that I have noticed is some of these tanks have a few common denominators. Every tank that I've seen that has amazing coloration is using SE 14K AquaConnect bulbs with VHO supplementation.

I am considering adding a Kalk reactor to my system and a litemeter. I used to top-off with Kalk a year or so ago and stopped. It seemed to me that my corals actually had more vibrant colors when I used Kalk as well as Ca Reactor.

Any words of wisdom? I'd appreciate it.

[Bullredchaser]

What color and brand is your T5 bulbs.I used to run Geismann Actinic plus bulbs because of the higher PAR.But since I switched to Geisemann Pure actinics my greens came back and so did alot of other colors.For your information the halide is the same 10k XM bulb Ive always had.The bulb swap was the only change to the system I did.

[jay24k]

I have no issues with color and run XM10K. Personally, I don't run carbon unless I really see the need. I use carbon maybe 2 to 3 times a day for a week. I don't honestly see the need unless your water clarity is off or if you have competing corals. Are you keeping your sand bed clean? SSB do require vacuuming around. I would possibly increase the back half to a DSB. You get the benefits and keep the nice look of SSB in the front. (What I do).

As far as GFO, I don't run that either but I thought I recall the best way to use it is through a reactor and not in a sock since it doesn't really get the right flow. While phosphates are mainly the issue and not nitrates, you really shoulnd't be seeing any nitrates at all. Maybe your skimmer is not picking up the slack on the nutrients from the heavier feedings.

Hope that helps.

[dvmsn]

Some corals are just ugly

[brucem]

I would look into phosphates . I just got mine under control and some corals I have seen a big difference in. John has a hannah meter to test phosphates

[cwegescheide]

Originally posted by brucem
I would look into phosphates . I just got mine under control and some corals I have seen a big difference in. John has a hannah meter to test phosphates

Thanks Bruce. I will have to take a water sample over to John and see what happens.

Chris

[cwegescheide]

Jay24K - How do you supplement Ca/Alk? How often do you do water changes and what salt do you use? How big is your setup and what do you use for flow? And last but not least, what lighting setup do you have?

[Emster]

Hey Chris. How many watts of t-5's and what color? I have a 90gal too and it seems you have a lot of fish and feed a lot(from what I can tell) so I would check your phosphates at Johns. Also if you could get the nitrates down to 0 would help a lot too. I have to tell you my first thought is too much light, this is just my opinion but I have a phoenix over my frag tank and it can really blast the corals.

[YoitsArson]

Everytime I read one of these posts the culprit seems to be phosphate. Good luck. ttt

[jay24k]

My setup is 180 gallons with a 40 gallon sump.
I run 3 XM 250 watt 10K bulbs with 320 watts of VHO supplementation.
I slacked on water changes but I do about 20 gallons every 2 weeks. I was using Tropic Marin but switched to Reef Crystals since it is easier to get and cheaper. I've noticed no changes.

I use a panworld pump that pushes about 900 gph through my sump and I run 2 vortechs at full speed.

I only run a calcium reactor and have the effluent wide open at 120 ml /min with a ph of 6.3. I have to run it this way for the calcium demand to keep up. My chamber is 18" tall and it is 6" diameter.

[Marko9]

FWIW, I run my T5 supplements for 12 hours. I noticed better color that when I was running for only 10 hours.

I agree that phospahates are the the most impostant when it comes to get the trickier colors to color up. Some corals take longer to color up. They need to put down more of a base and gain surface area before they can color up.

[cwegescheide]

Originally posted by Emster
Hey Chris. How many watts of t-5's and what color? I have a 90gal too and it seems you have a lot of fish and feed a lot(from what I can tell) so I would check your phosphates at Johns. Also if you could get the nitrates down to 0 would help a lot too. I have to tell you my first thought is too much light, this is just my opinion but I have a phoenix over my frag tank and it can really blast the corals.

Hi Emmet,

I have 2x (I think 54W of Giesemann t5- what the fixture comes with) I've been thinking of trying another type of T5 bulb. I saw Carol's tank with T5's over it and the coloration was really nice.

I guess I have been running my lights a little more than usual lately. I might cut my photo period down a little bit and see it it helps.

Might have to stop by John's today with a water sample.

Take care,
Chris

[kev apsley]

How long is your photoperiod?

[MitchReef]

I swear by Phoenix and Reef Crystals....you saw my blue tort in the Eye Candy thread, and it was a little skinny pale beige stick just 3 months ago.

[mano1192]

Its prolly built up PO4, it may not be very high, but still enough to disrupt the color in some of your corals. I would buy a 2 little fishies reactor ($30 @ Marinedepot) and run your PO4 remover in there 24/7. A sock is incorrect for po4 remover, it works for carbon but not good for phos remover. Also is there a specific reason you run carbon 24/7? You may be stripping beneficial stuff out of the water before your corals get it....

[jay24k]

The only salt I personally do not like is oceanic. The others seemed fine. I run a 7 hr photo period and 12 hour vho one.

[Sk8r]

I know what you mean. I swear I look at the zoa forum's interesting thread about tossing vitamin c pills into the tank [some claim fantastic expansion and color] and get real tempted by the notion, but I think color in wild-taken in particular pretty well is what it is.

[midas blenny]

could it be that half are aquacultured sps, and some are wild. wild ones will take a year or 2 to color up sometimes or not color up at all. dont sound like po4 if half has real nice color and how often do you feed and what do you feed. and if you got the corals from someone that was using a 1000 watt halide it will take time to adjust to your light. long as you have good pe night or day wouldnt be worried, how old are the corals you are talking about.

[midas blenny]

i do not like oceanic either good old io for me

[cwegescheide]

I feed 2x/day a mixture of Cyclopeez, couple different types of flakes and pellets in an electronic autofeeder.

My photo period is now 7hrs / day.

I also finally think I am on the road to recovery on my Alk supplementation. I realized that my PH probe went bad and my reactor was too low, melting my media too much causing my effluent drip to be erratic. I replaced my probe and cleaned out my media really well to remove all of the fine particles and reconnected everything. I hope this should take care of it for atleast a while.

I've been battling my Alk issue for a while and I'm hoping that once I get the stability nailed my color and growth will return.

I am also working on getting my nitrates down. Right now I am getting a reading of 1 with my Lamotte Nitrate test kit. Multiplied by 4.4 = 4.4 ppm nitrate. I will say that when my nitrate was zero some of my corals looked kindof pale. I'm not a total believer in 0 nitrates but I will give it a whirl.

I'm really getting tired of battling this stuff, but I will say that if it was easy I don't think it would be that fun or rewarding.

[kev apsley]

I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination but I recently had issues with colors and I lengthened my photoperiod from 7 hrs to 10+ and within a few days I began to see the colors start to come back like gangbusters...I know people on here claim that you don't need such a long photoperiod but I am on now on the other side of the fence, in which I believe a longer photoperoid is very beneficial to coloration...just a thought

[cwegescheide]

Originally posted by kev apsley
I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination but I recently had issues with colors and I lengthened my photoperiod from 7 hrs to 10+ and within a few days I began to see the colors start to come back like gangbusters...I know people on here claim that you don't need such a long photoperiod but I am on now on the other side of the fence, in which I believe a longer photoperoid is very beneficial to coloration...just a thought

So what kind of lighting do you have Kev?

[kev apsley]

Originally posted by cwegescheide
So what kind of lighting do you have Kev?

not a ton, just 150 watts hqi 14.5k Gmann over my 24 gallon but i wanted to throw that out there for you as a possibility as to why your colors may not be what you want...you might want to give it a shot if your still searching for the answer in the near future

[cwegescheide]

Originally posted by YoitsArson
Everytime I read one of these posts the culprit seems to be phosphate. Good luck. ttt

Well I went to FAOIS and Jennifer tested my Phosphates for me.

PO4 = .14 ppm

I understand that PO4 should be ~ .03ppm?

OUCH!!

Well now I have something else to work on. Getting my PO4 down. We will see what happens when I get this taken care of.

I've got my fingers crossed.

Thanks,
Chris

[reeladdictive]

I DO A WATER CHANGE EVERY WEEK 30% AND CUT BACK MY LIGHTING HALIDES TO 7HRS AND ATTINICS TO 12 AND HAVE NOTICED A CHANGE IN THE COLORS