EuroReef Club - Page 5

hahnmeister · #**101** 06/05/2007, 01:14 AM

sjm817, ownership is not a qualification to have the most informed opinion. Sorry, but I just hate it when people say that. I may not own a Ferrari 430, and I may not own a Ariel Atom (but I may in a year), but I can still tell you that an Ariel Atom will run circles around the Ferrari even though it costs 1/4 as much. How? Observation, which is not something that ownership automatically includes of excludes. I have seen both units in action now a few times, so thats what Im going with. The simple mass-flow rate comparison of the two is what makes me arrive at those conclusions as well. There are many people who own exotic cars, yet this does not mean they have the experience to know everything about them. Just because the mechanic who services them doesnt own one... does that make his opinion any less?

manderx · #**102** 06/05/2007, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Sorry, but I just hate it when people say that. I may not own a Ferrari 430, and I may not own a Ariel Atom (but I may in a year), but I can still tell you that an Ariel Atom will run circles around the Ferrari even though it costs 1/4 as much. How? Observation,

you can't even begin to make a comparison between cars and skimmers. you can lookup hard facts on cars. you know it's horsepower, torque, 0-60,... skimmers are a different beast, with no such hard numbers. sure you can compare body size, air, water,... but that only gets you partway. doesn't equate to real-world performance since it's the little details that make or break a skimmer design.

Quote:

I have seen both units in action now a few times, so thats what Im going with

so we're supposed to trust your assumptions over someone else's hands-on day in day out experience? enough of us have read enough of your posts to know what they are worth. (i'm still looking for that magical floating acrylic that is 1/8th the density of water)

Quote:

Just because the mechanic who services them doesnt own one... does that make his opinion any less?

well, since a mechanic has his hands inside them, knows what tends to break on them, and understands the workings better than the owners of course his opinion would mean something. doesn't mean i would automatically trust his opinion on a car he's only seen a picture of on the internet though. are you trying to compare yourself to a (skilled) mechanic?

sjm817 · #**103** 06/05/2007, 05:39 AM

This is the "ER Club" thread. This discussion does not belong here.

Out of respect for members of this forum, I'm not wasting their time discussing this here.

Doubledown · #**104** 06/05/2007, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doubledown
When you first turned your skimmer on, was it loud? I just started my new RS180 and it sounds like it will vibrate to pieces. I got used to a gentle hum from the Sedra pump on my ASM skimmer, but this is much worse.

I have unplugged the skimmer and hope one of you has some suggestions.

Thanks

Back to Euro Reef skimmers?

Thanks

tbone28 · #**105** 06/05/2007, 11:11 AM

Sorry, couldn't delete my post

Doubledown · #**106** 06/05/2007, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by EuroReef Tec1
Doubldown: PM sent!

Got it, thanks.

hahnmeister · #**107** 06/05/2007, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by manderx
you can't even begin to make a comparison between cars and skimmers. you can lookup hard facts on cars. you know it's horsepower, torque, 0-60,... skimmers are a different beast, with no such hard numbers. sure you can compare body size, air, water,... but that only gets you partway. doesn't equate to real-world performance since it's the little details that make or break a skimmer design.

so we're supposed to trust your assumptions over someone else's hands-on day in day out experience? enough of us have read enough of your posts to know what they are worth. (i'm still looking for that magical floating acrylic that is 1/8th the density of water)

well, since a mechanic has his hands inside them, knows what tends to break on them, and understands the workings better than the owners of course his opinion would mean something. doesn't mean i would automatically trust his opinion on a car he's only seen a picture of on the internet though. are you trying to compare yourself to a (skilled) mechanic?

The point was that I dont need to own one to have enough experience with one. As far as the worth of my posts, that is up to you... if the information is not of any value to you, simply pass on it... but others may find it important. I have no idea where you get some idea that Im going to procure 1/8 density of acrylic water... because I never said I would. So, dont trust my assumptions... no. Trust what my eyes have seen. I may not own the skimmers I talk about sometimes, but plenty of people around me do... and I have had my hands in them to know something.

mph, bhp, torque... sure, these are hard numbers, and so are the mass-flow-rates of air and water, volume or diameter and height of a skimmer. As for knowing which car will make it around a track faster... that is about as 'concrete' of a spec as how much skimmate a skimmer will truly pull... yet I can still tell which car will make it around the track faster... and its not based on assumptions. I wonder how that is... how a person can know 'where a bullet will land before pulling the trigger'... yet it happens. You know, just because I disagreed with you one time on one subject, doesnt mean you have to be so disagreeable with me.

manderx · #**108** 06/07/2007, 05:14 AM

Quote:

The point was that I dont need to own one to have enough experience with one.

really? what, you can pull decent knowledge out of "thin air" or something? moreso than someone who has owned the skimmers in question and used them day-in/day-out? wow. you should charge money or something.

Quote:

As far as the worth of my posts, that is up to you... if the information is not of any value to you, simply pass on it... but others may find it important.

the information on RC depends on being peer-reviewed in order to be good and useful towards forwarding the reefkeeping knowledge base. it is *everyone's* duty to point out bad information. if you see someone spouting stupid, it is your duty to say something. otherwise, yet another reefing myth may be spawned.

Quote:

I have no idea where you get some idea that Im going to procure 1/8 density of acrylic water... because I never said I would.

really? (ignoring your typos) i would have forgotten about it, but it bumped up to top just recently...
"water is what, 8x heavier than acrylic or something like that (that was a number out of thin air)"

Quote:

mph, bhp, torque... sure, these are hard numbers, and so are the mass-flow-rates of air and water, volume or diameter and height of a skimmer.

so? there's more to skimmers than that. if you have made 1/100th as many skimmers as you say you have you'd know that. i still think it's odd that you only post pictures of the crappy skimmers you've made, yet the 'good' ones you say you've never posted pics of...

Quote:

As for knowing which car will make it around a track faster... that is about as 'concrete' of a spec as how much skimmate a skimmer will truly pull...

really? so tell us how you can absolutely and quantitatively measure a skimmer's performance on par with a car's '1/4 mile' stats? i mean, if we know a car can go at x miles per hour, and the track is y miles long, we know how fast it can go around the track. you're saying you can tell me how many moles of carbon/nitrogen/phosphorous i can pull out of a typical 120g tank with a bm200 (or some other skimmer you've never used)? heck, if you could tell me for a skimmer you *have* used i'd be impressed.

Quote:

yet I can still tell which car will make it around the track faster... and its not based on assumptions.

lemme guess. published measured PERFORMANCE stats?

Quote:

I wonder how that is... how a person can know 'where a bullet will land before pulling the trigger'... yet it happens.

most guns have these things on them called sights (*really* fancy ones have scopes) that show you were the bullet will land. they work well enough you can cut a playing-card in half with a one. if you don't believe me, i'm sure there's plenty of slo-mo videos on teh youtube. knock yourself out.

Quote:

You know, just because I disagreed with you one time on one subject, doesnt mean you have to be so disagreeable with me.

i'm not disagreeable with *you*, just many of the things you say (goes back to the whole 'peer-review' thing). if i see stupid in a thread i happen to skim through, and i'm in the mood to say something, i do. don't feel special.

hahnmeister · #**109** 06/07/2007, 01:18 PM

Manderx, you have just sunk in to the realm of 'arguing stupid'. Water being heavier... yes.... it is heavier at the molecular level. its atoms are less spaced out, which allows the water to be absorbed into acrylic at the interstitial level. You are interpreting the information how you want to, but I never said acrylic would float.

As for sights on a gun, you try using a scope like you say on a moving target. You cant just use a scope to shoot something... you have to adjust for wind sometimes, and distance. If the object is in motion, you have to lead into the shot to actually hit it. Nevermind, I can see that the analogy has fallen on deaf ears.

BTW, making 1/100th the skimmers I say I have made would put me at about .8 ... I dont see a reason to justify or prove to others every single skimmer I have made. The only ones I show are the ones that are something special... the small ones that outperform a remora and are posted because anyone can easily make one for $10 in scrap materials. The larger ones arent anything special, and I dont feel like contributing to RC with yet another thread on 'look at yet another simple skimmer that looks like every other'.

'lemme guess. published measured PERFORMANCE stats?'
Yeah, thats part of it, but also seeing them in action or being in them to know what they mean.

Can we please stick to the point here though... I was arguing that the ER RS250 should perform about the same as the ATI BM250. Do you have anything to contribute at that level? I was simply seeking someone to post a vid of their RS250 in action, not drag an argument from another thread over here. If I bring this up in another thread, what are you going to do... follow me over to that one too and jump in because you feel you have to do this 'peer-review' thing? So if you can shut up for a moment, maybe someone here can simply post a video of their RS250 in action.

A sea K · #**110** 06/07/2007, 02:41 PM

Well now, That was fun.
Hahn,
I don't have a RC 250 but I do have a CS8-3 that I modded into a recirc using ER's 1262 pump and plumbing/fittings. I can't post a video but what I do know is this pump does not pull 1200 LPH and as is set up in my skimmer does have a good deal of turbulance and as sjm817 stated is evident up into the neck.

hahnmeister · #**111** 06/07/2007, 02:52 PM

The CS8-3 is a different skimmer, yes. If it comes down to it, I can take vids myself this weekend of both skimmers if I get a chance.

I wonder how a removable insert for removeing turbulence would work though... ORCA offers this and accorsing to them, the difference is huge. Its pretty much a removable bubble plate that you can attach to the outlet of the pump in the skimmer. The ORCAs have a top flange though, so fitting something in there that large is easier.

A sea K · #**112** 06/07/2007, 02:55 PM

No, it is the same dimension as the 250 8X30 with 4-1/2 neck.

Doubledown · #**113** 06/07/2007, 02:58 PM

To give credit where it is due, ER customer service and technical support are right on top of my questions and are taking care of me.

Nice to know a great product is backed by quality service.

hahnmeister · #**114** 06/07/2007, 11:31 PM

A sea K, different pump from what I remember. I know two people with CS250s, and the meter on their skimmers is about 1100-1200 (1180 exactly on one) for air.

hahnmeister · #**115** 06/08/2007, 01:00 AM

BeanAnimal posted this today... it cracks me up:
"Some of us have a bit higher level understanding of things than YOU may want to believe. You may not like it, but many of don't have to test drive something to understand it or the science that makes it tick.

Ownership of a product is NOT the delimiter for understanding of, or knowledge about the product and how or why it functions in a given manner. YOUR understanding of the mechanics may not be the same as mine or somebody else's. What you consider "fact" may certainly not be "fact" at all, but rather an opinion based on observation or LACK of understanding."

A sea K · #**116** 06/08/2007, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahnmeister
A sea K, different pump from what I remember. I know two people with CS250s, and the meter on their skimmers is about 1100-1200 (1180 exactly on one) for air.

You are totally correct. The RS uses the Gen-X 6100 and RC uses the Ehiem 1262.
I'll shutup now, I thought you were asking about the RC skimmer. My skimmer does have a great deal of turbulance however.

markandkristen · #**117** 06/08/2007, 07:41 AM

im a little confused here
is it lph that makes a skimmer or matching lph per the body of the skimmer.
i talked with a ER tech the other day on the phone and he talked about consistency of the bubble as well.
the eheim has less lph but good consistency.
i think thats why deltec users talk about how great they skim because of the consistency of the pump.
i think also it has to do with the acrylic its made out of. (how smooth)

A sea K · #**118** 06/08/2007, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by markandkristen
im a little confused here
is it lph that makes a skimmer or matching lph per the body of the skimmer.
i talked with a ER tech the other day on the phone and he talked about consistency of the bubble as well.
the eheim has less lph but good consistency.
i think thats why deltec users talk about how great they skim because of the consistency of the pump.
i think also it has to do with the acrylic its made out of. (how smooth)

Excellent question! I would love to know the answer as well as how to determine the proper LPH for a designated body/neck size.

hoyta · #**119** 06/08/2007, 12:29 PM

Hopefuly not a stupid question- have you guys mesh-modded your pinwheel impellars?

jimdogg187 · #**120** 06/08/2007, 12:44 PM

Lots of people have done this. It works well with the sedras and the gen-4100 from what I know.

Jim

hoyta · #**121** 06/08/2007, 01:12 PM

I'm a little lsot on how to do it- I've done it before, but not on the pinwheel versions... Any help? I guess I could shave some of the knobs down...

any help would be nice

ddboy · #**122** 06/08/2007, 01:49 PM

I have a RS135. it will overflow a little bit everytime I restart the skimmer after cleaning. Has anyone put a drain line to it?

jimdogg187 · #**123** 06/08/2007, 02:12 PM

On the 6" skimmers, you need to tap the side unless you ues a really small fitting. The space to drill on the bottom of the collection cup is pretty limiting.

I added one to my 8" skimmer. It works great, but I had to be really careful when I tapped it.

jimdogg187 · #**124** 06/08/2007, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hoyta
I'm a little lsot on how to do it- I've done it before, but not on the pinwheel versions... Any help? I guess I could shave some of the knobs down...

any help would be nice

I've never done it either. I am VERY happy with the stock performance of my eheim 1262.

However, there is a thread in the DIY forum called "meshmod genx 4100 friggen rocks".... or something to that affect.

Lots of info there.

Jim

tbone28 · #**125** 06/08/2007, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tbone28
RS250 - Order Status

EuroTech:

Would you mind checking the status of an order? I ordered one through Atlantis Aquarium in Union City, CA. They're a sponsor on this forum.

I ordered it a week ago. Mingwei, the owner left a message with you guys trying to find out the status of the order, and he told me he hasn't heard back yet.

Can you find out when you guys are shipping to them?

Thanks

ER Tech: The skimmer came in yesterday....Thanks for your awesome service!!!