Fish Survey: Volitans Lionfish

[Lionfish01]

OK here is the Facts on feeding a lionfish.

Goldfish are the worst feeders for a lionfish. They are high in fats and do not have the neccesary nutrients for a lion. Ghost Shrimp are the best live feeders (unless you live by the ocean, then you can catch marine minnows or shrimp.) Gut load these shrimp and feed them to your lion. Depending on the size of your lion determines how much you should feed him.
If your lion is:
1-5 inches--feed it everyday about 1-3 ghost shrimp daily. Try not to feed all at once. Space it out in the day.

6-11 inches-- feed it every 2 days about 1-4 ghost shrimp.

12-max inches-- feed it every 3 days about 1-5 ghost shrimp.

After the lion gets settled in his new home start trying to wean it over. Silversides and mysis shrimp ought to work. Impale the food with a piece of rigid airline tubing or a feeding stick and wiggle it so it looks alive. Keep trying until it accepts prepared foods.

Hope this helps.

[Trekkie]

What do silversides look like? One place they looked like forzen minnows and they were longer than the lion fish. The other place they were this tiny little white things with black eyes. Both were given to me at different stores when I asked for them

[Lionfish01]

Silversides are marine minnows. Try the ones that are smaller than the lionfish. As the lion gets bigger feed it the larger silversides.

[cirri]

I too have had a lion for over 1 and 1/2 now in my F/O tanks.

It was hand picked at a lfs -best way IMO

It is with, mexican dragon eel, niger and undulated trig in a 72 gal bow front

Feed is live rosie once a week, about 8 of them,

Frozen silversides once a week - about 5 of them

Fresh Scallops once every other week about 3 of the smallest you can find.


It would never take to the brine (of course) or frozens at first. Had to do live solely. This obviously has changed.

Very passive non agressive tempermant, but I aint no little fish, and he like to eat those!!

[M.Dandaneau]

Cirri, if this is a serious post you're about to lose yor lionfish of 1 1/2 years.............with a Niger, possibly, but with an Undulated trigger that lionfish is living on borrowed time, and IMO, so is everything else in the tank.

The Undulated trigger and the Clown tang are listed in every handbook I've ever read the two species most commonly encountered that will decimate a tank, yet people insist on packing them into a community set up.........in your case, I'm hoping that no-one ever told you what is in store for you in the future and trying to give you a tip in time for you to prevent it.

Mike

[cirri]

Appreciate the reply, and yes it is serious.

Every thing was put in the tank at the same time. The undulated is growing at a very slow rate, and I got him when he was extremely small.

SO, I need to try and get him out is your suggestion? I have heard a few time recently the fears of undulated trigger, but this guy is so small. I guess I just figured he was used to all the other fish that were with him since a wee little lad.

Thanks again!

[M.Dandaneau]

Thanks for the reply........unfortunately, the Undulateds ALWAYS eventually show their true nature as they grow, going from pleasent looking litle fish to a veritable Jack the Ripper as they add inches.
When little, their boldness endears them to many as they "nibble" at your fingers and show no fear, but as they grow those "nibbles" begin to hurt and soon pieces will begin to disappear from the other fish....that's just before the other fish begin to get massacred.
Honestly, I'd seriously consider trading it in or getting it its own tank.

Mike

[cirri]

I definately will have to do something! I care to much about all my creatures I keep. I guess, I was just hopeful he would be used to his other inhabitants. My does not have any "boldness" though he hides all the time just about. Will prolly have to trade it out, no more room for tanks.

Thanks again, and back on topic......if you get a lion don't put an undulated in there!!!

[M.Dandaneau]

Actually, cirri, lions aren't good tankmates for any of the triggers, although some of the more peaceful pelagic species may leave them alone in a large tank.
As a rule, triggers are too tough, fast and agile for a lion and simply bite off the fins, musch as they would the spines of an urchin.......any lionfish that wins a battle with a triggerfish was large enough to eat it in one bite! While the lions have large mouths, they are surprisingly peaceful fish with anything too large to eat.

Mike

[cirri]

Not looking for a fish fight in my tank!! I do believe the niger should be fine! And I definately agree it has been the most peaceful/graceful fish I have kept! (and I want to keep it that way) Thanks for your advice!!!

[M.Dandaneau]

You're welcome.......one more little thing......is the F/O tank the 72 gal. that you have listed?

If so, keep in mind that they can reach about 18", so I wouldn't add too much more, even though it looks a little empty now.

Mike

[cirri]

It is the 72, nothing else has been added since the original stock, but thanks!

My octo tank is the one that looks empty because I can have hardly anything else in there!

Good question back on this thread.... Do you happen to know the average life expectancy (in captivity) of Volitans?

[M.Dandaneau]

Actually, that's what started this whole survey and thread as we suspect they are long-lived, but most people seem to manage to keep them alive a year or so before losing them to disease, illness or triggerfish **grin**.

As more of us are becoming aware of just how peaceful they really are, already a difference seems to be evidencing itself.

We currently have a spawning pairy of dwarf fuzzy lions (32 spawnings to date, but no luck rearing fry so far...hopefully spring and an abundance in live wild plankton may change this), and a pair of P. russellii that are in spawning condition and are courting, but no eggs yet...soon they'll be moved to the deeper 300 gal. tank and, again, hopefully the deeper tank will produce another spawning pair.

We also just added a brilliant red male P. volitans to the growing tank, and as soon as it's large enough to keep with our stonefish, we're hoping it will spawn with our really dark large black female (about 14")

Mike

[cirri]

GL with the breeding!!! Has anyone successfully captive bred lions?

Thanks again for your help, pic of Foo attached!!!!

[M.Dandaneau]

Thanks, cirri....actually, you're asking the wrong person.....Frank Marini, one of the moderators for this forum, has written one of the best lionfish and scorpionfish articles to date (listed as Nov. Reefkeeping Scorpionfish, I believe) that's a MUST READ, in my opinion, located at the top of this forum.
Additionally, he moderates a forum specifically on the breeding and rearing of marine fish elsewhere in this site and is one of the most knowledgable people I've ever had the pleasure of almost meeting! **grin**

As far as I know, the dwarf fuzzies have been bred with some regularity, but I've only seen mention of the larger species breeding in the wild and in large public aquariums, where the event was just an act of nature that was totally by accident......then again, advances in this hobby happen so fast that it's difficult to keep up with.

To the best of my knowledge, no-one has so far been able to rear lionfish or scorpionfish in captivity (and after 32 spawns, it's easy to see why! **grin**) but spring is here again and we're hoping that the availability of live, wild plankton will be the deciding factor that allows us to at least raise a couple this year.
Or next year
Or the year after.....

Mike

[cwschoon]

Bought a healthy looking small to med blk volitan last week, took it home, fed it some ghost shrimp, which it took right away. It hid, never came out and was dead last Friday. Tank perimiters are great and the other few fish in the tank are fine. Any ideas? Cyanide perhaps? I am no amature and am at a loss as to why this fish died. This tank has been set up since September with good water movement, lots of live rock, etc.

[dhoch]

SELECTION
Did you mail order this fish and would you recommend mail order this fish?
No

Any tips on how you picked a healthy specimen of this species from LFS?
Eating and swiming and active at the store.


COMPATIBILITY
What tankmates do you have with this fish?
I have a blind picasso tringer, White Cheek Tang, Snowflake Eel, Salon's Fairy Wrasse, Blue Damsel, Flame Angel, Cleaner Shrimp, Red Banded Shrimp, Snails and Hermits

Is it a reef or FO tank?
FOWLR

Did this fish hurt/eat any of other fish (or vice versa)?
Someone in the tank ate a blennie. It was either the Lion (most likely) or the Eel.

Did this fish hurt/eat ornamental crustaceans (shrimps, hermits, crabs)?
Not yet

FEEDING
How did you get this fish to eat at first?
I started out on guppies...(about 1 or 2 days) but he was hungry enough that at feeding time he came to the top and I just droped in frozen food (thawed) and he would wolf it down.

What’s the diet?
He eats a variety of frozen foods

How much and how often do you feed?
once a day. About 1 frozen cube.


GROWTH RATE AND LIFE SPAN
What is the initial size of your fish and maximum size it reached?
Started out at about 2-2.5" and is now 5-6" (over a 2 year period)

What size tank did this fish live in? (or how soon did this fish outgrow what size tank)?
He is in a 125 gal.

What do you think is the minimum tank size required for an adult specimen of this fish?
I wouldn't go smaller than 110

How long have you kept this fish?
2 years

BEHAVIOR
Does this fish change body color under any circumstances?
Yes... he ocassionally "sulks" changes body color to a deeper red and won't move much.

How active is this fish?
Very for a Lion. He swims a fair amount lazily around the tank.

Is this fish shy?
Nope

How territorial or aggressive is this fish? How does this fish interact with tankmates?
He's a little bit territorial. He has on ocassion gotten close to other fish and I've noticed his bottom fins twitching (he did this when the eel was first placed in the tank). I think it was his way of setting pecking order. Other than that he really just trys to avoid the other fish.

Did this fish ever jump out of the tank?
Nope.

How does this fish sleep?
He hangs on rocks usually pointing straight down.

Does this fish allow cleaners to clean? If so which cleaner and how often?
Nope

How does this fish interact with human?
He is very dog like when it comes to food and feeding time. He will rise to the top of the tank and wait for me to drop food in.

Dave

[L98-Z]

Sorry if off topic, I just checked out Seafans website, job well done. If you get the chance, try doing the same with a Zebra moray. I always hear how friendly they are, but no one ever mentions having one or knowing much about them.

[35gallonhex]

do one for puffers

[ACIDRAIN]

I have kept Fu-Manchu, Antenia, Fuzzy Dwarfs, Zebra, Radiata, and Volitans both red and black, over the last 25 years. I have even caught my own scorpion fish and kept them as well. Currently I have only two lions, Leo and another not named.

Some pics of Leo, he is almost 16 inches long, and is over 10 years old.



You can see in this pic, his little friend haging out on the back of the tank. He to is a Volitan, but only about 6 inches long.


Close up of his head


Swimming around the tank.


Here you can see him and get an idea of his size. He lives in a 300 gal tank, 7 feet long. You can also see in the bottom left corner, his tankmate, a 32 inch male Califonia Horn Shark.

[ACIDRAIN]

OK, for some reason the pics loaded as links and not pics, and they only work if you cut and past. So, I will try this again linked to another site that has worked in the past, just pics not as good quality.

This is the only pic I have on both sites at this time. For the other pics, please copy and paste to your brouser.


Here is a pic of Leo's tank mate, the California Horn Shark



A few pics of one of my favorite lions that I lost a couple of years back. I had him for about 6-7 years;

[Paladin]

ACIDRAIN,
I was just wondering why some of your volitans lions passed away while others continue to live. I had a volitans that I kept for around 4 years but past away earlier this year.

[ACIDRAIN]

Well, some died many years ago, before they discovered gold fish were no good for them, and actually were what was killing them. But since then, they have died what I suspect as natural deaths. They mostly all ate up till they died. I did lose a couple to long power outages where I used to live. The one in the pic however, died of a dislocated upper jaw. They all get tiger shrimp for food. His last time he dislocated his upper jaw, and was never able to eat again. He tried for almost 5 weeks to eat, but he could not get anything in his mouth. I tried to re-set it (very dangerous, and painful), but as soon as he went to eat again, it would dislocated and he could not pick up the food.

[chrislee]

Do lions eat cleaner wrass?

[ACIDRAIN]

Lions will eat anything they can catch in their mouths. They will usually leave other live fish alone, as long as you keep them fed well. IMO the best tank mates for lions, are those they cannot fit into their mouths. So, IMO to answer your question, yes they will eat cleaner wrasses.