mandarin questions

[scoobasteve]

Hi. I am somewhat new to reefkeeping and since i setup my new tank i have been thinking it would be really awesome to have a mandarin goby. Only trouble is i hear they are hard to keep in good health and color and feeding them is tedious at best. I know they eat something called copeopods(spelling) and i was wondering if someone could tell me exactly what these pods are and how to best make sure they are in my tank before i add the goby.
I was hoping to keep a mandarin, an arce eyed hawkfish--mabye a hawian hawkfish, not sure yet, and a false percula along with a small cleanup crew.

[Drewcipher]

What size tank?

pods are little critters that live in your rock. They will be in your tank if you put live rock in. You can also get some from another reefer or buy some online. They take a while to establish though. Most people say to let your tank age for a year or so before putting in a mandarin. It also depends on the size of the tank. Mandarins often will not eat anythng but live, so if the tank is not big enough it won't be able to sustain enough pods to feed the fish.

[scoobasteve]

i wanted yo keep it in my 12g aquapod. The size of the fish looked about rite for this size tank, and i noticed they weren't all that active. However, being as i only have about ten pounds of live rock in the tank it probably wouldn't have enough food.
Can you buy live pods online?
Also, my water has been turning a little green lately. I havn't added any livestock yet, and its been cycling for about three weeks now. The actinic light on the hood blew the day i got the tank, and i am still waiting on th replacement. Could the absence of blue spectrum light be casuing the alage growth?

[Drewcipher]

Algae is going to grow at the start. Don't be discouraged, just keep doing water changes and watch the parameters. Yes you can buy pods online, but a 12g will not sustain a mandarin by itself. If you want to go this route, make sure that you buy the mandarin from a LFS and ask to see it eat frozen mysis shrimp. This way you can be sure it will eat prepared food.

[RocketSeason]

Mandrins are not for Nano tanks.

The Mandrin almost exclusively only eats copopods. These copopods thrive in live rock, however it usually takes about 75 lbs of live rock to support a population of pods large enough to feed a Mandrin.

there are places where pods can be purchased online, however these should only be used to "jump start" a pod population and not for feeding. Mandrins eat at a very lesurely pace and there is no gaurentee that pods purchased online will survive long enough for your mandrin to get around to eating it.

Most experieced reefers suggest a tank at least 75 gallons large with 75 lbs of live rock per Mandrin. It is also suggested that the tank be allowed to mature for perhaps 8-12 months to allow a significant population of pods to build up.

Most successful Mandrin keepers also have a large refugium connected to the system to allow pod populations to grow without fear of predation.

Finally, in a 12 gallon tank, I would not go with more than 2 fish. Perhaps a small clown and a firefish, or a clown and a golby. Arch-eye Hawks will get to large for the tank.

Sorry for the bad news...

-Matt

[chrisstie]

Melev has some very interesting info on Mandarins you should check out- if you can see that they will try mysis or pellets at the LFS they can be possibly kept.

[RocketSeason]

Even still, I wouldn't put one in a 12 gallon tank. Mandrins need room to move and scavenge.

To me, if I can't supply the optimal environment. I just don't do it.

[Doglover_50]

I agree with Rocket. apparently these fish do NOT survive well the trip to the LFS from the wild--I've read 90% die getting here. So in any case, I think responsible fish keeping would dictate a 70g or higher very well established tank to maximize chances for survival. Give them a look at your LFS--you'll see that many are famished from not getting their live food, and I don't think chancing it on a nano is warranted.

[gawf4fun]

Right you are Rocket. My attempt at keeping a mandarin in a 12 gallon with fuge that had been running for 2+ years lasted about 4 weeks. Had plenty of copepods growing in the fuge and all over the 15# LR. The mandarin cleaned them out fast. Ultimately, I had to return him to my LFS.

[Zeppelin52]

I have had a Green mandarin in my 20g for about 6 months and is been fat and happy the whole time. The tank is 1 yr old and i feed mysis 2 a week.

[majestic sea life]

i have a pair in my 18gal nano. But i have them eating mysis and brine 3-4 times a day. They need to be fed often and are slow eaters.

[scoobasteve]

thanks for all of your help. I really wanted a mandarin but but from the sound of it i should probably reconsider. I really want a goby in the tank though, Any idea or suggestions for 12g ready gobies? I aslo want t kepp a couple of anenomes. Should the stock 54w pc setup be ok?

[Henry22]

54watts of pc is not enough light to keep an anenome, and event though people keep the with pc lighting, metal halide is probaly better. Anenomes are also better for larger better maintained aquariums. Try a pistol shrimp and watchman goby pair, they would work well in a 12 gallon, and with weekly waterchanges, another small fish could be added, but that would be the limit.

[RocketSeason]

I was going to suggest the Watchman golby as well. Nearly as pretty and much easier to take care of in a small system.

Infact, I think I will be getting one myself!

[july865]

maybe you can get a tank bred mandarin. they are more sure to eat mysis or maybe there were trained on other foods.
IMHO we reefers should discourage LFS from purchasing "kidnapped fish" from the wild. but thats just me.

[majestic sea life]

mine breed alot. Its a PITA to keep the fry alive. i feed them to my pipefish and my 3 mantis shrimps lol.

[hgbarwick]

I wouldn't recomend a mandrian for a 12 gallon.

[RocketSeason]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7847313#post7847313 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by july865
maybe you can get a tank bred mandarin. they are more sure to eat mysis or maybe there were trained on other foods.

I haven't heard of tank-raised Mandarins. I don't think that feat has been accomplished yet.

-Matt

[jasutton]

i third the idea of a watchman/pistol pair. The amount of entertainment in those two is limitless. symbiosis at its best. I rue the day i had to give them away (rhyme??). but stupid apartment at the time charged me so...alas, no longer.

Go that route. less headache (in this hobby that says a lot) and you can still get some coral to go with it.

on a different note, you are much more responsible than i was. I never read up on stuff...just trusted my LFS. KUDOS to you. Less trial and error in this method :)

good luck!

[kass03]

Years ago I had a pair of mandarins in my 55 gal. that spawned every night when the actinics alone came on.
It was pretty cool and their eggs were pretty big I thought but I've never heard of anyone raising them either.

After a few years I lost the male and tried another but the female never spawned with that one.

I agree don't even try it in a 12 gal.
I also have a bullseye pistol which is pretty cool to watch. Had it around 8 or more yrs now and used to have a watchman with it.
The watchman I had around 9 yrs then it died.

Pistols do make a loud snapping noise like the glass cracking so if you do get one don't be alarmed when it scares the crap outa ya lol.

kass

[iku]

hm.. guys!! what if its a 46 gallon, but with a 12 gallon sump/fuge? (around.. 60 poundes of lr in total) would it be able to sustain 1 or maybe a pair of mandarins?

[jasutton]

even a 46 i wouldnt try, unless they eat prepared food. For what its worth, try cyclopeeze (the frozen) i have even gotten pipefish to eat that stuff, it's amazing. Also, becareful if you have more agressive eaters in the tank...the mandarins are pretty nonchalant when it comes to dinner.

good luck

[armagedon48]

get 80 watts pc or more and your good to go with a wide selection of corals.

gobies are great for small tanks, depending on the goby of course. mandarins are not gobys but dragonets.

some clownfish can live in 12 gallon tanks.

alot of damsels are available and do good in small tanks, multiples of less agressive species or 1 of the much more agressive kinds.

royal gramma does alright in the nano tanks.

firefish, firegoby, do good in any tank, but i recomend a lid for these guys, as i found my guy dried up behind the tank...

many interesting inverts that do well in small tanks, starfish are generaly not a great idea though. neither are flame scallops.

most marine fish can become agressive and fight for space, best to have alot of live rock and hiding space and most importantly IMO is to add all fish at the same time OR rearrange the rocks each time a new fish is added. (i almost lost my royal gramma due to this mistake, blue damsel and false perc can get nasty!)

[Ryanqk]

My green mandarin has been living for almost a year in my 30gl, but i keep a large population on copepodes and i have a refugium dedicated to raising a massive supply. Unless you want such a nice fish to die, dont put them in anything smaller than 30gl and be prepared to raise copepods in a nano to support him if it comes down to it.

[Zero-2-Sixty]

ive heard of them kept in a tank as small as a 29g, but if theres even a question in your mind that concerns your fishes mortality, air on the side of caution.