Tunze streams

[Michelle L]

Hello, me again..... :rolleyes:

Anyone have any recommendations about what combination of Tunze stream pumps that I should use on the tank we are setting up? (Pretty sure it's a 210 gallon) I had thought about a Wavebox but have only gotten so-so feedback on them.

I am thinking of using two 6060's. Should I go larger? Or, is two going to be overkill? We are planning to run a closed loop system with a spray bar, powered by a Dolphin 3000 pump.

[RV8tor]

Ever think about a surge box instead? I am thinking of replacing my return into a boreman surge device. I have to work out some details but I have seen tanks that a surge tank is all they use.

[brad23]

The Wave box is great and is the best flow of anything I've ever seen. But you do next extra flow

I will be running the wave box + Dart on my 180g closed loop

[Michelle L]

John, by surge box, you mean a box mounted at a higher level than the tank (I've had them described to me, but never seen one)? If so, I don't think I can use one because space is limited where I am placing the main tank. My living room has windows all around with very little wall space. I have no choice but to place the tank in front of a set of windows which means that mounting something above the water level isn't really possible.

Brad, have you also used the stream pumps in the past? I'd love to be able to talk to someone who has used both a Wavebox and the streams who can give me comparisons about each. I've never seen either in action so it's hard for me to get an idea of the capabilities of both.

[schmoeger6]

The wave box does not give you any flow, per say. It is designed to simulate wave motion, you will still need to use something for flow. I have seen several tanks with the wave box, and it is neat to watch, but imo not worth the money. In my opinion (I'm sure many will disagree) the streams are the way to go, but I would personally go with the 6000 or 6100 as they have an adjustable flow rate, the 6060 and 6080 don't

Yes the surge box mounts above the tank, and is much more impressive than the wave box. This is the route that I am going to go when I do my in wall project with a equipment room behind it. Rod (Rod's Reef) is the king of surge box's. He has them on all his tanks, and they are all DIY , very cheap compared to the Tunze, and much more impressive.

Hope this helps.

[Michelle L]

Yes, it helps very much! I had heard that wave boxes like you described were very awesome, but I just don't have the space to put one. :( Maybe in the next tank that we're already dreaming of....I think I enjoy the planning and setup phase more than the actual tank itself, so I am always thinking of the next tank to come.

Thanks for the info on the Tunze stream 6000 or 6100. For some reason, I hadn't caught that they were adjustable. I like that idea very much...that way I can't screw up and either just tickle my corals or go the other way and blow them off of the rocks. :D

[Katana_user]

Ask Roger ;)

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=92

[Benny Z]

i completely agree with schmoeger.

it's neat to watch the wave motion inside the tank, but it definately doesn't flow any ditritus up to the overflows. rather, it just suspends it in water, swishing it back and forth in the same general space.

imo the streams are the way to go for this reason. they will do a much better job of sending the crud to the overflow(s).

[Michelle L]

Well, while I like the idea of utilizing both a Wavebox and streams, I do have a budget to follow. Picking up the MH pendants, the skimmer, the pump, the tank, the stand, the live rock, the sump, the RO/DI unit (did I miss anything???) and all of the miscellaneous stuff that we need, all within a couple of months time...well, I open my wallet and all I get is a puff of dust. :D I sure wish I were handy and could build stuff like you guys do! :mad:

I think I will opt for the streams, and possibly think about a Wavebox later in the game. Thanks so much, everyone, for the help.....again!!

[brad23]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7520501#post7520501 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by schmoeger6
The wave box does not give you any flow, per say. It is designed to simulate wave motion, you will still need to use something for flow. I have seen several tanks with the wave box, and it is neat to watch, but imo not worth the money. In my opinion (I'm sure many will disagree) the streams are the way to go, but I would personally go with the 6000 or 6100 as they have an adjustable flow rate, the 6060 and 6080 don't

Yes the surge box mounts above the tank, and is much more impressive than the wave box. This is the route that I am going to go when I do my in wall project with a equipment room behind it. Rod (Rod's Reef) is the king of surge box's. He has them on all his tanks, and they are all DIY , very cheap compared to the Tunze, and much more impressive.

Hope this helps.

I have to disagree with this some what, the wave box suspends everything in the water column. It doesn't blow it around like a PH (Stream) would but no detritus gets a chance to settle anywhere.

Also all my SPS opened up twice as much once the wave box was put on. It's the best natural flow you can get and corals love it.

I run a Seio 820 all day and a mag 9.5 for the return and when the wave box came on in the morning all kinds of crud would get lifted up into the water column and suspended while the PH pushed it all over to the overflows so it could be flushed down into the sump and into a filter sock.

The Wave box moves the entire water column but genteelly where as a PH only gets a section of the tank.

The best combo for me would be the wavebox + a stream facing it you need the under water rip currents.

I have a 75g right now and ran two Seio 820s + return pump, the wave box + 1 Seio 820 and return pump is much a better combo on my tank and ever since I put the wave box on the tank all my SPS started looking better and there is less detritus build up on the rocks.

I’m not saying a Seio is as good as a Stream by any means but the wave box does a much better job with the above listed setup.

Which ever route you go with don’t buy the 6060 or the 6080, get the 6100. The 6000 or 6060 is too small of a PH for a 72 inch tank.

[brad23]

One more thing,

I wouldn't run closed loop with a spry bar in the back of the tank, the flow is to defused especially on a tank that big.

[schmoeger6]

The Wave box moves the entire water column but genteelly where as a PH only gets a section of the tank.

The best combo for me would be the wavebox + a stream facing it you need the under water rip currents.


I agree that is the best combo, but I thought she was asking which is better, the streams or the wave box. The wave box alone wouldn't cut it, but she could get by with just the streams, for now.

On a side note has anyone seen or used the Wave2K wave box that Marine Depot sells? They are about 1/2 the price of a Tunze. I've read mixed reviews about them, but it seams most of the negative was because they were set up incorrectly.

[brad23]

I'll also add to this that the wave box is to much flow for a 75g, I have to keep the power tunred all the way down.

She would need more than one stream in a 210g.

[Michelle L]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7520863#post7520863 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by brad23
One more thing,

I wouldn't run closed loop with a spry bar in the back of the tank, the flow is to defused especially on a tank that big.

How would it be too diffused if we are also adding the combos that are being discussed here? Wouldn't that also depend on the size of the pump pushing the rest of the system?

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

you lose alot of velocity wtih multiple holes, not to mention the extra piping and bends, when making a c.l. spray bar

one or the other - streams

[Benny Z]

michelle, i was going to say the same thing about the spray bar. i was biting my tongue because i don't want to shoot down your ideas. sometimes it's just best to try things and see how they work for yourself.

but i would agree with brad. i don't think a large spraybar is a good idea. ...especially if you are going with a large diameter pipe like guy was experimenting with at tmr (i'm assuming you saw that setup on the 75g). the pipe he was using was way too big to keep any pressure bulidup. you could try a spraybar with a smaller pipe and fewer holes if you want, but i really think strategically aimed nozzles would work better than a spraybar.

just my opinion.

[LegoZ81]

also if you are NOT going for the controllable streams for the wave action with the streams save yourself money and get the a Seio 2600s and then you can afford to get the wavebox also.
imho that would give a ton of flow in that tank and would make a great sps tank.
So far so go with my Seio's no adjustablily or back forth wave action but PLEANTY of water movement. keep in mind when dissing the the wavebox that this is how a wave moved in the ocean it's not a current (flow) of the water but a transfer of energy from molicule to molicule of water in a circular motion.

[brad23]

To be honest a manifold with outlets or drilling a load of holes in the tank is the only way closed loop should be done.

The spray bar is something I'd think about doing with my return pump.

Have you bought the Dolphin pump yet? Isn't it only rated at 3000gph? You might want to look at something bigger. Sequence makes good pumps for a closed loop setup.

[Michelle L]

Well heck, guys, this is why I ask questions. All I've ever dealt with was fish-only tanks, so all of this reef equipment is new turf for me. If there is a preferable setup to what I am thinking of, I'd sure rather know now than later, when all of my corals crap out because I didn't do it right the first time. Don't worry about hurting my feelings, because none of these are my ideas. I'm going off of what I've heard and read. It's tough to get a grasp on what is being discussed when you've never even seen the setups or the equipment being described, as I'm sure many of you know.

So, all of you are welcome to help me design this thing before I make mistakes. I tend to take a general consensus about what people think, then make my decisions.

I'd love to hear how each of you would set it up if you were in my shoes. :rollface:

[brad23]

There was a huge section on closed loop in Calfos old forum although I'm not sure where it is now.

[LegoZ81]

Well the door to my disorganized house is open ;)

[Michelle L]

Oops double post....

[Michelle L]

I keep hearing that I should come check out your tank. May I bring a camera?? :D

[LegoZ81]

Please do! lol

[Michelle L]

You name the day and time, LegoZ. I'll be there. (Well, except for this weekend. We're going to Chicago to visit The Living Sea.)

Uh.... OK, I have to speak up here....I see a few of you suggesting Seio. I've frequently read that Rio churns out total garbage. Has anyone tested the long-term durability of these pumps? Also, is the flow as dispersed as it is with a Tunze?

While I understand that they are considerably less $$$ than Tunze, I would rather spend $250 per pump and have them last, instead of paying $75 a pump and have them fry in a year.

[LegoZ81]

Brad has had his for quite a while not sure here as I only had mine for 3 mo or so. BTW new pics! check out the new thread :)

[Michelle L]

I'd love to hear that they are better quality than people say they are. You can't beat the price.

Is the water flow similarly diffused as the Tunze streams?

I'm on my way to the new thread right now! :)

[brad23]

I've had two of them for a year and never had a problem.

I know two other people that have had theirs for at least 8 months and as far as I know they have never had a problem.

I will say Seio's have good flow but they don't compare to a Tunze, not even close.

[ostrow]

Seios are not reliable at all, many threads here about them seizing and I had two that were totally and completely unreliable. Tunzes are expensive.

I disagree entirely about the wavebox critique above ... it moves a LOT of water and like a surge system will blow detritus off the rockwork anywhere near proximate to it.

But, all this said, I love my flow system, which you can see at www.ostrows.us

Basically, I have 2x maxijet stream mods mounted to used sea swirls I picked up. Total cost under $200. Each MJ Mod moves 1200GPH+, and if you are going barebottom you can get the 1.75" propeller that moves 3000GPH+.

On the swirls, the whole tank gets flow, and reasonably random.

[UH_OH_5_OH]

HEY MICHELLE L...sorry I was yelling......I don't know if you have seen them but in the DIY forum there is a Tunze mod that Dahn Nguyen makes for Maxi jets of almost any size that is super powerful and its only like $20.00 plus shipping. I have one now on my Maxijet 900 and it REEEEALLY kicks some serious flow. He will either show you how to build it on the thread or build it for you for the 20 spot.

Check it out...the thread id is 717034 ! I am going to have him make me one for a Maxijet 1200 next.

Just thought you might wanna check it out ! ! !

[ostrow]

Uh, yeah, that's what I was referring to. Or you can buy all the parts from mjmods.com and do the mod yourself now that it has been made easier (read the last few pages of the thread).

[kennethl]

will also urge you get a pair of 6100's. they use very little power (next to nothing for this hobby), very quiet, easily re positioned in the tank, and add almost no heat to the tank, feet of head ? whats that? My tank temp dropped from 89 to 81 when I went from external closed loop to Tunze. Everything in the tank immediatly did much better.

I would caution you away from the Anthony Calfo manifold or drilled closed loop. My experience was that they were pretty much complete opposite of Tunze. Sure, they were cheap to build initially, but you have to use a really large pump to overcome ft of head and still get the turn over.

I have lived the math.

Big external pump = big initial $ + (big watts /hr)

(big watts/hr) = high power bill + heat

heat = high tank temps

high tank temps + big tank = big chiller

big chiller = big puchase + more pluming + more pumps + even more power consumption.

when you add it all up it equals a headache, mo money mo money.. mo money, (much mo money then a pair of tunze), this is before the very disgruntled wife factors into the equation.

disgruntled wife = nights on couch + ((no sex)^3) + no dinners + ((no beer)^4).


for me, the tunze will pay for themselfs several times over, I wouldnt do a tank again with out them.

[Benny Z]

talk about insight...

thanks ken. you now have me reconsidering a cl for the 200.

[Michelle L]

Oh hey, cool, I'll check that thread out. Thanks!!

I also have a Rio (Not a Seio 2600, just a regular Rio) that I've been using for about a year or so. I picked it up at a LFS when the last pump I had unexpectedly died and I needed a larger pump ASAP. I've had no problems, but with their reputation, I keep expecting it to croak at any moment! :eek:

Thanks!

[Benny Z]

i took the small rios that i had at the bottom of my 29g out when i put the seio 820 in.

btw - my seio is silent and starts without hesitation every time. it is, however, just a few weeks old. i'm hoping this was out of a "new" batch. i've heard they fixed those problems recently.

[ostrow]

Benny: give it time. I promise you there will come a day in the next 2-3 months when you get home and the Seio will not be moving water. Or when you shut it off for whatever reason and can't get it going again.

The MJ as modified costs less, moves more water, starts every time, can be used on a wavetimer, uses less power and generates less heat, than any Tuzne or Seio.

[Benny Z]

i know all about the maxi-mods!

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=850399&highlight=maxioops

granted, my experience isn't typical.

i'll let you know if and when the seio fails.

also, my seio is "rated" less watts than my mj-1200 was. ...although your guess is as good as mine for "actual" used watts.

[brad23]

I don't know if it was the early models of Seios that had problems but I know 6+ people running them that have never had a problem. But there are a lot of people who have had issues with them so I don't know.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

the maxi-mods are nice....BUT the 1200 does not put out 1200+

IMO:
1200 - 950-1050gph
900 - 650-800 gph

...i've used both and these are my feeling after also using seios 820, 1100, 1500, 2600, and Tunze 6060's, 6080's and 6100's

[ostrow]

EAGLES it all depends on what propeller you use and how the shroud is cut. If done right, it moves more.

I can personally attest that my MJ 1200 mod moves as much water as a Tunze 6060. That is with a mid-sized prop. The larger prop, which I also have, I can't use. It moves far more than a Seio 2600, which I also owned, based on sand displacement distance at identical pump placement. The Seio doesn't even compare.

[brad23]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7528996#post7528996 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kennethl
will also urge you get a pair of 6100's. they use very little power (next to nothing for this hobby), very quiet, easily re positioned in the tank, and add almost no heat to the tank, feet of head ? whats that? My tank temp dropped from 89 to 81 when I went from external closed loop to Tunze. Everything in the tank immediatly did much better.

I would caution you away from the Anthony Calfo manifold or drilled closed loop. My experience was that they were pretty much complete opposite of Tunze. Sure, they were cheap to build initially, but you have to use a really large pump to overcome ft of head and still get the turn over.

I have lived the math.

Big external pump = big initial $ + (big watts /hr)

(big watts/hr) = high power bill + heat

heat = high tank temps

high tank temps + big tank = big chiller

big chiller = big puchase + more pluming + more pumps + even more power consumption.

when you add it all up it equals a headache, mo money mo money.. mo money, (much mo money then a pair of tunze), this is before the very disgruntled wife factors into the equation.

disgruntled wife = nights on couch + ((no sex)^3) + no dinners + ((no beer)^4).


for me, the tunze will pay for themselfs several times over, I wouldnt do a tank again with out them.

It's all down to how you want it, most don't have the issues listed above if they did no one would do a closed loop system.

If anything PH heat the water up a lot more than a external pump, that and they are big and ugly.

[brad23]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7529723#post7529723 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ostrow
EAGLES it all depends on what propeller you use and how the shroud is cut. If done right, it moves more.

I can personally attest that my MJ 1200 mod moves as much water as a Tunze 6060. That is with a mid-sized prop. The larger prop, which I also have, I can't use. It moves far more than a Seio 2600, which I also owned, based on sand displacement distance at identical pump placement. The Seio doesn't even compare.

I don't care what anyone else says no hacked up maxi jet puts out flow liike a Tunze it might put out the same GPH but it doesn't have flow like a Tunze which is much more spread out.

[ostrow]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7529759#post7529759 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by brad23
It might put out the same GPH but it doesn't have flow like a Tunze which is much more spread out.

This simply factually incorrect. The diameter of the shroud I have on my pump is only minimally smaller than that on the 6060. There are two MJ mods. The one with the output just "hacked off" as you put it, you are correct and the flow is much less.

The MJ Stream mod though looks and performs very much like the Tunze stream and better than the Seio in my experience (not opinion, experience).

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

i am speaking of the stream mods.....they do not compare to tunze in the pattern of the flow and do not put out 1600gph like a tunze 6060 - IME

[ostrow]

Well, you either used too small a prop, used the flex airline of the old mod, or used too small a shoud with too few/too small openings.

You put the 1.75" Dumas propeller on there, and you are pushing 3000 GPH, and put a large shroud on there, you have a great, diffuse pattern.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

well you are entitled to your opinion as am I ;)
...also the yare not controllable, which is a BIG +
- imo

[brad23]

Michelle is probably more confused than anything else now.

Really when it comes to asking for help here or at the LFS your going to get something different from everyone.

Your best bet is to research as much as you can and chose what you want to go with. You can always change it later.

[Benny Z]

imho and ime the seio 820 puts out more flow than my maxi-stream mod did. i was using the smaller prop.

[ostrow]

Controllable no, but for the Tunze contollables with the controllers you are talking serious money, and Michelle (remember Michelle?) is on a budget as are many of us. And I would only recommend the controllable Tunzes. The Tunze 6060/6080s also seize or have a tendency to do so, those "brakes" as they call them are definitely a weak link on that pump. The more expensive models don't have that issue though.

Unlike the Tunzes and Seios the Maxijets are safely used on regular old wavemakers/wavetimers. And they have a long, long history of running like tanks. They don't stop.

So, Michelle, the wavebox and a controllable 6100 or 6200 will give you awesome flow, the warranty and service from Tunze, and set you back nearly $800.

The Seios will give you, most likely, headaches.

The MJ Mods require some DIY or buy the mods from an experienced maker (as did I but in future will do my own as it has become easy with the new method). Much, much less expensive but no warranty. Small profile and safely run on wavemakers.

If I had the cash, I'd get a wavebox.

But I'd still go MJ Stream over Tunze. Even if flow is a tad less (which isn't true if you use the big propeller) and pattern is slightly less diffuse (which I grant), at $40 vs. $300+, it's a no-brainer to me. If you see the top video on my website, you'll see the great flow of these mounted on sea-swirls. The Tunze is heavy, I had a 6060 on there before I got my MJ mod and was worried it would strip the gears over time. The MJs are feather-light and the swirls don't even get warm. Keep your eyes open on RC and you'll find used swirls in the $70 range or even less (but I got real lucky there).

[Michelle L]

Ooooo, I'm going to need some time later on tonight when I can sit and soak this info into my pea brain before I respond. :D

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7530018#post7530018 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ostrow
Controllable no, but for the Tunze contollables with the controllers you are talking serious money, and Michelle (remember Michelle?) is on a budget as are many of us. And I would only recommend the controllable Tunzes. The Tunze 6060/6080s also seize or have a tendency to do so, those "brakes" as they call them are definitely a weak link on that pump. The more expensive models don't have that issue though.

Unlike the Tunzes and Seios the Maxijets are safely used on regular old wavemakers/wavetimers. And they have a long, long history of running like tanks. They don't stop.

So, Michelle, the wavebox and a controllable 6100 or 6200 will give you awesome flow, the warranty and service from Tunze, and set you back nearly $800.

The Seios will give you, most likely, headaches.

The MJ Mods require some DIY or buy the mods from an experienced maker (as did I but in future will do my own as it has become easy with the new method). Much, much less expensive but no warranty. Small profile and safely run on wavemakers.

If I had the cash, I'd get a wavebox.

But I'd still go MJ Stream over Tunze. Even if flow is a tad less (which isn't true if you use the big propeller) and pattern is slightly less diffuse (which I grant), at $40 vs. $300+, it's a no-brainer to me. If you see the top video on my website, you'll see the great flow of these mounted on sea-swirls. The Tunze is heavy, I had a 6060 on there before I got my MJ mod and was worried it would strip the gears over time. The MJs are feather-light and the swirls don't even get warm. Keep your eyes open on RC and you'll find used swirls in the $70 range or even less (but I got real lucky there).


disagree whole-hartedly ;)

i have used 2-6060's for 2 years with not one restart problem...but the four different maxistream modded's and the countless seio's have had 'many' restart problems...

[ostrow]

Funny. I had 3 6060 "drive shafts" fail on me.

We agree on the Seios at least Eagles!!!

You are the first person I've heard to have a Maxijet not start. Some have had problems using airline tubing on the mod but with the rigid tubing nobody is having problems anymore. The mod is better now.

[ahenson]

I just added a Tunze 6000 and multicontroller and I love the way everything looks. It is adjustable, looks better and my tank looks better. I can't wait to add the second tunze and replace a seio 1500. Thae tunze are controllable so the can make the water pulse, the seio pushes a lot of water but is difficult to position or control. If you can afford it buy the streams and the multicontroller. It really makes things simple. I bought mine used and there are deals out there if you are patient.

[hounddog01]

I have a seio 820. Used it and it produced good flow. bought a Tunze 6060 and it is the best water mover I have seen for its rating. It moves lots of water in a very wide and open stream. I have a 90 so my tank is 4'. I have not had any issues with the Seio and it is well over 6 months old. I clean mine every month, that could be the difference.

Michelle, the wave box is and 2 6100 streams would be the coolest system you could have. Since I bought my Tunze I would never buy any thing else. If you can not afford all of this, I understand it is expensive. I would get the streams a but make sure you plan for a wave box. I would shoot it behind the rocks so you can mount it in the back corner. I have seen this combo work in a tank, one of the nicest coral tanks I have ever seen and it is the best thing you could buy.

[Katana_user]

I'm a fan of Tunze equipment. I've now run a 6060 for 11 + months without a hitch so far. Never failed a restart, never stopped unexpectedly, never needed cleaned. I'll be cleaning mine this month or next to get the pink coraline off it. Best water mover I've had yet. And a 6000 controlable will replace it when the time comes.

And Tunze equipment generally carries a 2 year warranty. What's the warranty on Seio or MJ?

You pretty much get what you pay for in this hobby. And sometimes buying cheap costs you dearly. :rollface:

[Michelle L]

Well thank you all very much. I am glad that I posted this question, because I think it brought forth a lot of interesting conversation and debate.

I have decided to go with the Tunzes. And, no disrespect is intended to anyone who suggested otherwise. Many of you can take so-so pumps and do the modifications that you speak of and have whippin' pumps. I'm just not all that handy, so I have to do what I have to do. :) I'll buy two, but they will have to be purchased one at a time!!

The Wavebox is planned. Once we sell our 125, that will free up some extra cash for me to put towards one.

Again, thank you everyone. You all go out of your way and take time out of your schedules to help people like me, whom most of you have never even met, without even questioning it. I just want to let you all know how much it's appreciated.

Ok now, awwww, *group hug*!!

[ostrow]

Good luck and enjoy! I didn't make my MJ mods either ... .bought htem from the initiator of the mod.... Love em.

Anyway, Tunzes are great if pricey. Do yourself a favor if you go that route. Get the conrollable ones. 6000 or above. Or, even better, if you are spending that kind of money, get the Vortech at $345, adjustable from 0 to 3000 GPH. Can't beat that. People who have them (they are new) love them. Search on that too. Nobody in CIMA mus thave them

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

wait on the vortechs until the controller and angle mount are distributed-imo

if going tunze do yourself a favor like ostrow said and get the controllable ones....you can buy 6000's and then if you want more upgrade them to 6100's for like $70 each with a new part added to your existing 6000's ;)

the newest model maxi-modded 1200's with a proper propellar would be the equivalent of a tunze 6060, or close to it, so if you can buy them already modded for $50 each or less, you might be better off doing that than getting uncontrollable tunze 6060's
....i own 2-6060's and one 6100, and wish so badly i had another 6100 in place of the 6060's

-jmo(*although i could sell you my 2-6060's and spend more and get another 6100 ?)

[ostrow]

Angle mount if it happens will make it better.

[Michelle L]

Yeah, I definetely like the idea of controllable flow. That's the way I will go.

[LegoZ81]

Glad you have the cash to go for the big boys!
This DEFINIATELY makes it a better setup over the Seio's just pricey is all:
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=TZTS07
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_searchstatistics.asp?SearchStr=tunze&action=view&idProduct=TZTS12 (3175 gph)
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_searchstatistics.asp?SearchStr=tunze&action=view&idProduct=TZ1319 (5283gph ~same amount of flow as me with the 2 Seio's, but controllable.)
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_searchstatistics.asp?SearchStr=tunze&action=view&idProduct=TZTS24 (6350gph 2 pumps (best for wave simulation))

[Michelle L]

Oh Louis, if only I had the cash....!! :D Hubby is a full-time student, and I'm working while he's in school. When he's finished, I get to go back full-time. Until then, cash will be scarce at times. We have the luxury of just having sold our house and we made some equity, so we chose to put some of it towards something we both enjoy and stash the rest for a rainy day. The rest of the tank equipment that we are buying now is going to hurt because we've went overbudget, but I want to do this project right the first time.

While we're in school, I won't have a lot of spare change to buy new pumps should one fail, thus my decision to buy Tunze now, in the hope that they'll function well and last the long-term. I hope to buy the 6100 kit that comes with two pumps and all of the goodies here in the next couple of months.

[hcs3]

i can't believe anyone would pay that much money for p-heads that litter the aquarium :p

my vote goes with the closed loop.

$900 internal tunze for 6300gph or $750 (including plumbing) for 10,000gph external sequence.

[LegoZ81]

you can buy a ton of seio's for that price though ;)
12 of the 2600's actually ;) even if 2 die a year you still have 6 years worth of pumps ;) lmao

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

that pump is louder and to me, seeing the pvc return nozzles in the corners is just the same as a couple black tunzes that can fade fairly well against a black back wall
...not to mention the worlds better type of flow you would get, being far more dispersed and controllable

seio's do not have as good of a flow pattern and the 2600's are huge even when modded....and their 2600gph is not comparable to tunze's 3000gph - ime....plus they aren't controllable yet and when they are you have to spend $ on the controller

-jmo

[LegoZ81]

still even with the controller purchases (if one actually ever show up on shelves) it at it's high point is supposed to be 200 bux 170+200 = 370 < $900 for the tunze...
It's all still about the controllability and the fact that only low voltage is in the tank with the high end Tunze.
Tunze does make a good product period, I am not disputing that. However, will I buy that product, or recommend that product for the rediculious premium they are charging for it? No.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

i do agree they are raking reefers over the coals, but their product is second to none so they can :(

But, given other choices i do and will recc. tunze's and i am by no means a wealthy man...just worth it(comparatively) - imo

[LegoZ81]

BTW this hobby is only expensive because people will pay it! If no one bought $907 worth of powerheads Tunze would charge less for them or go out of business. There is a downside to this though, if you force companies to compete there comes a point where quality will suffer. However that point is WAY under 900 dollars for this trio of parts.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

i agree...

[LegoZ81]

so quit being an enabler ;) lmao anyway beack to our regularly scheduled programming.
Michelle has plenty of info to go off of here imo to make/stick to her descision. :)

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7553031#post7553031 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by E-A-G-L-E-S
i do agree they are raking reefers over the coals, but their product is second to none so they can :(

[Michelle L]

Sticking to my guns. :) I've made a decision, I'll stand by it now.

Henry, I chose not to go with a closed loop (which was my original plan) because with my stand height, I need to have a short skimmer under it. I chose the Shorty Compact by Aqua-Medic which will be plumbed externally from the sump/fuge. That would mean I'd had to have used the higher flow Dolphin pump that I was going to originally purchase to run the closed loop, and then run a separate line to the sump with another slower pump, because I want a nice slow flow through the sump/fuge so that I can grow bazillions of pods and for water purification.

I decided to buy a lower flow pump and run only the skimmer and a line back to the tank from the sump/fuge, and to use the Tunzes for flow. I am planning an SPS tank so I need flow.

Does any of that make sense? Like I said, it's Monday on a Tuesday for me. :confused:

[Benny Z]

hey, who ever said drilling through the wall for plumbing and building a small "closet" on the outside of that side of your house for equipment was out of the question?

:D

[hcs3]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7552939#post7552939 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by E-A-G-L-E-S that pump is louder and to me,

well, i realize you can't hear a tunze mostly becaue they are internal, but i can't hear my sequence, either. my single mak4 is louder than both sequences. with all 3 running, i only hear the mak4.

seeing the pvc return nozzles in the corners is just the same as a couple black tunzes that can fade fairly well against a black back wall

if you can see the input pvc, you are not creative enough ;) regardless, white or black, both will be purple in a couple months if you know what you are doing.

...not to mention the worlds better type of flow you would get, being far more dispersed and controllable

i don't agree with this. i can spread out 11,000gph in an 8' aquarium easier than 6300gph for sure.

[Michelle L]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7553370#post7553370 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Benny Z
hey, who ever said drilling through the wall for plumbing and building a small "closet" on the outside of that side of your house for equipment was out of the question?

:D

My landlord, that's who said!! :D

[w2]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7553370#post7553370 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Benny Z
hey, who ever said drilling through the wall for plumbing and building a small "closet" on the outside of that side of your house for equipment was out of the question?

:D

Or just use the pantry in the kitchen. Right, Henry? :D :lol:

[hcs3]

what pantry?

[dkh0331]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7547212#post7547212 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Michelle L
Oh Louis, if only I had the cash....!! :D Hubby is a full-time student, and I'm working while he's in school. When he's finished, I get to go back full-time. Until then, cash will be scarce at times. We have the luxury of just having sold our house and we made some equity, so we chose to put some of it towards something we both enjoy and stash the rest for a rainy day. The rest of the tank equipment that we are buying now is going to hurt because we've went overbudget, but I want to do this project right the first time.

While we're in school, I won't have a lot of spare change to buy new pumps should one fail, thus my decision to buy Tunze now, in the hope that they'll function well and last the long-term. I hope to buy the 6100 kit that comes with two pumps and all of the goodies here in the next couple of months.

You will be happy with the streams. I have two 6100's in my 110 that replaced a number of powerheads, including 3 Seio's. More flow for less electricity, moonlight on the 7095, feeding timer - it's all good shtuff.

Now that you have decided on the streams, are you going to use the standard mounting device or looking at other options? Tunze has their own magnet mount - or there is an alternative magnet mount for less $$$$$. I opted for the deco rocks. It does add up, but IMPHO, the deco rocks are so much nicer in appearance.

Good luck to you and your hubby w/ the tank and school

David

ISU Alum

[Michelle L]

Thanks for the info. :)

I had been planning on the magnets, but hadn't really looked at the deco rocks. I've seen them listed online but didn't know what they were. How do they work?

[dkh0331]

http://wetwebfotos.com/usermedia/high/5/1695_42.jpg

I have mine in the lower corners. this pic was taken right after I completed my rock cooking, so that's why all my LR is white. LR and stream rocks are all purpling up nicely now.

HTH

David

[Michelle L]

Wow, you can hardly see them!

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

I think it would look rough if your l.r. was already corraline covered until they themselves do, but they do hide them nicely.
-jmo

[dkh0331]

Noticeable for a short period of time. After a couple weeks, purple patches started to appear. Short term of being noticeable for a couple of months IMPHO is worth the long haul of not having to look at big black powerheads day in/day out for many years.

David

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

with a black background they can blend in pretty well though - imo

[hcs3]

how do you take them out for cleaning? seems like you'd have to have easy access or tear apart the aquascaping.

[brad23]

Who cleans?

[dkh0331]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7560552#post7560552 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by hcs3
how do you take them out for cleaning? seems like you'd have to have easy access or tear apart the aquascaping.

Correct. You do have to be careful when aquascaping so you can have access to the pumps. Ms. DKH did the aquascaping and didn't understand that concept at first.

David

[hcs3]

yeah, i couldn't deal with that given my aquascaping technique. i thorite my LR into wacky positions.

[andycook]

Speaking of which, Henry do you have a picture?

[dkh0331]

"thorite"

did someone have one too many rare beers already? If so, please pass one this way. :D

My wife had a bunch of rocks stacked on it. Once I fully explained, again, and this time she actually listened, she understood and moved some things around. Now I just pick up the rocks, turn them upside down and pull the stream out. Actually very painless and less of a hassle then dealing with suction cups, etc.

David

[hcs3]

andy,

no photos yet.

http://www.chargar.com/Products/prod_mf.html

in short, thorite is neutral pH (aka doesnt mess with our aquarium pH), high alkaline value (aka grows coraline VERY fast), fast setting (in 10 minutes it is rock solid) and sets underwater (can patch or create structure in a filled aquarium).

IOW, thorite is gods gift to those of us that know how to aquascape. the rest of you just stack rocks.

p.s. is there such a thing as too much rare beer?

[andycook]

Stacking rocks so they don't fall is a gift. Besides, there's no thorite in a real reef

too much of a rare beer, never!

[Benny Z]

so there're glass walls around a real reef?

:D

[smorrow5773]

Where did you get the thorite, I looked the other day online, but it costs alot to ship. Have you found local?

[hcs3]

i buy mine at my local prairie central facility. they keep it in stock in the office. whoever sells mixed cement in B/N should also sell it in your area.

HTH

[brad23]

Nice tank setup so far and nice meeting you today.

[Michelle L]

Thanks Brad, it was great meeting you as well. :)