question about Kalkwasser, little leary

[pufferpoison]

ok i'm a little leary to add kalkwasser because i've heard bad things about it. I can't get my calcium up past 375 (adding 21 drops to test tube to get it to change blue AP test)

so i've mixed up so kalkwasser but don't have any way other than taking a cup and slowly adding some that way or maybe to drip it through a siphon air tubing setup?

Is this article correct? http://www.reefscapes.net/articles/breefcase/kalkwasser.html

also i made 1 gallon of ro/di water and added 2 teaspoons of kent marine kalkwasser. how much can i add to my tank (1 cup, 2 cups....etc) the directions WERE NOT clear about that. Thanks in advance.

[iCam]

I made a cheap kalk dripper, but it worked well:
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/23374dripper_002.jpg

Your best bet is to slowly drip it. If it's added too quickly,it can throw your pH off, et cetera, or cause a "snowstorm" if some precipitates out.

[Bandsaw]

As iCam said. You will want to add slowly. I use mine as top off water. I use a float switch that activates when the sump water drops 1/8". When the pump starts (MajiJet 1200 choked back with a ball valve), it takes about 2 minutes to raise the water level back up. My PH spikes locally in the sump to about 8.6 during dosing then drops off rapidly. My main tank never exceeds 8.3 at the peek PH.

That being said, lime water is a good meaure the maintain Alk and Ca. It is not really a good way to increase your Ca. You say that you can not get your Ca above 375. Do you know what your Alk and Mg levels are? If not start with testing both parameters and get back to us.

These may also be of help;

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/feb2003/chem.htm

[pufferpoison]

alk (if this is the same as KH) is 11, don't have a mag test yet.

ok finally tried a 9oz. cupful of kalkwasser last night, just put it in the cup, set it on top of the lights and added a airline siphon with a shut off valve set to drip 3 drops per second. Tested the Calcium and ph today and was at 8.2 ph and 411.7 Calcium. So something happened with the kalkwasser

[Billybeau1]

I dont drip. I mix a gallon of ro/di with two tsps kalk. I put two cups in the morning and 2 cups at night. This only raises ph about .05 at a time which is fine. You just dont want too raise ph too much at one time.

I also agree with the mag test. Low mag will give you problems maitaining calcium. If you are using IO salt, you probably have low mag.

[pufferpoison]

yep IO i do have some strotium and magnesium from kent marine. Should i be adding this more than stated on bottle?

[Bandsaw]

I would test for Mg first. Generally speaking, you should never dose anything that you have not tested for.

You are adding Mg now on a regular basis? If you Ca stays above 400 now with the lime water, then bonus.

[bertoni]

Trying to raise calcium very much with limewater tends to lead to problems because limewater has a high pH, even with vinegar added. The alkalinity level in the tank will rise along with the calcium level, too. What is the current alkalinity level?

[pufferpoison]

totally my bad it's not magnesium that i'm dosing, it's strotium and molybdenum not magnesium. I don't have any place around here that sells magnesium test kits.

[pufferpoison]

the alkalinity (which i've asked this question about 4 times on here without an answer) is it the same as KH (carbonated Hardness) if so my KH is 11, thus it takes 11 drops to turn the finished color from the test tube. I use Aquarium Pharmicuticals test tube tests.

[Bandsaw]

Yes, Alkalinity is the measure of carbonate hardness. At least that is one way of looking at it. Elevin Kh is near the top end of where you want it.

[Bandsaw]

bertoni can probably explain the chemistry behind how Magnesium works better than I. The best way that I can explain it is magnesium is the glue that hold the Alk and Ca together in a good marriage. A stabilizer if you will.

I also use instant ocean salt and I was in the same boat that you are. I could not get my calcium up to save my sole. After learning about magnesium and its effect, I ordered in a test. I found my Mg level around 900ppm. Natural seawater is somewhere in the neighborhood of 1350ppm. At the time, I added Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulfate Hyptahydrate). In no time, my Ca levels came up to a more balanced number with respect to my Alk level. I use Randy's improved Mg plan now as my Mg supplement.

As I said, I'm no expert, from my personal experience; I would look into ordering in a Magnesium test kit.

I also second bertoni on using lime water to increase Ca or Alk. Limewater is a good way to maintain a balanced Ca/Alk. However, to balance where you want it, I would look at using a separate Ca or Alk supplement.

By the way, FYI if your Alk is at 11 DKh, the balanced Ca level would be 440 ppm.

Here is some more happy reading

Magnesium in Reef Aquaria
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/oct2003/chem.htm

This calculator is also useful

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chem_calc3.html

[bertoni]

Those articles should help. Magnesium helps keep calcium in solution by poisoning the surface of crystals as they form, preventing further deposition. At least, that's what I remember.

I agree that the alkalinity is fine but shouldn't go much higher. I would suggest a calcium chloride product as the best way to raise calcium without raising alkalinity. Most of the calcium-only supplements should be fine.

[pufferpoison]

well you guys are great. I've posted some ASAP questions on the mushroom forum and after 2 days haven't got an answer on my questions. I will order tehe MAG test. Would it help if i switched to Reef Crystals brand salt? i've been thinking about doing that anyway. Let me know Thanks

[PatMayo]

Also I would not add any other additives. For instance you say you were dosing strotium and molybdenum, I can't strss enough the importance of dosing only what you can test for. Most of that stuff is trace elements and most trace elements are in the salt mix that you use to make your water.

If you do regular periodic water changes those trace elements will be replenished.

I only dose alkalinity, Calcium and magnesium. But I have test kits for all those things.

I think it's solid advice and taking this advice will likely keep your critters out of hot water.

Regards,

Pat

[bertoni]

Reef Crystals is a fine product. I'm not sure what the cost difference is between that and IO, though.

[pufferpoison]

less than $10 per 160G worth of salt. From my other costs, basically nothing.

[Billybeau1]

Reef Crystals has more calcium and magnesium than IO. Alk is about the same. It's a fine upgrade for the price IMO.

[worlds under]

do you know the mg prams on reef crystals??? Billybeau1? or anyone??

[Billybeau1]

The last time I tested mag on RC 1.023 it was 1290 according to my salifert so at 1.026 should be a little higher.

[worlds under]

thanks Billybeau1