Hands in your tank

[Randall_James]

Anthony Calfo brought up some interesting points in another thread and it had to do with skimmers, constancy and of all things how bad you disrupt life by putting your hands in the tank. The oils and other assorted who knows what ends up in tank and it knocks the head right of the skimmate.

It renders the skimmer ineffective for some time depending on how bad the contamination was. In short not good.

So anonymously, answer the average number of days your tank goes without your ungloved hands go in tank. (Washing your hands does not count. Only full length gloves do)

[Shoestring Reefer]

Every other day. I'm not running a skimmer these days.

[Bomber]

Washing your hands does not count.

Why does washing your hands not count?

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by Bomber
Why does washing your hands not count? Regardless of how much your scrub, you will still loose oil, hairs, moisture, skin cells, and you still subject yourself to any one of number of bacteria, parasites or other bad things.

[jasper24]

Everyday no skimmer. I do make sure my hands are clean. I have seen 0 ill effects.

[pili]

Everyday with skimmer. I tried using those aquagloves but they were just too thick and i kept on knocking things over. Couldnt grab anything small either.

[lil_fishey]

about 2xs a week for me i but when i do its just to put somthing back into place that a tubo has nocked off or somthing

[ReeferAl]

I use gloves whenever I can, especially if rearranging the rock work. I use a long handled grabber when possible. If I'm doing any fine work like mounting a frag I go gloveless. I voted once a week, but those days my hands may be in quite a few times.
Allen

[Aquaguru]

I'm about twice a week for random things like putting somehting back that fell or just moving stuff around.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

2x a week to hand feed corals......also when a coral falls(random)

[TippyToeX]

As little as possible. I use a turkey baster to feed corals and fish, rarely use my hands. :)

[stevedola]

R U serious?
dont put your hands in my tank? i think calfo is taking things alittle too far. I mean I dont put my hands in my tank will chez wiz and chilli hanging off of them but a quick rinse and Ive never had any problems over the 4 years of reefin.

[zapata41]

wow i voted once a week and that is rare at that, since everything i running nice now, i rarely put my hands in the tank at all. maybe once a month to give it a good glass cleaning but thats it. it used to be like everyday when i was stocking the tank and moving stuff, ut now that most everythign is encrusted i dont have to move much at all. and now that i have a ca reactor, i rarely even go into the sump room, used to be a few times a day and now it is every other day and sometimes more.

Tim

[my2girls]

Twice a week or so. Used to be every day but since I get my mouth washed out with skimmate when I do, I've cut way back. :D

[Saltz Creep]

Is there anyone here who never puts their hands in their tank but just hires someone to do it? C'mon and fess up. We'll find you sooner or later.:hammer:

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by my2girls
Twice a week or so. Used to be every day but since I get my mouth washed out with skimmate when I do, I've cut way back. :D No way!! OMG Fear Factor Juice.....

I am about every other day, I am going to either stay out of the tank or get some gloves. The quoted improvements in skimmate consistancy is enough to motivate me. My effluent output is up and down all the time.

[lil_fishey]

^that would be somthing they would do on fear factor they do some weird stuff on there lol^

[ACBlinky]

As seldom as possible. I use a homemade 24" pipette that reaches right to the bottom of my tanks to feed corals and fish and a magfloat to deal with algae on the glass. During water changes I do my best not to stick my fingers in the water and generally handle the filter media with gloves if I'm rinsing it off in a bucket. The rock in my nano is wedged in pretty tight and the corals are all glued down (to prevent the turbo from sending them flying) so it's not often I have to go in and move rock or corals. If an Astraea falls and can't get up, I use the pipette and magfloat to try and right it again. Not only do I not want to stop my skimmer or upset the inhabitants with anything that might come off my hands, I also react very strongly to many corals. The less contact, the better it is for all of us :)

[gina6one9]

i have a question.... how many people swim in the ocean? our oceans are dirtier and they somehow find a way to strive. i ain't goign to lie.... almost everyday.

[ShannonT]

I too have tried the aquagloves and they are just too big for my little hands. I don't actually touch anything with my hands. I flip over snails with long forceps or a turkey baster.

My cleaner shrimp seems to enjoy my hands. :)

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by gina6one9
i have a question.... how many people swim in the ocean? our oceans are dirtier and they somehow find a way to strive. i ain't goign to lie.... almost everyday. You are kidding right? You are talking about a closed system fish tank here. You perspire into the tank when ever you put your hands in. That amount is measurable. It has a pretty profound effect on the skimmers ability to work, just watch the thing.

The ocean has relative to your fish tank, an infinite amount of water. You can bury entire continents in it and never know it.

:D

[Brandon's Reef]

i hate putting my hands in the tank and adding oils and phos. i cringe at the thought

[tabndust]

i still have a prob with everyday feeling the need to feel saltwater fun down my arm! it is a serious problem that i hope ends soon im tired of getting in trouble for dirtying all dish rags!

[Azurel]

I voted every other day...I have never noticed a drop in skimmate...Alwasy seems to be a full cup every other day or so....

[leeweber85]

I didn't vote because Im not exactly sure.... I have gloves and wear them some times... but when im just reaching in to feed the tang I usually don't wear them.

[Lunchbucket]

why do you not have a section for never? i NEVER EVER NEVER touch my water w/ bare hands.

why?
a) i don't want to catch anything from my tank
b) i don't want to put anything in there on accident
c) i don't want to "kill" the foam in my skimmer.

just a better practice to ALWAYS use gloves IMO. how many times do we have stuff on our hands that we don't know about? how bout people with wedding rings? soap or other contaminents could be in or under them...not much but still we stive for health.

Lunchbucket

[Gwoardnog]

Every day, gotta feed the fish and anemone's somehow. Plus it's fun to touch the hammer corals, they're so soft. lol, I'm bad.

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by Lunchbucket
why do you not have a section for never? i NEVER EVER NEVER touch my water w/ bare hands.

Lunchbucket I guess I did not count on anyone being on that list. I suppose that thought of someone finding the true Zen of salt water tanks never occurred to me.

As you bask in nirvana, and I am slopping around in my tank like a fool, I will keep a manual list of the "Never" club. Thanks for breaking my list Lunchbucket :LOL:

I am working on getting to the never list. I understood that what I was doing was wrong, but I had no idea how wrong it was until I sat an thought it thru for a bit. (hmm senses a 12 step program)

[Saltz Creep]

Originally posted by Lunchbucket
why do you not have a section for never? i NEVER EVER NEVER touch my water w/ bare hands.
why?

a) i don't want to catch anything from my tank

Yeah, like Mycobacterium marinus (http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-07/sp/feature/index.php)


http://www.nbat.nl/visuals2/granuloom2.jpg
http://www.nbat.nl/visuals2/granuloom1.jpg
http://www.cdc.gov/NIOSH/images/derm077.gif
http://dermnetnz.org/bacterial/img/atyp-mb.jpg
http://www.umm.edu/images/ency/fullsize/mycobacterium_marinum_infection_on_the_hand_2337.jpg
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-07/sp/feature/images/DonTuttlesFinger.jpg

[kabboord]

I put my face in every morning; beats coffee.

[Gwoardnog]

yum

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by stevedola
R U serious?
dont put your hands in my tank? i think calfo is taking things alittle too far. I mean I dont put my hands in my tank will chez wiz and chilli hanging off of them but a quick rinse and Ive never had any problems over the 4 years of reefin. Can you say "Scroll up" ? Thanks Saltz Creep, I am sure I will sleep much better knowing what ever happened to that guy could not possibly happen to me. EEYUK......

[Andrew]

My fingers only go into the tank when I hand feed.

[romanr]

I would like to keep my hands out but it seems impossible. When I do, I take off rings, etc. and wash my hands with soap and rinse like a maniac. I then use fresh saltwater to rinse my hands prior to insertion. About catching things, I'm not worried. If you have dogs, kids, etc. then you have subjected yourself to far worse things in my opinion.

[kirstenk]

I am the worst offender of this practice but my tanks have not shown any obvious ill effects. I am sooo bad I conducted my own little experiment.

I took some 0 TDS water and put it into a 7/11 64oz big gulp cup, swiched my hand and as much as my arm that would fit in there and took another reading........27 TDS. Another experiment, by total accident, was when one of my cats fell into the brute trash can about 1/3 full of 0 TDS water. Reading......127. I attribute that to cat butt. :D

[romanr]

Sure it was an accident! Very nice!

[Saltz Creep]

Originally posted by kirstenk
Another experiment, by total accident, was when one of my cats fell into the brute trash can about 1/3 full of 0 TDS water. Reading......127. I attribute that to cat butt. :D
Cat butt? So, then TDS would stand for Totally Dissolved S....Stuff

[MiddletonMark]

I probably put mine in a couple times a week.

Sometimes, the frags get knocked around + there's not a lot I can do. Also, often when I want to turkey baste + get all the detritus stirred up ... I can't get below the rockwork another way.

I do try to avoid it, and when I have to mess with the tank less [hands only part of that] ... the tank often goes through a nice growth spurt.

But I always wash before + after, and if doing maintenance rinse in SW too.

[Lunchbucket]

Randall_James - :lol: yeah i guess i'm a list breaker...such a rebel i am :D first a 400w on a 20H then 2x400w on a 58gal...now the no hands in teh tank thing :lol: i guess i'm always messing w/ something around the house, putting lotion on my hands during the winter, or washing dishes (trade off w/ the wife for not cooking)...so i can only imagine what is on my hands or soaked into them that i would NOT want in the tank. also i'm on immune suppressant drugs so my immune system is WAY down so i like to be extra careful not to catch some nasties from my tank. would suck to have to be on antibiotics and sick for a while or loose a finger due to my tank. just makes sense IMO.

i've seen buddies just dive in w/ thier hand w/ and w/out washing them and always wondered what they were releasing into the tank or what they were recieving.

guess we need to teach a tank ed class on protection againts TTD - tank transmitted diseases. "cover you limp before you dive in" that could be a good slogan. but i guess we will have to have the supreme court get involved at it might not be ethical to teach this at RC :lol:

Satlz - thanks man! that is what i was thinking of...but that is only ONE bacterium that can do that. what about the toxicity from zoo's, burns from bristle worms, anenomes (sp?), and other corals.

romanr - impossible?? put a glove on then dive in. then you don't have to wash up first. actually saves some time :D

kirstenk - wow!! that is kind of scary

salts - LOL TDS!!!!! :lol:

anyone ever shut their pumps off then put their hand in the tank and watch an "oil slick" pool off thier arm?

Lunchbucket

[GraviT]

Maybe twice a week here. Critters love to knock over frags at night!

[kirstenk]

I swear it was an accident. I had the lid on upside down so it was not secure. Mirri jumped up there, walked to the "bad edge" and she toppled in. :eek1: This is my 3 legged cat. I was in the room, horrified, but she flew out of there on her second try. No more lids like that around here.

I live in AZ and have dry skin to boot. I never create an oil slick and rarely does the skimmer stop producing. I only lotion before bed now-a-days.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

isn't that a fish bite?
I've NEVER heard of someone "catching" something from tank?
bristleworms in fuge, but what else is there?

[Scatfish]

I understand the need of not putting your hands for fun but if you are careful and use logic I don't think I will become a monster like those pictures.:confused:

[alten78]

I always wear gloves...im too much of a baby to get my hands wet :lol:

[myhumps]

once a week for me

[cyclgrl]

I average once a week, mostly thanks to some tools I created and bought; most helpful of which are a pair of long aquatongs. I have to admit that the fact that I am allergic to my tank is a big incentive.

[mvandepeer]

I would say about once every week or two.
My skimmer always fluctuates as for the amount of skimmate produced and have never seen a change in the amount after arm insertion :)
I do wash my hands before putting them in and after just so I don't have a nice salt crust on my skin :)

Just out of curiosity.... how would this effect your skimmer?

As for the pictures of the bacterial infection.... ew ew ew... but I am not too worried about that happening to me because of the fact that I have never seen anyone post having this happen to them and i'm sure if it was something to be concerned about it would be more widely discussed.

[jman77]

I do it once every 2 weeks. That's to prune the Chateo , Change Filter Floss, Carbon, ect. Now i'm in the tank alot more than every 2 weeks, but i use my plant tongs for that. It makes my life alot easier since i don't have to have my hands in the tank that much.

Saltz Creep,

Those pics are plain nasty, but I¡¦m not worried about catching something from sticking my hand in my aquariums. For one the fish look healthy, now if they had sores covering their bodies I wouldn¡¦t be sticking my hand in the tank.

Second, I have been going in the Ocean since I was a baby, I'm 28 now and have never caught anything from the ocean. It's actually the opposite. When I was 20 I was doing Jiujitsu and caught a bad case of ring worm. One thing that helped it was the Saltwater in the Ocean, The Meds cleared it up, but the ocean helped somewhat :) I've had accidents spearfishing/freediving where I¡¦ve gotten really bad cuts and never had anything serious come out of it. Shoot, one time I got thrown onto rocks by the waves and had pieces of those tube snails inside my foot. As soon as I had the tubes remove everything healed fine¡K.lol ¡K

[Randall_James]

Jmann77 I would feel safer in the ocean as it is not a contained breeding pool of what ever pathogens we can collect in our little tanks.

It is rather interesting that most know of the issues of getting in the tank (myself included) and yet we do it anyway.

[deansreef]

twice a week for me, less if at all possible

[OceanSpray]

I voted twice a week, but sometimes its much more. I try to keep it down as much as possible, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do, to keep things running right.

[MyMonkey]

Twice a week in general. However, problems do arise. I do not own a pair of long gloves. I have touched everything but the bubble tipped anemone in my tank. Nothing has stung me yet. Still waiting on a test subject for the nasty anemone though.

[Gwoardnog]

BTA's feel like LPS, though a bit more slippery so it's harder to "feel" them when you do touch them (but if they're hungry they'll stick to ya).

[CaptainCoral]

I put my hands in the tanks every day. Feedings, water testing, general maintenance, filter bag replacements, etc. the list goes on and on. I did consider trying gloves once when I first heard of mycobacterium marinum, but playing with the tanks is part of what I like about reefing and using gloves every time I need to go (play) would remove some of the fun.

I understand the concerns for folks decision to avoid water contact, for me it's a small concern and I feel there are bigger fish to fry. :)

[lil_fishey]

this dosent stop me from putting my hands in my tank but i remember when anthoy Calfo came to talk to the greater iowa reef society he told us he has lost his sense of taste no more than 3 times from touching a coral and then touching his mouth

(i kinda hope he reads this and tell his story it was almost a year ago in january when i saw him)

COME ON ATHONY TELL EM THE STORY! :lol:

[Saltz Creep]

Originally posted by Scatfish
if you are careful and use logic I don't think I will become a monster like those pictures.:confused:
"Care and logic" didn't keep Don from getting the infection. He had an ordinary small cut on his finger and put his hand in aquraium water. Although many of us have probably done the same, statistically I think we have a better chance of dying in an automobile accident.

Read under "A Couple of Case Studies"

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-07/sp/feature/index.php

[Lunchbucket]

either way i'm not taking any chances! hospitals are no fun :( and infection sucks. i had cellulitous (sp?) when i had my knee surgery. had it for 7wks and lost 20lbs!!! antibiotics don't do the body good..and i think they were the start of my other GI problems that i have for life now.

Lunchbucket

[graveyardworm]

Currently I'm fighting bubble algae so my hands are in my tank frequently. Sometimes for hours at a time. I do keep my hands out when I have an open cut, and I clean/rinse/dry my hands very well before and after tank maintenance.

[DownTown]

Come off it guys... Feeding the tank affects the skimmate FAR more than sticking your hands in. I can spend an hour in the tank up to my arm pits working on this, that or the other thing, and the skimmate is solid bubbles up to the top of the skimmer. I feed the tank a quarter gram (estimated - I'm not actually weighing my food) of flakes, and within 5 seconds you can hear the changes in the sound of the water as the chemistry changes. The skimmate bubble column is interrupted for a while while things process and the bubble column slowly reforms. Clearly, between arms in tank and feeding tank, feeding is FAR AND AWAY worse for skimmate consistency.

D.T.

[1SickReefer]

you know, if we avoided everything in this world that has the potential to make us ill. we would not be safe anywhere. I think if you are of sound health with no open soars your chances of this happening to you are extremely rare ( like lighting). the sun can give us skin cancer how many of you put on sunblock every time you go outside?

Sushi eater like me, are aware of a certain parasite in raw fish that can harm us but we still eat it.

How many of you put on hazmat suits before going into a public bathroom, sure you wash your hands afterwards but I bet you still turn the water off in the sink with your bare hands after washing than walk out. or touch the papertowel dispenser or grab the door handle on the way out.

Bottom line is, I cant go around and worry about stuff like this. Things like this are in every aspect of out lives.

O and I put my hands in the tank water whether it be the sump or the main tank like every other day. or when the need arises, I do thoroughly rinse my hands under HOT tap water before I go in the water only so I don't PUT anything IN my tank, and I wash with antibacterial soap (cuz that's what the wife buys and is near the sink) after I am done.

[stevedola]

Originally posted by Randall_James
Can you say "Scroll up" ? Thanks Saltz Creep, I am sure I will sleep much better knowing what ever happened to that guy could not possibly happen to me. EEYUK......

I think this is just taking it alittle too far. I guess its a question of how much is too much? and in this case...this is too much for me.

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by stevedola
I think this is just taking it alittle too far. I guess its a question of how much is too much? and in this case...this is too much for me. Well the point was not what your fish tank could give to you, it was what you are doing to the tank.

I am sure your fish will do much better without your sweat, bacteria from your hands, under your nails and what ever else you may touch in the course of a day.
The point was brought up that "Feeding" did as much if not more to skimmer output than the "hands" did. Well "food" is natural, it is also good for the fish. And if you feed correctly,it should not have that drastic an impact on skimmate. It is one of the main reasons we must skim in the first place.

The instant your hands go in the tank, you start releasing your own body chemistry into the tank. This happens in plain old fresh water and much more so in salt.
As another reefer had actually tested the TDS in some RO/DI water, splashed around for a few in it, and then re-tested the water at I think 26ppm?

That is pretty considerable. You would not accept that water for water changes if it tested at 26ppm, well you might but most of us that have purchased RO/DI units would reject it. we got these units for our tanks health. (and ease of maintenance)

We then turn right around and replace much of what we took out with some pretty expensive stuff.

Now you could just wag your arms around in your tank for a bit and not think about it. I just happen to think about making conditions a bit better for my fish, even if it is something as little and silly as keeping my hands out of their water as much as I can. I am sure they are subject to all this stuff in the wild with surfers in their water huh?

The subject about about possible safety concerns was brought up by someone that had it happen. I think it was good of him to bring that up as another point as to why some avoidance should be practiced. It sure makes me think about other aspects of this hobby.

You may not fully understand (or care for that matter) what the medical field does to people to cure them, but some of the cures are in fact as bad as the disease was, only you live on instead of die from it.

I feel for him as I have seen it (life long issues after cure), I deal with it on a daily basis and it does mess up your life.
I say thanks for sharing it with us all, I know it has been talked about before, but I think it should be thought about a lot.

Heck we kill a lot of fish and corals in the practice of the hobby, I guess the thought of them killing back "is to much for some".... but that is ok, I understand :D

[Melody]

Once a week. Every sunday I spot feed my corals, cyclop-eeze and golden pearls (with a syringe). They're growing like crazy. Other than that, I keep my hands out of the tank.

[stevedola]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Randall_James
Well the point was not what your fish tank could give to you, it was what you are doing to the tank.

ok. my point was about monitoring the amount of times you put your hands in your tank. It had nothing to do with what disease you can get.

I am sure your fish will do much better without your sweat, bacteria from your hands, under your nails and what ever else you may touch in the course of a day.

havent seen any ill effects in 4 years of putting my hands in my tank. i want to see the study that provides factual evidence that our hands in the tank effects the health and welbeing of our fish/corals.

Now you could just wag your arms around in your tank for a bit and not think about it. I just happen to think about making conditions a bit better for my fish, even if it is something as little and silly as keeping my hands out of their water as much as I can. I am sure they are subject to all this stuff in the wild with surfers in their water huh?

COLOR=blue]some tanks are so large that they require jumping into the tank in swim trunks...i wonder what they would have to say about this.[/COLOR]

You may not fully understand (or care for that matter) what the medical field does to people to cure them, but some of the cures are in fact as bad as the disease was, only you live on instead of die from it.

][youre right, I really dont care.


Heck we kill a lot of fish and corals in the practice of the hobby, I guess the thought of them killing back "is to much for some".... but that is ok, I understand :D [/QUOTE

and again, I dont think you read my first post on this thread because I wasnt commenting on the diseases but rather that I thought that monitoring how much you put your hands in a FISH TANK is alittle obsessive and "too much" for me.

[Randall_James]

Well thank you stevedola for taking a the time to comment on something you do not care about.
That is the joyous side of this hobby, there can be any number of opinions ona subject and they can all hold merit and be correct.
I would guess by your tag line that you have been suppressed in the past, aren't you glad they allow you to speak freely here?
Love they neigbor brother :D

[Gwoardnog]

topic plz.:worried:

Man I should be a mod.:hammer:

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by gordo663
topic plz.:worried:

Man I should be a mod.:hammer: Sorry man...... This week my goal is twice....

[kysmith]

I put my hands in the tank as little as possible because I constantly have atleast one cut or scrape on them and am worried about infections that I can contract in the tank. I've seen a few threads of people's fingers after some bacteria got in a small cut in their hands and it's always nasty.

[ricks]

My hands are in everyday.. I don't know how people don't. In the morning for algae clip. In the evening for feeding again. I'm BB and do twice a week detrius siphoning. And weekly sump vaccuming, and refuguim clean up. Along with filter pad changes. Dang, I seem to always have my hands in my tank. Haven't seen any noticeable effects on livestock. My hands are very dry, and I have very clean fingernails..

[stevedola]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6222240#post6222240 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Randall_James Well thank you stevedola for taking a the time to comment on something you do not care about.


What is it that you think I dont care about enough to comment on it?

Maybe people are missing my point. Ill have to write clearer...I think worrying about how many times we put our hands in our tank is pointless. There are far more greater things to worry about IMO.

[blide]

I don't know how people don't. In the morning for algae clip. In the evening for feeding again

It used to be everyday or 2 or 3 times a week and finally I decided to stop. Now I usually go about a month because I feed with a baster and my nori clip is on a fishing line.

My skimmer used to overflow when I had my hands in their all the time and I actually saw some film come off my hand and go into the water once and that's when I decided enough was enough.

We all make mistakes and when people put their hands in everyday they could forget to rinse/wash their hands from time to time and that could really create a disaster.

[SeanT]

Originally posted by Lunchbucket why do you not have a section for never? i NEVER EVER NEVER touch my water w/ bare hands.

Originally posted by Randall_James I guess I did not count on anyone being on that list.

I am on that list.
My hands haven't been in my tank in 1 year, 5 months, 3 days.

Originally posted by mvandepeer As for the pictures of the bacterial infection.... ew ew ew... but I am not too worried about that happening to me because of the fact that I have never seen anyone post having this happen to them and i'm sure if it was something to be concerned about it would be more widely discussed.

Well, now you have.

Another...your tank can be dangerous thread. (http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=414029)

I almost died last July from the infection.

Sean

[ricks]

Sean,
What your didn't list the hours... Hehehe, wow that amazeing... I've never thought about getting sick. Maybe I'am and just don't know it.
The fishing line is interesting, how do you get the suction cup to release from tank?? Or do you just let it free float.
Also if my hands are in the water. What should I look for as far as getting sick or making the coral sick. I see no bleaching loss of tissue, color or polyup extention??? Maybe I was a fish in previous life...

Rick

[Reeforbust]

I use a homemade 24" pipette that reaches right to the bottom of my tanks to feed corals and fish


Pics please.......:)

[festus]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6213829#post6213829 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by stevedola
...I mean I dont put my hands in my tank will chez wiz and chilli hanging off of them...

How do we know that reef critters don't prefer cheeze whiz and chilli ?

For all the reef world knows this could be the secret to a thriving reef.

:lol:

[kysmith]

Jmann77 I'm not squeamish but your avatar creeps me out. What is that thing?

[SeanT]

I believe that is the blind, mange ridden, dog that was voted "World's Ugliest Dog".

Sean

[ErikS]

I believe that is the blind, mange ridden, dog that was voted "World's Ugliest Dog"
Yep, answers to the name "Lucky"

[NoSchwag]

I think lucky just died recently.

[NoSchwag]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051122/ap_on_fe_st/obit_ugliest_dog;_ylt=AtGaKFmwZf5MSAZP5RK2Eq3tiBIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--

R.I.P. Lucky

[kysmith]

sorry about pirating the thread but THAT THING IS GRUESOME!

[blide]

It's not Lucky! His name is Sam!

And to get this thread back on subject I would like to know if anyone has ever had anything bad happen to their tank due to having something on their hands?