Just got my tank!

[Fmellish]

Just got a tank, first reef tank, can't wait to dive into the hobby.

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

Do I need a 4 stage RO/DI system? Or is a 2 stage enough? Or even a 3 stage?

The last stage being DI.

The 4 stage systems are expensive.

What is the current opinion on this?

I would imagine that you reach a point of diminishing returns after 3 stages?

[fareforce]

Get at least a 4 stage.

[Fmellish]

I've seen 4 stage systems on Ebay for $99

and then 2 stage systems at marinedepot for $299?

So is marine depot that much of a rip off, or are the ebay ones just that low in quality?

[Fmellish]

I suppose I need help picking.
From

http://www.marinedepot.com/aquarium_reverse-osmosis-deionization__index.asp?CartId=

Which company do I choose, and which model?

Thanks

[FrankB1]

www.airwaterice.com

good reasonable RO/DI units

[FrankB1]

Check out the Compact ReefKeeper unit, its a 5 stage for $139.

[reefer2005]

Cool looking tank, I like the center overflow. ;)

[jay24k]

Don't waste your money on the expensive ones. The ones off ebay are just as good and much cheaper. Get one with the storage tank also.

[justgeorge]

I have the 5 stage residential from www.roultratec.com and it has been great!

[justgeorge]

Forgot to mention that it came with a 2 gallon storage tank but I don't even use it, 2 gallons is nothing! I have 4 6 gallon water jugs (look in the camping dept at Wal-Mart) that I keep filled for top off water.

[Fmellish]

Fantasic, thank you everyone.

I suppose I should have called this thread, "Hey I'm new to this and I'm going to have tons of stupid questions throughtout the coming year as I establish my tank"

Thanks

[Fmellish]

Originally posted by reefer2005
Cool looking tank, I like the center overflow. ;)

It is neat, but poses some design challenges. Because I can't have any visible wires or tubes, all plumbing and wiring has to be done through that overflow box, and it's not the biggest in the world.

[Fmellish]

I really wish the search function were operational, then I wouldn't have to ask all of these questions.

2 more questions right now:
1) Is a cheap refractometer better than an expensive swing arm hydrometer? When I look at refractometers I see them range from $40 - $100. If I get a $40 refractometer will I regret it later?

2) I need a heater, i'll just have it in my sump, what is a good choice?

[55Reef]

The $40.00 Refractometer will work just fine. Much better than a swing arm hydrometer.

Take a look at the Ebo-Jager heaters.

[Fmellish]

Thank you very much 55Reef

[Fmellish]

The chart at http://www.marinedepot.com/aquarium_heaters_ebo-jager.asp?CartId= claims I will need 500 Watts of heating for my tank size.

is this chart accurate? The biggest Jager heater is only 250 Watts. So would I need to buy 2?

Or are they being overly conservative?

My house is normally kinda hot inside anyway.

Your thoughts?

[ste6168]

i have two 200w heaters in my 75g, but the only reason i got two 200w instead of two 150w's is becuase i am probably going to upgrade. go with two, or even three.

[Fmellish]

Next question, LIGHTING.

My dimensions are 48" left to right and 24" top to bottom and 24" front to back. Looking down on the tank there are 2 areas with an overflow in the middle.
See http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/images/11272005_004.jpg

I think I'm going to go with T5's due to their lower heat output because whatever I buy, has to rest on top of the tank. I have 2 inches of clearance not the 8-12 that hallide requires.

Is this a good choice?

http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=CU01123
It's only 14 inches wide so if I place it in the middle, would the front and back sides of my tank be dark and only the center really bright??

Thanks

[DiverD rufus]

I"ve got a RO/DI filter from AIRWATERICE for years and it works great and they have good prices on replcement filters and are very helpful if you need it.

[Chaotic Reefer4u]

fmellish, tiight tank.

[Fmellish]

Originally posted by ChAoTiCrEeFeR4U
fmellish, tiight tank.

Thank you. I am very happy with it. But it is a fixer-upper.

[mmoore0803]

sweet avatar......get that bulkhead out yet?

[mmoore0803]

Originally posted by Fmellish
I really wish the search function were operational, then I wouldn't have to ask all of these questions.

2 more questions right now:
1) Is a cheap refractometer better than an expensive swing arm hydrometer? When I look at refractometers I see them range from $40 - $100. If I get a $40 refractometer will I regret it later?

2) I need a heater, i'll just have it in my sump, what is a good choice?

pay the membership fee.....search works great for me:p

[Fmellish]

Originally posted by mmoore0803
sweet avatar......get that bulkhead out yet?

How do I get it out? Do I just take a hacksaw to the pipes and cut them all out?

And how do I install the new bulkhead? Do I need to screw from both sides? If so, I'm screwed because I can't fit my hand down to the bottom of the overflow box.

[mmoore0803]

Originally posted by Fmellish
How do I get it out? Do I just take a hacksaw to the pipes and cut them all out?

And how do I install the new bulkhead? Do I need to screw from both sides? If so, I'm screwed because I can't fit my hand down to the bottom of the overflow box.

ask bryan.....he's used them before...I haven't

[Fmellish]

Next question SKIMMERS / REturn Pumps
-----------------------------------------------
I want to get a Euro reef skimmer as I've heard they are the best, but the one that I would need for my 120gallon is the
"EuroReef CS6-2+ Protein Skimmer" and it's $420.00. Anywhere I can get it cheaper than that?

And then a return pump. I need a good return pump, quiet, reliable, enough flow for corals in a 120 G, (although I don't want my sump waters to be storm-like).


And help would be appreciated

Thanks

[Fmellish]

Updated

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

I still need help deciding what to get because I'm not sure how it all works together. Apparently skimmers need a pump, can this pump also be used as your return pump to send the water back up to the tank? Or do you still need a seperate return pump?

1) Which skimmer should I get?
2) Should I get an in-sump skimmer? is the "EuroReef CS6-2+" an in-sump or external skimmer?
3) Which return pump should I get?

Thanks

[WarDaddy]

Skimmer, check this one out... http://www.exoticfish.com/results.cfm?cat=0|1978|1961|1893|0&

It is just like the EuroSkimmer, but $100 less.

My question would be this, can you forgo the pump and just plumb from the overflow into the oinput of the skimmer? Avoid that pump all togeather. The skimmer pump and the sump pump have to be seperate. you will need a pump to return to the tank.

I would think for a 120, around 1000 GPH woulb be MAX. you will have 1" pipe and a bout 4 feet of vertical head, plus some fittings.
Toss an OM Super Squirt version 3 on the outpout from your simmer and a apir of GOOD powerheads in the tank and you will be set wor anything.

Link to the Super Squirt:
http://www.oceansmotions.com/

Here is the powerhead I would think is about right.
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=TZ1313
Get two of those and you are set...

[WarDaddy]

Ack I was not done...

Here is the controller I was talking about:

Aquacontroller JR (http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PA&Product_Code=C-NEP-ACJR&Product_Count=&Category_Code=)

This is the best buy in town. BESURE to get the PH Probe and the DC8 options... I can help you get it all going... That will control the powerheads, which will create all kinds of great turbulance.

So in short:
Skimmer, of your choice, ask around for ideas on how to plumb it... If there is one you can plum from the overflow directly, that would be best case.

Power heads, strong effecient, best bang for your buck. look at the power consumption, I am going this route.

Controller, a must have in my book... all in one control of the tank.

SuperSquirt. Give you great flexibility and water turbulance, a lttle pricey, but a great tool.

--- Oh your return pump...your sump is set for external so look at these:
This is the Cadilac of the group:
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=IK1143

Here is the knock off:
http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=LG2145

[WarDaddy]

HEATER.... Check this out:
http://jehmco.com/PRODUCTS_/HARDWARE_/Heaters/heaters.html

look at part TSH-500. POWER and it is run by your controller, the heater is either on or off. Nice setup. Just drop it on the bottom of the sump.

[sharkdude]

looks good. interesting with the center overflow. should make for some nice complete 360 viewing.

some recent pics of my 120 here
http://myreeftank.com/pages/Tank%20Tour.htm
http://community.webshots.com/album/496737747RPJSuM

I also attached my spec sheet to give you some inspiration and ideas.

patience is key. and good mentors helping you out. come check out www.scmas.org next year:cool:

[Fmellish]

Originally posted by sharkdude
looks good. interesting with the center overflow. should make for some nice complete 360 viewing.

some recent pics of my 120 here
http://myreeftank.com/pages/Tank%20Tour.htm
http://community.webshots.com/album/496737747RPJSuM

I also attached my spec sheet to give you some inspiration and ideas.

patience is key. and good mentors helping you out. come check out www.scmas.org next year:cool:

Thanks sharkdude! I was at the tour. You had a great setup. I loved your clowns.

My main issues are going to be regarding how to get electrical to everything
above my sand line without having cords visible. It means I have to run all
electrical through a dry separate pipe in the center overflow. See pics at
my WWW site.

This constraint impacts everything.
- Lights retro into canopy? Then How do I ever lift the canopy off? the cords will be going through the center overflow.
- Lights from ceiling? This would allow for hallides but my ceiling is 10 feet, that's a lot of wire. ANd where do the ballasts go?
- Lights in a self contained plastic hood resting directly on tank? Again, if the cords go through the center overflow, then I can't ever move the lights off the tank, (and I'll need to if I ever want to feed my fish).
- Powerheads? Are their cords going to also run through the overflow?


I have thought of one solution, but I need you all to tell me if its feasible.

Instead of running cords for a dozen devices through the center dry pipe, just run one cord, an extension cord.

Then attach a powerstrip to the inside wall of the canopy, and then plug the powerstrip into the extension cable coming up from the center pipe.

Then all devices, (lights, powerheads), plug into this power strip.

This would allow me to simply unplug the power strip from the extension whenever I needed to remove my canopy, and it would facilitate retro lights in the canopy rather than a light hood resting on my acryllic.

HOWEVER I don't know if it's feasible. Can I have a powerstrip in my canopy? Won't evaporation destroy it? I have an 8 inch tall canopy, so I could have the powerstrip 8 inches away from the top of the acryllic. Is this safe?

Or should I mount the powerstrip on the outside of the canopy on the top and just figure that no one is tall enough to see it?

If I can power MH lights from ceiling electrical then the only power I need through the center pipe would be for any powerheads I have. But I'd have to have an electrician come out and put electricity in my ceiling. And that still leaves the problem of having two big MH lights hanging down 5 feet from the ceiling in the middle of my main room.

It's a deep tank and I'd like sps corals, so MH would be best, but the 15Amp circuit this tank is on is already very busy with my 6 amplifiers for my home stereo and other associated equipment.

So MH lights solve some problems, (1. It's no longer a problem that my canopy has no lid, and 2. a lot less wires to worry about running through the center pipe. But then MH lights introduce new issues.


I dunno.

So many design considerations given the known constraints.

WarDaddy has some great ideas, but I'll need him to help implement them in person since I don't understand all the concepts he's describing yet.


And I've got sump issues too. The sump design is bad. I spent last night on the board with someone trying to figure out the best design for my sump. I will need to mod my sump.

No wonder the guy wanted to sell this thing. It has so many design considerations. I am confident though that if I think everything out and do it well that in the end it should be a spectacular tank.

Thanks guys,

[sharkdude]

my guess is you'll eventually want that 'dry pipe' in the center overflow to be modified to use as an additional drain or as a closed loop intake perhaps?

they do make weather proof oulet palstic covers, but it would take some diy electrical work.

maybe sacrifice viewing on part of one side and fabricate a matching mini side cabinet to run all electrical?

access doors on the canopy are a must. you can modify the one you have easily enough.
quick dissconnects closer to retro lights will help some of your design problems.
ballasts will have to be remote anyways, and that dry pipe can only hold so many cords.

don't chance sharing electric demands on same circuit as all your amps.

for feeding fish, just drop food in sump near pump intake.

good luck! definately a challenge which will make the results all the more satisfying!

[WarDaddy]

I tell you what... When we have time, we will design and Build you an awasome canopy, for about $100. Access doors, top that opens, enough room to work, hold your lights and then some.

A Cable run from the top down to the bottom on the left side would be easy to do, and not realy cost you much viewing. No one will really view it much from that side anyway.

I have a few awasome ideas for a canopy, you can wait to see mine, our we can build all 3 (including Mike's) at the same time.

yours, painted Black, will be done quick. Not as much staining, sanding, staining, sanding...to do.

I am kinging the canopy wil be in the 12" - 14" range, with the lights sitting about 5" off the water.

[Fmellish]

Too many design options. I need to prioritize. i agree with you sharkdude that it would be nice to not lose that pipe to electrical. Then I could have a closed loop system, but I am against having external cords.

You guys know anyone else witha 4-sided (viewable) tank?

Maybe you're right about its placement. Maybe I should push it against a wall so one of the short sides is not accessable. Then run all the junk down that side.

Who knows, too much to think about.

I have timing issues. I hate waiting, and I want to buy lights this week and get them going. I'd like to get MH lights if possible.

I suppose I could wait. Just take a stance that I'm not going to touch this stuff until after XMAS. Then I can use your help with the canopy.

I want to get the tank up so bad!

[Fmellish]

BTW, thanks for all of the links Bryan.

I checked them all out, except the first one didn't work right.

just more stuff to think about. Would I use just one power head and where would it go? If i can put it on the outside of the overflow that would be preferred to putting something on my tank walls.

I'm considering maybe using an in-sump return pump. I've heard that sump-external pumps can be noisy.

Andy thought?

[WarDaddy]

The first pump is prety quiet.

The sump is pretty narrow to try and do a return from inside...BUT you could go with a bulkhead to a 10 gallon tank1/2 as a refuge then pump out...

There are so many ways you can go...

Don't worry about the light...NOW.
Start wiht plumbing. Get the plumbing done, skimmer installed, sump worked out and fill that bad boy up. Get sand inthere, seed it from my tank. then get you a few boxes of live rock and tlet the curing begin. you need no light to cure the rock. Work on the Hood and lighting while the rock cures. That way once the rock is done, you will have your lights and you can start to populate the tank. Curing will take 6-8 weeks.

yes you can attach the powerheads to the overflow, but they would be blowing straingt to the glass, not prfered. I would placcee them on the left side, pointing to the right, blowing hte length of the glass, or on on the front left, on eon the back right, making a nice circle flow.

In the hood design I am woking on, you will have lots of space for a good place to keep a power strip or two.

Before you commit, we can talk, there are lots of options.

I would try and get it plummed and get sand and rock in there asap. Once you get that started you wil have lots of time wile it cures do work on the rest. This is good too, in that you will not be rushed to put stuff in the tank too soon, and end up with dead stuff because you stocked it too soon.

[Fmellish]

Bryan, that sounds like a good approach.

Focusing just on plumbing for now and getting the tank water ready would be nice.

My RO/DI unit should be arriving this week.
I already bought 2 heaters, but they were cheap I can switch them to another type of heater if necessary. The sump needs some work. I need to find a place in south OC that sells acryllic, and I'll need to get the tools to cut it.

Where can I go tonight to find aquarium plumbing parts?
Or should I wait to do plumbing until you can help me? I know you want me to utilize a squirt. I would need help with that. I was just planning on splitting the return line in 4 once it hits the surface and dividing the return water 4 ways to each side of the tank. But should I just simply fix the broken bulkhead and redoing the pipes as they were? And then use the squirt? Or is the squirt instead of the existing return plumbing I have?

Also should I contact an electrician now to find out about adding a dedicated service for this project and wires in the ceiling for MH lights hanging down?

[Fmellish]

Sump updates


http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[WarDaddy]

Interesting... First I suggest Flexable PVC, it will save on all those 90 degree turns, reduce your head pressure and is easier to use.

Second, what skimmer can you plumb directly into? I would love to know?

Look at Marine Depot, for flex PVC, Home deopt for most stuff. Search super pages.com for a Plastic/glass company in the area to get scrap acrylic from, or home depot, but HD is expensive. Normal saw or router will cut the stuff.

[cwegescheide]

Hi Josh,

Hey if I were you I'd put your skimmer in the sump... If you have a malfunction and the skimmer overflows it will not go all over your floor. Been there done that!!! :) Just my opinion.. Nice looking soo far!!

Chris

[Fmellish]

Thank you for the advice Chris. I am thinking the same.

My sump won't really fit a skimmer as is, so I think I'm going to need a new sump. The existing one is thin and wobbly, so I don't have much faith in it anyway.

Thank you
Josh

[mmoore0803]

The nice thing about a new stand is you can build your sump directly into it and just line it with pond liner...a couple people down here in SD did that and it looks real nice.....plus it's all built in

[Fmellish]

I don't want anything to be permanent though. I'd like to be able to pull my sump in and out. What if I ever want to change it?

[mmoore0803]

true....but if you make it righ the first time you wont ever need to change it again :p

[Fmellish]

Remember what they say, "First time worst time". This applies to more than just losing your virginity.

Since this is my first tank, there are so many mistakes I may make. I want to do as much backout planning as I can.

[mmoore0803]

clear your inbox and sent box!!!

[Fmellish]

Done

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by Fmellish
I really wish the search function were operational, then I wouldn't have to ask all of these questions.

2 more questions right now:
1) Is a cheap refractometer better than an expensive swing arm hydrometer? When I look at refractometers I see them range from $40 - $100. If I get a $40 refractometer will I regret it later?

2) I need a heater, i'll just have it in my sump, what is a good choice? Search Feature Fixer (http://reefcentral.com/premium_membership.php)

Honestly a premium membership helps preserve this resource and is worth its weight in live fish *(the ones you wont kill)

The 40 to 60 range on a refractometer is fine, make sure it is temperature compensating is all. PremiumAquatics.com has a nice unit.

I have a titainium heater with remove control ($30) and at 300 watts works fine, I prefer to smaller ones however in case one quits.

It does look like you got into this hobby via a long road. Glad it did not shy you away to much. With all the expenses this hobby entails, a new tank is almost a drop in the bucket. Sure glad you caught the short commings before you got full of water...

[Fmellish]

I knew the project would end up costing around 5K in the end. I'm about 1/4 of the way there :)

I am not a big fan of doing things cheaply.

I seem to remember a time when the search engine was working for me. Do they turn it on and off? I wasn't very impressed with the engine. Although when you purchase an off the shelf website you're kind of stuck with what you get.

[Randall_James]

When server loads hit a fixed point, the search only works for premium members. It is not the best engine but you have to compromise when a board is this large. This is actually a highly modified version of VBulletin board, I run this board on a couple of my sites. Is pretty much the benchmark by which others are measured. (maybe even some are better?)

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

That looks great!!!! and the neighbors are ****ed....good job! You really stuck your finger up your nose didnt you :eek2:

Get everything done so we can put water in it on Saturday

[Randall_James]

so whats with the neighbors? I did not recall seeing anything about them.

[BMitch]

Originally posted by Randall_James
so whats with the neighbors? I did not recall seeing anything about them.

You have to check out the recent update on his website. Too funny about the neighbors!

[wazo90925]

Originally posted by Fmellish
I've seen 4 stage systems on Ebay for $99

and then 2 stage systems at marinedepot for $299?

So is marine depot that much of a rip off, or are the ebay ones just that low in quality? i got my 4 stage kent system for just under 200 from marinedepot. it works very well.

[Fmellish]

That's a great deal I think.

I ultimately found a similar deal. After getting a TDS meter and some extra filters I ended up spending about $250.00 total.

Thanks

[wazo90925]

i wish i would have got the TDS meter w/ it, because after a year it is still on my wish list.

[Ugly-one]

very nice tank and sump setup.!

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Randall_James]

I see on the inside of the old sump it is like dark blue. I would put a water proof sealer and then paint it white.

The sealer is for the humidity of the sump and the white for light reflection. I am assuming you are going to grow macro algae? I also put my CF flood light mogels on the inside framing of the stand. The clip on light thing was driving me crazy. The mogul is a $1.99 ceramic from "Do it best" hardware. It has a 1/4 hole that mounts from the inside of the socket.

I have some silver backed insulation foam we use for shipping human immuglobulin that I am going to put on bottom of tank. Insulate the tank from the sump, suck up noise and it is mirror reflective.

http://mytankpics.com/movies/mogul.jpg

[Fmellish]

Thanks for the ideas Randall.

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

OMG

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Randall_James]

WIthout seeing the other side of your sump you may have some other issues here.

Keeping the skimmer in the sump (I really prefer this)

The 3 baffles should be the last thing your water sees right before it heads back to the display via return pump.

The skimmer can dump right into the refuge area. Where you have the skimmer stand would be a good place for the return pump. What does the other end of sump look like?

[Fmellish]

Just scroll down far enough on the website to see the sump design.

[Fmellish]

I could switch the return area and the skimmer area, but that doesn't fix the problem. The return area is only slightly bigger. The problem is with the way AquaC states their specifications.

Can I just run the skimmer without the gate valve?

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mope54]

You won't be able to control the water level if you take the gate valve off. You need some kind of mechanism for controlling the water level, gate valves offer the most precise means to do so.

If you're set on keeping your skimmer in sump, you could put it up on a stand of some sort so the valve is a bit higher over the baffle.

If you still haven't decided on your T5 fixtures, I am about to buy mine this week. If we buy together, maybe we can save some money. I'll ask the vendor if you're interested.


Does anyone have a hole saw capable of making holes in acrylic for a 1" bulkhead? I'm in Irvine. It's a 29 gallon tank that I want to modify, so I can just bring it with me.

oh yeah, in terms of what to do about the front doors...no problem. Mine doesn't have a center support either. I have spring loaded magnets that screw right into the top brace. My hinges pop off, too. They're rusted, and I don't know where to buy them, but I can show you one of these times what I'm talking about.

I've also got LS and LR if you're interested in picking up some base rock, I can toss it in my sump or fuge and start to seed it for you so it should be ready by the time you're ready for it.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6228088#post6228088 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
I could switch the return area and the skimmer area, but that doesn't fix the problem. The return area is only slightly bigger. The problem is with the way AquaC states their specifications.

Can I just run the skimmer without the gate valve?

[Fmellish]

Thanks mope.

I don't have a hole saw. FOr holes in wood I just use a hole bit on my drill.

I will need live sand and live rock, but not for awhile. I only work on weekends lately. So I've got another few weekends working on the stand, and then another few working on plumbing. Maybe start addnig water in Early January.

I'll keep the website updated.

As far as the skimmer, thanks for the info. I have decided to keep the gate valve on and put the skimmer in the center chamber, fed with water from the first chamber.

[mope54]

Base rock should take a few months to seed. So if you plan on going live in 2-3 months, soon would be the time to buy some base rock and farm it out to your fellow reefers to seed for you. That will save you a TON of money, I think.

I was able to get two screaming deals on two full setups, one over 3 years old, so I didn't have to worry about live rock...but I understand prices are outrageous.


Putting your skimmer in the center is a great idea. I'm a fan of seperate fuges, anyway, and I wouldn't put anything in the center of that sump you have other than maintenance stuff. I would turn it so the outlet goes back to the chamber you used to have it in, so you can still take advantage of the baffles. An elbow or something to get it over there won't create a problem.

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

wow......haven't you put fish in that thing yet? I need to do something similar in my stand too. Did you get the RO/DI set up yet?

[Fmellish]

Nope, no Ro/DI installed yet.

Nope, no fish yet.

My next major mountain to climb is plumbing and lighting design.

[Fmellish]

Updates Updates!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

thanks for the anonimity....i was really worried about that....I'm kinda paranoid.....so let's see..panel in tomorrow.....fish by Christmas right?

[Fmellish]

I was gonna buy some fish tonight and keep them in the bags until xmas.

[mope54]

Can you tell me which timers you bought, where you got them at, and how much? Perhaps even a wiring diagram so I can do something similar to what you've got going on.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Josh is this the timer you are using?

http://www.intermatic.com/?action=subcat&sid=112

[Fmellish]

It's half way down the page or so

"Self-Adjusting Digital In-Wall Timer SS8C"

[Fmellish]

I'll have another update tonight. I'm finishing the electrical panel today.

[Fmellish]

Updates!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

It's so purty........dude.....water and fish tonight....right?

[Fmellish]

I installed the electrical panel today and began plumbing. I will upload pics later. I'm pretty busy now until late tomorrow with Santa stuff.

[Fmellish]

Updates Updates! Electrical finally installed and final? sump pictures.

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

That is some nice electrical work....real clean....I'm jealous

[Fmellish]

I'm lucky, I have experienced friends, and industry professionals on my street.

I looked over my electrical tonight. I have a 70 Amp / 240 V sub panel on the other side of the aquarium wall. This panel powers my spa which pulls 50 Amps. Leaving me with 20 Amps at 240V or 40 Amps at 120v ? Regardless I have space. So I am going to have an electrician add 2 new services. one for the lights, and one for all the other tank stuff.

Josh

[mmoore0803]

clear your message box.....and update with pix....i want to see that bad boy

[Fmellish]

Updates Updates

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[psy_chick]

looks like its going good! keep us posted, cant wait to see it filled up :thumbsup:

[Fmellish]

My personal webspace on my ISP is limited to 10 MB.

I am at 10 now. I may have to delete some of the older pics, or compress them to ugliness.

i'll always keep the thread updated.

Cheers
Josh

[mmoore0803]

yeah....delete all them old photos....and start using lower res photos...how did you get it in the house? called in all those favors from your disgruntled neighbors :rollface:

[Fmellish]

Actually my dad and Nancy's ex husband helped me. They were over for XMAS dinner. Kinda feel bad they sure were groaning alot.

it really wasn't that heavy. We brought it in through the front door. As the tank started to fill April noticed the water wasn't level. It is a tad higher on one end. Maybe an eigth of an inch or so. You can't really tell. I'll check the slab tomorrow, but i know the garage portion of the slab isn't level, so it wouldn't surprise me if the family room area of the slab isn't level either.

Josh

[mope54]

you have to level the tank...you could use self-leveling epoxy instead of shims.

also, if it were my house and I was putting a tank in the middle of the room (or anywhere not being a load-bearing wall), I'd crawl under the house and add support beneath the tank.

[gforce6]

Great work!
You must have a lots of fun.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6362885#post6362885 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mope54
you have to level the tank...you could use self-leveling epoxy instead of shims.

also, if it were my house and I was putting a tank in the middle of the room (or anywhere not being a load-bearing wall), I'd crawl under the house and add support beneath the tank.

Self leveling epoxy? Where do you get that and how does it work?

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6362885#post6362885 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mope54
you have to level the tank...you could use self-leveling epoxy instead of shims.

also, if it were my house and I was putting a tank in the middle of the room (or anywhere not being a load-bearing wall), I'd crawl under the house and add support beneath the tank.

Thanks for the tip. I'll measure the level tonight. Unless it's way off I may just leave it.

I have a reinforced post tension slab. I would have to dig down 10 feet into the earth and then tunnel over to get under my slab. It's not a traditional raised house.

If I were to try and shim the tank, so I shim the entire stand, or just shim the tank where it meets the stand? I amagine it may be too late to shim anything now. The tank is partially full and I can't lift it. I couldn't really lift it empty either. Same with the stand, to shim the stand would be tough. I'd need a dolly to get it off the ground at all. And do I really want to be lifting my entire setup, (stand and tank), off the ground while there is water in it so I can insert shims?


Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

Update:

TDS level of tap water is 336 PPM.
TDS level of RO/DI water is 0 PPM.

Flushed RO/DI system for 3 hours and then put it's hose in the tank and let it flow over night. In 10 hours it filled the tank up approximately 25%.

I will turn the hose on again tonight.

Cheers
Josh

[mmoore0803]

i thought you were going to use that thin styrofoam board in the garage to level the tank

[Fmellish]

The purpose of the foam is to distribute pressure of the wood frame across the entire tank bottom. I didn't plan on using it as I have a nice solid shelf for the tank to sit on, but I saw that fish stores sometimes put foam down, so I decided to keep it after all.

The foam is not a contributing factor and it will be squished fairly level once the tank is full.

[mope54]

You have to level the stand, you can't just shim the tank. Acrylic tanks have to be perfectly level on the stand. You'll need to shim the stand.

I have plastic shims. You can buy them at Lowe's or some place like that. I got mine at a locally owned business, but I forgot the name. I still have a bunch lying around somewhere, but they're cheap.

1/8" on a 4ft run? I'm hoping you're referring to the length of the tank and not the width. If it's the width, you must level it because that's huge. If it's lengthwise, you may never run into any problems, but you've spent all this time to rebuild a stand you were worried about, redesign the plumbing, and etc. It just seems senseless to leave something like a seam busting to chance without at least increasing your odds against it happening.

It sounds like this is going to be a lifelong tank (or a decade or two). You've got your own house, setting it up in the living room, and all that. So far you've been following the do it right the first time. Unfortunately, someone forgot to mention to check level and plumb! But it's ok, this is a common issue, and besides, the tank settled more once you poured a half ton of water in it so you may have had to relevel it anyway. Just be thankful you don't have the problem I had--my tank was comnpletely set up and running before we bothered to check level! I had to do a complete tank tear down and move it against the wall. All you have to do is shim the stand or dump the water, lift the tank and pour some self-leveling epoxy.

http://www.shopmaninc.com/kk121.html



<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6364028#post6364028 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
Thanks for the tip. I'll measure the level tonight. Unless it's way off I may just leave it.

I have a reinforced post tension slab. I would have to dig down 10 feet into the earth and then tunnel over to get under my slab. It's not a traditional raised house.

If I were to try and shim the tank, so I shim the entire stand, or just shim the tank where it meets the stand? I amagine it may be too late to shim anything now. The tank is partially full and I can't lift it. I couldn't really lift it empty either. Same with the stand, to shim the stand would be tough. I'd need a dolly to get it off the ground at all. And do I really want to be lifting my entire setup, (stand and tank), off the ground while there is water in it so I can insert shims?


Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

It's a small amount acorss the entire length. Front to back is level, it's just side to side across 4 feet the water seems a tad higher on one side. But just a tad, and I haven't done any scientific analysis yet.

If the slab is level, which I don't know if it is, I'm assuming a freshly constructed wooden stand will settle a little bit?

I don't want to level it and then once it gets under weight it settles and then is not level.

It takes so long to fill, still only about 25% full. But I would hate to begin any leveling procedure without first verifying level once full and settled. Does my process make any sense?

Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6170988#post6170988 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by FrankB1
Check out the Compact ReefKeeper unit, its a 5 stage for $139.

BTW, I have to give props to FrankB1 for referring me to the RO/DI unit I ultimately bought. It's working great so far :)

Thanks FrankB1

[mope54]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6365722#post6365722 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
If the slab is level, which I don't know if it is, I'm assuming a freshly constructed wooden stand will settle a little bit?


It's not out of the realm of possibility that your foundation shifted, especially in OC where we live on a sandbed with more fault lines than solid pieces! But it's most likely you built a crooked stand ;)


I don't want to level it and then once it gets under weight it settles and then is not level.

It takes so long to fill, still only about 25% full. But I would hate to begin any leveling procedure without first verifying level once full and settled. Does my process make any sense?

Thanks
Josh [/B]

Yeah, makes perfect sense. That's what I was commenting on, that your tank will continue to shift while weight is being added. Although, to be honest, I don't think you're going to get much more movement given that you're on a concrete slab. The changes occur because the floor beams bow under weight--not really because the tank or stand are shifting.

I only used foam under my glass tanks, I never have with my acrylic ones. I know some people do, but those ones at the LFS you saw were most likely glass. You know the grade of wood you bought for the bottom (top?) of the stand so you'll have to decide whether you want or need to deal with it. It won't level anything, though, just protect the bottom of the tank from pressure points.

[Fmellish]

Thanks.

I'll check tonight to see if the tank is level or not. If not then I'll monitor the tank for a few days and correct if needed.

Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

OK, here's the scoop.

The stand is perfectly square and parallel to the ground, and the tank is perfectly parallel to the stand.

My cement slab is not level, as I knew it probably wasn't. I am seeing a 3/16 " difference in water height over 4 feet.

So if the water on the left of the tank were to just touch the ceiling, the water on the right side of the tank would be 3/16" below the ceiling. That's across 4 feet. Also front to back across 2 feet, the water level is lower in the front than the back by 1/16"

So the entire slab slopes towards the fron of my tank by 1/16" every 2 feet and 3/16" inch every 4 feet going the other way.

Is that small of a deviation any problem?

Should I bother to drain it and level it?

You seriously can't tell unless you break out a ruler.

Thanks
Josh

[Reef_Dweller_69]

If the water level is lower in the front then the slop is to the back. As it leans to the back the water will rise in the back and be lower in the front

[mope54]

If it's concrete, I'd probably leave it myself.

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=395149

[Fmellish]

Ok I need help quick!

I'm just starting to flow test and when I kill the return pump the sump will overflow into my family room.

My return line siphons the tank contents back into the sump.

i have locline on my return that plunges into my tank about 2 feet deep. WHen the pump kicks off the tank wants to drain to this level through my return line!!

Please help, how can i prevent this from hapening? How do I keep the return line from siphoning half of my tank back into my sump!!

I know with the drain line you can drill a hole to let air in, but I can't drill a hole in my return there is pressurized water in the return under normal operation. Help Help

I'ts running while I write this and I can't turn the pump off.

Help please

Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

Important updates!!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

Also, do you apply teflon tape to the threads on a union?

My single union leaks. It doesn't leak at either end, but in the middle where the collar screws on. I didn't use teflon tape because the union has an oring and I didn't think it would make sense. Especially considering that unions exist to allow you to disconnect things, and I didn't think it made sense to teflon tape a connection I would be unscrewing from time to time. You can't really reuse the tape.

[mmoore0803]

Great use of your christmas present...eesh

Instaead of plunging your loc line return a foot into your tank just have it return at just about the level of your overflow teeth or at least have the ends of the return nozzles at that point so it breaks the suction/siphon..as for your return pump noise....someone else is going to hafta help as I have no idea....is it just the vibrations against the tank?

[Fmellish]

It's a noisy motor for which the noise if amplified since it is hard connected to everything. The other pump, (same model), is connected through soft vinyl tubing and the noise is the same but at a much much lower volume.

[Fmellish]

I'm tellin ya, that book is VERY useful

[Fmellish]

Bump

Need help

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6378770#post6378770 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
I'm tellin ya, that book is VERY useful

I can see that

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6378769#post6378769 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
It's a noisy motor for which the noise if amplified since it is hard connected to everything. The other pump, (same model), is connected through soft vinyl tubing and the noise is the same but at a much much lower volume.

Is the pump submerged in your sump or outside? If it is in water, can you put it on a sponge...maybe that would absorb some of the vibration being amplified by the sump and other plastics that are attached.....or use vinyl tubing to attach the pump to the harder PVC?

[Fmellish]

The sponge sounds like a good idea. However the plumbing was measured and glued with the pump on the sump floor. I can't raise the pump without putting stress on the pipes.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6379666#post6379666 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
The sponge sounds like a good idea. However the plumbing was measured and glued with the pump on the sump floor. I can't raise the pump without putting stress on the pipes.

cut and reglue leaving room for noise dampening spongey material beneath it

[Fmellish]

Listen Mr. smarty pants!

There's water in there now. I'd have to drain my sump. and then it would be days for the glue to dry so I don't make the water toxic.

What do you think of that!

[Fmellish]

Yeah I suppose I could do that.

I also thought about taking the stand and tank full of water to a car audio place and havng them install Dynomat all over so it's quieter.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6379847#post6379847 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
Yeah I suppose I could do that.

I also thought about taking the stand and tank full of water to a car audio place and havng them install Dynomat all over so it's quieter.

that was gonna be my 2nd suggestion.....you didn't put a valve between your pump and drain? pump and return?

[Fmellish]

There is a resevoir between my pump and my drain, it's called my aquarium.

[mope54]

You need PVC 2795 for the connection between your spa-flex and the elbow.

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6380267#post6380267 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mope54
You need PVC 2795 for the connection between your spa-flex and the elbow.

Please tell me more. What is it, where can I get it?

Thanks
Josh

[mope54]

It's PVC glue for bonding flex to flex or flex to hard. That's the number on the can, probably home depot, lowe's, ace.

btw, you'll want your locline at the surface for a few reasons:
won't drain your tank
agitates the surface for oxygen exchange
makes ripple lines for your viewing pleasure

[Fmellish]

Yes I do prefer my loc line at the top now instead of the crazy tentacles in the tank.

Thanks for the part # on the glue.

[Fmellish]

I'm not 100% happy with my plumbing design. I had no plan of course I made it up as I went along. So I'm not that disappointed. But I have some questions.

There were some assumptions and constraints I was designing around that maybe I shouldn't have.

1) Do I need a filter sock? And if you use one, how do you plumb so as to be able to get to it and remove it?

2) How do you plumb your drain to sump connection? My sump had a lid with a hole, so I installed a bulkhead in the hole. But now the issue is that to get my filter sock out I have to lift up the lid/bulkhead/plumbing. It's very difficult and puts a strain on the pipes

Do you go hard PVC straight from drain bulkhead into sump? How do you do it? You can look at my www site. I went flex tubing to my sump so I could move it around, but I'm beginning to think that was a mistake. Should I forget about using a filter sock, hardline everything, and just accept that I can't really get into my first chamber anymore? SHould I even be using a bulkhead? Should I even be using a lid?

Should I just trash the lid and bulkhead and plumb a pipe straight into the sump?

How do most people do it? And for those people that use a filter sock, where do you put it that allows you to remove it easily without having to break plumbing apart?

Thank You
Josh

[Fmellish]

I think I just uncovered the source of a lot of my noise. My pipes and the walls of the tank and stand resonate with the same sound/vibrations as my return pump.

I noticed that when I grip my return pipe in my hand the noise goes away. The pipes are vibrating along with the pump and this causes the pipes to radiate the sound/vibrations to the tank walls, stand walls, etc.

My return pump is hard lined into my PVC return pipes. How do I prevent the vibrations of the pump from transmitting to the pipes? Is it even possible to prevent this if they are direct glued together? If I could prevent it I would be very very happy.

Should I use vinyl tubing to connect my pump to my PVC return line? That would reduce a lot of the vibration transmission, but I worry about vinyl tubing's integrity.

Any thoughts?

Or should my goal be to keep the pump from vibrating?

BTW my other pump (skimmer pump), is the same model (Mag 7), and it connects to my skimmer via Vinyl tube and it doesn't transmit vibrations at all and is mighty quiet.

Ideas?

Thanks
Josh

[BMitch]

The problem with putting vinyl tubing on the output of your return pump is that the hose barb will increase the head pressure and you'll get less flow.

On the other hand, why not use vinyl tubing from the return pump to where the PVC goes up through the overflow box. That way you won't need all those PVC rigid 45's that reduce the flow. You'll likely end up getting more flow through the vinyl tubing.

[Fmellish]

Another person also suggested using the vinyl tubing all the way. I have 2 issues with that, which maybe you can help dispel.

1. Routing is a pain, I can't really route the tubing where I want it. If I try to bend it, it may actually fold or kink.

2. Integrity and security. I've seen threads on here of people coming home to flooded rooms because the vinyl tubing slipped off.

If you can ease these 2 fears then I may go vinyl all the way.

My neighbor, who works for Ken Marine, says he uses vinyl tubing for return lines in all of his installations. So I know people do it, even professional, it just scares me. Glues PVC give me that warm and fuzzy feeling that I know it will never leak. Although conversly it amplifies all vibrations and noises.

Let me know if I should make the switch. I have plenty of 3/4" vinyl tubing.

Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

UPDATES UPDATES !!

Go now! You go now!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[BMitch]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6383699#post6383699 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
I've seen threads on here of people coming home to flooded rooms because the vinyl tubing slipped off.


Get hose clamps on vinyl tubing. Plastic hose clamps for underwater use and stainless steel hose clamps for out-of-water applications. No worries then.

[BMitch]

I checked out your website and had a couple questions:

1) Are you experiencing microbubbles in the display tank? I see your bubble trap is after the drain pipe but before the skimmer.

2) What are you doing for top off water? The return section of the sump appears rather small. This area is where you'll see the evaporation of water from the system and will need to top off with pure RO/DI water to keep your salinity and specific gravity remains near constant. Are you going to have an automatic top off or just fill by hand when needed?

[Fmellish]

1) There are no bubbles in the display caused by the return. My tank still has lots of cling-on bubbles from when I filled it, but i'll wipe them off someday.

The bubble trap removes all of the bubbles from the drain flow. When the drain hits the first chamber it is highly airated, lots of bubbles. THey are removed. If they don't go through the trap and get pumped to my skimmer they are removed there. The EV180 is well engineerd and doesn't output any bubbles.

Funny enough even though no bubbles are around by the time the water flows into the return chamber, the effect of going over the last set of tines does add some bubbles, but for some reason they pop before going through the pump. So no, no bubbles in display from return.


2) I have an RO/DI system, and I have a float valve designed for the system. So I could plumb in auto top off and never worry about it again, however my RO/DI is installed in my kitchen 20 feet away so that kind of shoots that idea in the foot. Worst case I run the hose over a few times a week for a few minutes to top it off.

[Fmellish]

The return chamber looks a lot smaller now with the Eheim in it :)

[mmoore0803]

so where are the fulltank and filter pix? How goes the electrical rewiring? I might be tagging along on monday if the rain has passed

[Fmellish]

Monday will be fun, i let Bryan know. He may come also if he can.

Today Saturday was spent salyifying the tank. SG is 1.023 and holding at 75F.

Tomorrow Sunday, (hopefully), will be spent adding new electrical services to my breaker and installing new duplexes for my stand to plug into. Although Home Depot will be closed. Fruck!

Monday we're going to Ocean Pro.

[Fmellish]

I love my new Eheim 1260. Quieter and better output than the Mag 7 I had. I would love to replace my other mag 7.

Is the Eheim 1260 pump a good pump for the AquaC EV180 skimmer? It's not in their list of pumps to use for this skimmer, although I don't know if they reviewed every pump known to man. I am currently using a Mag 7 but I dislike its noise level and power consumption. I have an Eheim 1260 as my return pump and I love it. nice and quiet. So I was hoping I could buy another one for my skimmer.

Or even better, if the Eheim 1250 would work, that would be even quieter and more energy efficient, although the 1250 only outputs 317 GPH instead of the 1260's 635 GPH.

I also emailed this question to AquaC, and they always reply, however the holiday is tomorrow, and I thought I'd ask here and see if I could get some opinions tonight.

Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

UPDATES!!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

looks very nice.......I like how your house is tilting to one side yet your tank water remains perfectly symmetrical....how do you do that?

Figure out how you are going to do your flow in the tank yet?

[Fmellish]

I've got the 2-5x sump turnover covered. THe other 10-15x will be done with a Tunze powerhead. I'm going to get the Tunze Turbelle® Stream Kit TS07 (6000x1, 7091x1). Although my mounting options are limited.

[Fmellish]

UPDATES, live rock and sand today

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

I see critters. I long earthworm looking worm is hanging loose out of a hole in one of the rocks. It's not a bristle work or a flat worm. It looks just like an earthworm, thick round, brown.

Cool stuff

[Reef_Dweller_69]

It's a peanut worm. They clean your rock, sweet I have 3 of them. :)

[Fmellish]

Thanks Reef_Dweller. All the critters were gone this morning. Pulled back into their homes.

My water was crystal clear this morning. I am happy and amazed it took less than a day for all the cr@p to get filtered out of the water.

My skimmate production is through the roof. My skimmer produces a full cup of junk every 45 minutes. And if I don't change it in time the brown sludge drips back into my sump. Yuck. I woke up to a sump with the surface water all sludge and foam. I will go home for lunch today and change it, but other than that, its just going to have to drain back into the sump until I can get some 1/2" tube and route the overflow sludge to another container. I'm assuming all of this "instant skimmate" is due to the dirtiness of the whole rock installation process and the kick @ss efficiency of my skimmer.

I emptied the sludge this morning, went back upstairs to take my shower, and when I came back down the cup was full again. Full to the valve with brown sludge, and then full from the valve to the top of the cup with brown foam.

Yum

I have a few questions for today.

1) Can you have your arm in your tank too much? I had my arm in my tank for about an hour last night while I aquascaped one side. Tonight I'll probably have my arm in my tank for another hour while I aquascape the other side.

2) I don't have lights yet. THe guy at the LFS said I would lose all of the coraline algae I paid for on the rock if I didn't get lights on it. Is this true? I wasn't going to worry about lights until I got livestock.

3) Is there anything I should be doing during the cycling process?

4) When should I buy snails and stuff?

Thanks
Josh

[Fmellish]

Anyone,

When should I added macro algae, (chaeto), to my sump?

I've just added my live rock and sand and should be starting my cycle soon, if I haven't already.

Thanks
Josh

[Reef_Dweller_69]

You can add it during the cycle as soon as your Ammo starts to drop, thats when I did. I do believe at any part of the cycle is fine. If I am wrong someone tell me.

[Fmellish]

UPDATES

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Why don't you attache a tube to that drain on your skimmer, that way you don't have to clean it out every 45 min. By the way looking real good man.

[Fmellish]

I need to get some tube. I think its 5/8" inner diameter.

Then I will route the excess waste to a collection container.

Thanks :)

Have any idea how to clean up sand in my return chamber? Apparently when I was installing the sand and rock some of the ligher sediment particles made it to the last chamber in my sump and my Eheim is now sitting on a small bed of sand. How do I get it out of there?

Any ideas?

Thanks
Josh

[Reef_Dweller_69]

No problem bro.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6418376#post6418376 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
I need to get some tube. I think its 5/8" inner diameter.

Then I will route the excess waste to a collection container.

Thanks :)

Have any idea how to clean up sand in my return chamber? Apparently when I was installing the sand and rock some of the ligher sediment particles made it to the last chamber in my sump and my Eheim is now sitting on a small bed of sand. How do I get it out of there?

Any ideas?

Thanks
Josh

How about a siphon made from 1/2 inch vinyl tubing....just suck up the sandy mess and have it goto the next chamber

[Fmellish]

Doesn't a siphon need a difference in altitude to work? I don't think I can siphon from one chamber into another if they are on the same level.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

There's no need for that type of siphon. The tube attached to the nipple on the skimmate cup will do fine. I will drain on its own into what ever container you set up, eg.. 2 litter bottle or a bucket, etc.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6420329#post6420329 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Reef_Dweller_69
There's no need for that type of siphon. The tube attached to the nipple on the skimmate cup will do fine. I will drain on its own into what ever container you set up, eg.. 2 litter bottle or a bucket, etc.

sorry....i meant for the sand problem

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Oh in that case I agree 100%. Just use some tubing to suck it up. The same way you would drain water out the tank if you didnt have a pump. Stick one end of it in the tank suck on the tube a little to get the water flowing then suck up the sand, wala sand is gone :)

[Fmellish]

I spent the $79 to get the AquaC waste container. It is totally cool. Well worth the money. It's got a ping pong ball that floats in mid air and seals the chamber when the air pressure is too high. it's got a carbon filter on the top. And best of all its made of the same extremely high quality material that the skimmer is. Same type of sealing rotating top too. Incredibly cool. And hey, it matches my skimmer.

[Fmellish]

I HAVE LIFE.

Thousands of tiny tiny tiny things in the top 2 inches of water above my sand bed.

I sat staring at my sand bed just now, (which isn't live sand), and I saw for the first time ever, these little creatures jumping around in the inch of water above my sand line. They are so so so small. imagine a flea, and then imagine something 1/10th the size. So small that you can't see that you're seeing it. Smaller than the sand grains. And they are white. I didn't see them at first, but then once I saw small particles hopping up and down on the sand I looked closer with my best stare and a flashlight. It is amazing. the sand is covered with them and they can swim up an inch or two. I would say they look like babies of brine shrimp. These are my babies. They were just born today. not there last night. The tank was dead last night, except for my rotting live rock.

Cheers
Josh

[Reef_Dweller_69]

They were inside the rock ( it's LR right?). You will see al sorts of life come out your rock when all settles in. The critters wil go deep into the rock during cycle, transit or any other occansion causing stressor bad environment. The little bugs are copepods if I am not mistaken. You will see them eventually on the glass and everywhere. My glass is full of them, little crusteations they are.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

So cool I stay up till like 3 am with a flashlight and magnifying glass.:o By the way what kind of sand are you using?

[Fmellish]

Just beach sand I believe. The LFS said it was "live" sand. But they were holding it in a wheel barrow .

it is not aragonite based and it is not crushed coral. It is extremely fine and there is no derivation in the grain size. Its all very consistent. It's beige, (brownish). It looks nice, it's not chunky like argonite sand can be. It's like brown sugar.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

It might be or did they say it wasn't. There are sands that are aragonite based and they are sugar sized. Check the out the 2 links...

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/detailed_image.cfm?pCatId=7321&large=/images/bigimages/lg_967052_17657D.jpg

http://carib-sea.com/pages/products/marine/substrate/aragonite.html

They kept it in a wheel Barrow?Was it wet or moist at all or completely dry?

[Fmellish]

It was all wet, under water. But there were no critters or coral in it. It certainly wasn't sand from a live reef. I've done enough reef diving in my life, reef sand doesn't look like this.

So yes, they said it was live sand, and it was kept in water, but I doubt it was from a reef area, and there were no critters in it. I looked.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

What makes live sand live is not the critters you find in it. Same with LR. What makes it live is the bacteria that lives in it and on it that breaks down your ammo, nitrite and nitrates. This is why everyone uses some amount of both when starting a tank. It actually speeds the cycle. So infact your sand just might have been live sand (which you find wet when you get it).

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Live sand can also come out of an established tank. Doesn't actually have to come from the ocean/reef.

[BMitch]

About adding the cleanup crew . . . wait until your cycle is finished. You'll know when because your ammonia and nitrIte will be ZERO and your nitrAte will be high.

Otherwise, if you added them now, they would likely die and increase your ammonia level.

[BMitch]

Oh yeah, it might be a good idea to get those full arm's length gloves the LFS sells so that the oils on your hands and arms doesn't "pollute" your tank. Plus, the gloves will protect your hands so they don't continue to get cut up.

[Fmellish]

Thanks a ton guys.

I was contemplating aquascaping last night but my right thumb is still very tender. It isn't cut, but for some reason it scraped against some rock that has made it tender. Feels like someone hit it with a hammer.

Also the other cuts on my hands aren't healing very fast. My hands still today are just swollen a little and totally dry. I was contemplating applying some lotion but I figured it would sting within my cuts.

Maybe tomorrow my hands will be good enough to dive back into the tank.

But I did have some fun last night. I bought my Tunze powerhead and controller, and my waste collection container. So I got to play around a little bit.

BTW, my waste collection container has already overflowed. My wife just called me at work.

So by adding the waste collection container I now only have to empty my skimmate twice a day instead of every hour.

Yay for me!

[mmoore0803]

Just fill a bowl with alcohol and slowly lay your arms in it...wuss

Did you find out if the Tunze's could be rewired to work in your setup?

[Fmellish]

Yes! The Tunze representative replied and it turns out that yuo can take the box apart and inside the cable just plugs in. I went home and took it apart. Piece of cake. I am excited now.

I just got off the phone with yer wife.

Cheers
Josh

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6431341#post6431341 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
I am excited now.

I just got off the phone with yer wife.

Cheers
Josh

Man that sounds bad! Glad to hear the Tunze's will work....r u still at work or did you go home early? Pix man! When do the lights come?

[Fmellish]

I'm home now.

I'm aquascaping tonight. Going to use gloves to as to protect my fancy hands.

If the dust cloud I'll create settles down tonight I'll also throw the powerhead in. If I'm done before 9:00 i'll post pics.

The lights arrive tomorrow.

I'll probably start the canopy this weekend if I can.

Cheers
Josh

[Fmellish]

UPDATES UPDATES !!!!!


http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

Read now or go to hell!

[Fmellish]

Reef_Dweller_69 empty your inbox so I can PM you!

[Reef_Dweller_69]

ok but I think I am late on this response

[Fmellish]

Thanks my PM went through now :)

[mmoore0803]

Where are the pix of the new skimmer cup? Man, those things get no respect....tank looks awesome though.

[Fmellish]

sorry I'll take pics of my collection cup tonight.

I am so very very low on disk space at my ISP. they give me 10 MB I think. I am having to compress my image so much that they look like poo.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6437695#post6437695 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
sorry I'll take pics of my collection cup tonight.

I am so very very low on disk space at my ISP. they give me 10 MB I think. I am having to compress my image so much that they look like poo.

yeah and it's adding weird chair ghosts

[Fmellish]

Yes, yes it is.

I'm heading off to marine depot in about 30 minutes to pick up an acrylic mounting kit for my Tunze powerhead. I love the fact that you can drive there and pick up stuff.

Why pay shipping when you can pay tax!

[mmoore0803]

no kidding.....so what does the mounting kit give you that the one it came with doesn't?

[Fmellish]

I would like to mount mine against my side wall. The pump only comes with hardware to drop it down from where ever your lip is. My lip is 5 inches into my tank. See my pics. So to get it against the side of the tank you have to buy an optional piece to wrap around the lip.

[mmoore0803]

oh.....did you go and get it yet?

[Fmellish]

Yes silly.

I got it 30 minutes after my first post.

Are you coming over tomorrow to build canopies?

Sunday I'm only free in the morning. Afternoon I'm seeing someone else.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Fmellish, for the Tunze couldn't you have used the magnet they make to hold it from the out side? I saw it used on a tank before. Seems to hold it quit nicely. Although it is rather big and bulky, sort of unsightly.

[Fmellish]

The magnet is only recommended for glass from what I can tell. I'm sure it would put some pretty nice scratches in acrylic.

But I don't know for sure. The pump sure shakes around a lot. Maybe I should investigate the magnet more.

Although it does look quite nice now with the new kit installed.

Thanks

[Reef_Dweller_69]

The tank I saw it on was a 150 acrylic, but you know your right about the scratches. I am trying to remember if there was something special he had between the magnet and the pump. I will have to go take a look at his setup. I will let you know what I learn.

[Fmellish]

Also, I angle my head at about a 60 degree angle.

I do'nt know if you can use the swivel attachment and angle the pump if you use the magnet.

[Reef_Dweller_69]

oh ok, I don't know either. I REALLY LIKE THOSE TUNZES BUT CAN'T AFFORD THEM. i WILL HAVE TO SETTLE FOR ONE OF THOSE SEIO M620'S OR THE HIGHER ONE M8 SOMETHING.

[Fmellish]

This thing is a monster. It makes my tank look small. And it shakes to violently, especially at top speed. It looks like its going to fly off the holder at any moment.

It has totally aquascaped my sand for me. now all the sand is positioned in rolling dunes and all pushed up under the rocks. Its incredibly powerful. I've got a little whirlpool in my tank now.

i'm going to take some pics tonight and update my website so everyone can see the new position since I installed the new mounting kit.

Josh

[Fmellish]

UPDATES

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

Looks good.....did you pee in yer tank? Did you check the params b4 calling it a night?

[Fmellish]

Yes Mike. I peed in my tank. I thought it would aid in the process of establishing my bacteria colony and increasing my ammonia at the same time.

Was I not supposed to? You don't wanna know what i did in my sump!

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6447416#post6447416 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
Yes Mike. I peed in my tank. I thought it would aid in the process of establishing my bacteria colony and increasing my ammonia at the same time.

Was I not supposed to? You don't wanna know what i did in my sump!

Well I noticed how brown and full that cup was becoming.....:eek1:

[MAreefer1]

you have a very nice tank set up!

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6448119#post6448119 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mmoore0803
Well I noticed how brown and full that cup was becoming.....:eek1:

Thanks goodness I have the extra waste collection vessel.

That's right, I said vessel!

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6448369#post6448369 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by MAreefer1
you have a very nice tank set up!

Thanks. It's nice to hear that.

I made and will still make plenty of design mistakes. Thankfully most are correctable.

A design mistake I am having to deal with now is not putting vents in the stand. It's like a sauna in there.

Cheers
Josh

[fodder]

BTW...
If you order online from Marine Depot, then indicate in the shipping instructions that you will use Will Call, you wont have to pay shipping or tax!! I've done it several times.

Oh yeah, nice progress on your tank!!

[Fmellish]

I will call from marinedepot all the time, and they do charge me tax. For online orders they will pay the tax, but in person you have to pay tax. At least I always do, and I'm there at their window at least once a week.

Josh

[fodder]

Interesting...I've never been charged.

Well, you have the consolation of having a great looking tank and a frequent buyer card at Marine Depot, while I have a 60gal cyano breeding mess!! :D

[Fmellish]

I'm sure cyano and I will meet at some point :)

[Fmellish]

Tonight my ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate all tested at 0 !!!

i am going to pick up a quarantine tank this week and get a fish and also work on my canopy this week.

[Fmellish]

UPDATES !!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[mmoore0803]

dude....yer tank shrunk....or is it my imagination?

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Looking real good man, bravo bravo.

[Fmellish]

Sometimes I experience shrinkage.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6464887#post6464887 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
Sometimes I experience shrinkage.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: since birth :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Fmellish]

It's perfectly natural !

Now to go shrimp up my water. Want to test out my live rock and see how well it biologically filtering things.

Laters
Josh

[Fmellish]

Nitrites and Nitrates are 0 for both my display tank and Quarantine tank.

Ammonia is 0.25 in my display tank and 0 in my quarantine tank. So my QT has slightly safer params right now. However the barely measureable ammonia in my display tank may be due to the rotting shrimp in the bottom, which I should probably remove now. It's just sitting there.

I don't think my quarantine tank had a cycle. Since I used water from my display tank, and most recently added live rock, I think my quarantine tank may have the bacteria it needs now. Regardless of whether its the bacteria or the efficient chemical filtration, the quarantine tank has great params. So I might be getting a fish tonight.

What is a good fish for a new tank? Well, the display tank will be 5 weeks old by the time the new fish sees it.

I want something that is friendly and not territorial, but is hearty and pretty.

Any thoughts?

Thanks
Josh

[mmoore0803]

clown trigger?

[Fmellish]

THanks :)

[Fmellish]

Long night people. Check it out.

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[Fmellish]

Man, last night sucked, oh wait I'm still up! I mean work tomorrow will really suck on just 3 hours of sleep.

So, today I will buy some live stock.

My tank is ready, (sans skimmer, see www link above), and my QT is ready, so I figure livestock that needs to be QTed will go in the QT, and livestock that doesn't, I'll acclimate and drop right in.

I should probably get a clean up crew, however I have no lights in my tank so there is no algae, but I do have lots of dead rock filth on the sand bed. So I need a clean up crew that will clean all of the dead rock slime off of the sand. What kind of clean up crew would do that? And I've got a rotting cocktail shrimp in there that I'm sure some snail or shrimp would like. No crabs, hermit or otherwise.

And aside from the clean up crew I figured I'd buy one fish, to QT and then add to main tank in a month or so. What should I get? ultimately I want a tomato clown, but I want to add territorial fish like clowns later in the game. What is a beautiful, hearty, non territorial, and friendly fish that makes a good addition to a new tank? I'd prefer something small.

Neon gobies are nice and small. a 6 line wrasse would be nice but I hear they can be territorial. I have tons of pods, but they are baby pods, too too small. So a mandarin is out of the question but it would be nice to get a very colorful fish like that.


I'm looking forward to your opinion.

Thanks
Josh

[sid700]

I like these guys for cleanup crews and other stuff. I got their mix n match for $100. They are in Hawaii.

http://www.ipsf.com/

I've also decided a while back not to "work on" the aquarium when I'm watching the twins.

[mmoore0803]

Dude....that sucks! Don't you have a shop-vac? if not....get one...easier to clean up the floods....be glad the wife wasn't home to witness this.

Think of it as the "Newbie hazing Ritual." Everyone goes through it and the first time is never fun....Boy Scouts always say "be prepared"....course with our amazingly wonderful Indian Guides training, our motto was......uhm...."flashlight tag anyone?"

I'll second that ipsf link.....that's where my first few little snails came from (now...as you saw...my tank has become a brothel for those guys)....and I too purchased the mix for $100

I still say wait on the clown and get something more mellow....I saw the most amzing fish the other day at a lfs....i think they called it an arabian pseudochromis....but it had a more purple body than orange....cool little fish...might pick him up and put in the nano

And....I told you to put valves on all your pumps :rollface:

[Fmellish]

Thanks for the suggestions guys. I'll check out that ipsf place.

Bryan PMed me and said he has had floods before.

Mike, what's funny is that I see on some of the snail vendor sites that snails are difficult to reproduce, but yours won't stop doing it. THey must say that so that you don't try to buy just a few and breed them. Snails are a high margin item. They should be free, but some places charge $1.99 a snail. And from your experience, you can have a snail factory if you want.

The valve goes in today :) Although I'm not too keen on having a PVC ball valve in the middle of a vinyl tubing segment. It will put weight on the tubing.

[mmoore0803]

don't worry about the weight...i doubt it will be enough to cause trouble....i can give you a bunch of free snails the next time i see you...i shoulda given u some on Sunday ;)

Also, i had no real predators in my tank for 8 weeks when i was qting for ick...lots of reproduction with my pods and snails...i'm sure that helped

[Fmellish]

I checked out http://www.ipsf.com/ , and as with many aquarium hobby related websites, it's totally incomprehensible. I can't figure out where to click to get a clean-up crew. I can't find any pictures. it seems to be just one large page?

What is it with websites in this hobby? They all suck.

Josh

[mmoore0803]

these companies are not High Tech companies and can't pay for decent web services....you hafta read and cross reference using other sources so you can see what they sell....it's not "totally incomprehensible." eesh!

and if all you want are snails.....i have a ton i could part with

[jakem]

looks sweet. great job:D

[Fmellish]

I do'nt know what I want. I would like a star fish also, but not one of those sand sifting ones that will die after cleaning all of your sand. I want a bright red or bright blue startfish that won't starve in my tank.

And then I want some snails, some snails for cleaning sand, and some snails for eating algae. And then a few worms.

So tell me where to get that.

I'm going to get a fish tonight, and maybe the stuff mentioned above. I'm bringnig the girls too. It's going to be fun. Until I have to pay.

Cheers
Josh

[mmoore0803]

sweet....they'll love it.....as far as bristleworms mine just magically appeared in my tank...i never bought any...they usually come as hitchhikers....i hear the pretty blue and orange stars aren't good for the tanks...but i also have seen many in reef tanks...don't go crazy on the snails...can't wait to see yer new purchases....tonight i get my purple tang

[Fmellish]

Congrats. Let me know how it goes with Dori and Nemo

[Fmellish]

Updates Updates!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

Fish too!

[mmoore0803]

cute fish.....where r they in that last pic? Iwas reading that those brittlestars have been known to lurk on the tops of caves and drop down on unsuspecting sleeping fish......hook up a video camera....i'd luv to see that...i'll take pix of my new inhabitants and my new lights when i get home today

[Fmellish]

Let me know if the brittle star is bad ASAP. It will be harder to remove him later. Right now he isn't moving yet, so I can fish him out and flush him.

[mmoore0803]

I hear it's just the green ones....is yours green....I want one of these
http://www.reefermadness.us/RMD-Linckia_multiflora.htm

[Fmellish]

Mine is not green. He is just plain sand colored.

[Fmellish]

Updates!

Lights are on! Canopy under way! You look now!

Now!!

http://members.cox.net/jgunder/aquarium/

[ga_reefer_guy]

nice set-up

[Dubbin1]

So Josh how are you liking those lights? I hope I did good by recommending them to you.

[sundance1]

The setup looks great!

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6506496#post6506496 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dubbin1
So Josh how are you liking those lights? I hope I did good by recommending them to you.

The lights look real nice! I was up til 3 helping him put them on that amazing canopy in the pix.....but they look amazing

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6506496#post6506496 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dubbin1
So Josh how are you liking those lights? I hope I did good by recommending them to you.

The lights are wonderful I love them very much. They aren't the same exact color though, They are both labeled as 14K, but one is much much bluer, closer to 20K. I know this is somewhat common, but it looks a little weird with one side of the tank bluer than the other.

But overall I am ecstatic. I love them

Thanks
Josh

[TekCat]

Pretty cool setup! Good work! You are way more organized than me :)

[Fmellish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6510372#post6510372 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TekCat
Pretty cool setup! Good work! You are way more organized than me :)

Thanks :)

My friends would say the opposite. I rush through everything and never really plan. Luckliy I have friends who stop me at every corner and encourage me to do things the better way.


Josh

[Reef_Dweller_69]

Those lights are awsome. I can't wait until I can afford to upgrade to halides.

[mmoore0803]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6510473#post6510473 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish
Thanks :)

My friends would say the opposite. I rush through everything and never really plan. Luckliy I have friends who stop me at every corner and encourage me to do things the better way.


Josh

We try...but you never listen :lol: :lol: :lol:

Update your site....I wanna see the pix of the new inhabitants and the stand mods....ditch the old pix....we don't care to see how you put it together anymore:rollface:

[Fmellish]

Here's the current state of affairs. I'll update the site after I find a new host with more space.

My tank contains a new inhabitant a Sailfin tang. he is doing well. My brittle star is doing OK also, though he is too lazy to eat on his own and I have to direct feed him. I'm sure he'll die sometime if I forget to feed him. I also have 2 corals in my tank. A gorgonia? Looks like twigs with nice yellow polyps, and a hammer coral?

I was able to ventilate my stand by installing a fan and punching a hole in each side.

My water temp is running 82F even with lights off in the middle of the night and no heaters turned on. I took me awhile to figure it out. I noticed when I cleaned my skimmer, my temp would drop until I turned it back on. Duh! My skimmer pump is keeping my water in the 80s. With it off I can get the water back down to normal temps in the 70s and then my heaters come on.

So it looks like even though the Eheim 1262 is a powerful, quiet, efficient pump, it doesn't like being throttled. Installing the necessary ball valve and cranking it down to constrict flow really ****es this pump off and the pump turns into an oven. So even though its 68F downstairs in the middle of the winter night my tank is at 82F. I don't think turning the skimmer off is safe though, the water would retain all the brown gunk the skimmer is pulling out. I could reinstall the Mag7 but it was so darn loud.

Looks like its time to start researching again for a pump that is quiet and either has the correct amount of flow, or doesn't get hot if throttled back.

I'm going to contact AquaC customer support and get some ideas, they've always been good.

Cheers
Josh

[mmoore0803]

What's wrong with 82? As long as the aquarium stays consistent and temps don't drastically swing, you should be fine. Mine holds at 82 in the summer and 79-80 in the winter.

[Fmellish]

Most books say 72-78 is safe.

I suppose I just want to stay in that range. I don't want a hot tank.

[mmoore0803]

okay......still planning on finishing the canopies this weekend?

[revnull]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6535473#post6535473 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fmellish

So it looks like even though the Eheim 1262 is a powerful, quiet, efficient pump, it doesn't like being throttled. Installing the necessary ball valve and cranking it down to constrict flow really ****es this pump off and the pump turns into an oven. So even though its 68F downstairs in the middle of the winter night my tank is at 82F. I don't think turning the skimmer off is safe though, the water would retain all the brown gunk the skimmer is pulling out. I could reinstall the Mag7 but it was so darn loud.


You can move the skimmer pump out side of the sump so the stressed impeller motor no longer “directly� heats the water. I used to use an Eheim pump in my water cooled PC setup. When I had the pump submerged in the reservoir, my temps where around 130F. I switched to a closed loop system (removed the reservoir, added intake barb to the pump) and my temps dropped to just a little over 100F. I'm thinking you can drill a new bulkhead in the first chamber of the sump. Attach via intake barb and you're done.

[Fmellish]

Mike, yes we're going to finish those canopies.

Ray, you are correct. An externally plumbed pump has advantages. However I am beginning to think the source of my extra heat is not necessarily my skimmer pump. I will be doing more test tonight.

Thanks
JOsh

[mmoore0803]

Josh is the coolest person ever!

[Fmellish]

That is so sweet Mike, thank you!