Other Than Tangs.....What other Large Reef Safe Fish?

[StinkinTuna]

Like the title asks, what are some other peaceful, reef-safe, but large fish you recommend for a community tank?

Thanks,
-ST

[Chap]

Blue Jaw Trigger :D

[Fishfirst]

Anthias, some wrasses, larger gobies

[LukFox]

Rabbitfish and the majority of Genicanthus angels (some arent a reefsafe as they're made out to be, I think the Lamarck's?).

[StinkinTuna]

I'd like to get a trigger actually, but has anyone had problems with a blue jaw or the other 'safer' triggers like Niger actually eating snails, shrimp or polyps...I know that the Xanthichthys family of triggers is supposed to be ok (blue Jaw) but wondering if by first hand experience anyone had a bad one?

I was thinking about something a little bigger FishFirst but thanks :)

[StinkinTuna]

Will check out those angels Luk..thx

[Chap]

We've had our Blue Jaw for about a year now. Perfect reef companion so far. Lat night was the first time I have ever seen him go after any snails. I added 20 small cerith snails and Blue picked one up by the shell and carried it around the tank. Never did eat it.

Our Niger was a different story. We couldn't keep a clean up crew with him. He loved cracking the shells.

[Tagareef]

How about a Harlequin Tusk?

[JENnKerry]

We've had our Blue Jaw for about a year now. Perfect reef companion so far.

I'd be interested to know how your water quality is. Triggers are very messy eaters and expel a lot of waste. A little too messy for the likes of a reef unless you have the best skimmer money can buy.

Just because some people have success with triggers in reefs does not make them reef safe. It's like a dwarf angel. 50/50 chance, nothing more. But if it's working out, then congrats :D

[dhoch]

I also have a blue jaw trigger in my tank (as well as an eel... A chain link).

My blue jaw has been a model reef tank fish, except when he bit my finger :0

He has never gone after snails/hermits or the 5 shrimp (2 x skunks, 2 x fire, 1 x CBS) in the tank. Took a while for him to start eating (other than fed from a feeding stick), but now he eats it all (flake, frozen, raw seafood, even nori).

JenNKerry... I have 2 big bio-load fish in my tank (the blue chin and my chain link eel... who also has not eaten any shrimp or crabs, but has taken down the ocassional snail if he is feeling hungry)...

Tank is (well see my signature)

My water quality:
Nitrates ~0.2 (it gets hard to read the salifert test kit when it gets low... I would not say 0, but looking through the side (divide reading by 10 it reads between 1 and 2)
Nitritites 0
Ammonia 0

I don't have the best skimmer money can buy, but have a ASM G4 (which actually I want a bigger pump for, but have to save money... sigh)

Dave

[dhoch]

Here is a couple of pictures of Nippy (his name since he bit me):

http://www.danj.com/images/misc/trigger4.jpg

http://www.danj.com/images/misc/trigger2.jpg

[KDodds]

Niger's are more likely to cause trouble for other fishes than for corals. They will certainly eat crustaceans as well as they can catch them, but snails are generally safe. My Niger was removed specifically because of issues with other fish. If this is an SPS tank, the lighting may be a bit much for some Genicanthus, since they're (for the most part) frequenters of deeper waters. Many are finding that the Apolemichthys, Chaetodontoplus, and Pomacanthus are more "reef safe" than has previously been thought and practiced. Heniochus diphreutes and Chaetodon miliaris are frequently available, larger, shoaling species that may be worth a shot. Chelmon sp. and Forcipiger are also "reef safe" Butterflyfishes. Eels such as the "White Ribbon Eel" and small Morays can be somewhat "reef safe", but may topple corals that are not secured. Lions are definitely AT LEAST as reef safe as Triggers, but again, there's the issue with smaller fishes. Many Bodianus and Halichoeres Wrasses will also work (Thalasoma, not so well). HTH.

[JENnKerry]

Glad it's working for you Dave. I could never do it. There are always some that like taking chances. I guess my wife and I stay with what's traditional. Good job :thumbsup:

[Travis L. Stevens]

dhoch, either that's a tiny trigger or you have HUGE corals :D

[dhoch]

Trigger is about 5-6"... so yes I have some huge corals (that hammer in the middle is about basketball sized.

Dave

[Skorpinok]

Originally posted by KDodds
Heniochus diphreutes and Chaetodon miliaris are frequently available, larger, shoaling species that may be worth a shot. Chelmon sp. and Forcipiger are also "reef safe" Butterflyfishes.

So, The Lemon Butterfly - Chaetodon miliaris (http://store.yahoo.com/marinedepotlive/384214.html) is sorta reef safe as safe as the coral beauty and the flame angles?

This guy
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y235/Reef-Junkie/LemonButterfly-Chaetodonmiliaris.jpg
Sorry Marinedepotlive.com, I borrowed your image. :D

[KDodds]

Yes, they're planktivores and as such, should be safe, within reason. Of course, as with any fish, your mileage may vary according to individual specimen. I've been researching myself and have not found anyone who has tried them in a reef, so I would be the first, should I choose to do them, that I know of. But, all reports on the species have it listed as a non-corallivore, preferring lists of things like roe, polychaetes, zooplankton, etc. Be aware tho, that those offered for sale in actuality do NOT often look like the individual pictured. The yellow coloration tends to fade fairly rapidly in captivity, making them more grayish-silver, along the lines of a capistratus. Oh, I also left out the Hemitaurichthys Butterflies (Zoster's, Pyramid) which I know from seeing them in reef tanks, are reef safe. HTH.

[Skorpinok]

So you don't know any who has tried this fish in a reef tank. Still a good choice for a yellow fish rather than a yellow tang - IMO.

MY GF has always complained that I need something bright swimming around - She wanted a yellow tang! Go figure.

Sorry for jumping on the thread:rolleye1: .

[JENnKerry]

No butterfly is reef safe.

[cyberpanther]

If money is not an issue go with the reef-safe (as reef safe as triggers go anyway) Crosshatch Trigger. I have one on backorder right now, beautiful fish, but expensive. Atlantis seems to have the best price online, Live Aquaria has them, but there out of stock right now and much more expensive, My LFS has them cheaper than online, and has the healthiest fish I have ever seen, (I love Salty Critter) but they're on backorder for 2-3 weeks. I know you are looking for large, reef-safe fish, but have you considered any of the Leopard Wrasses. Beautiful fish. I have a Vermiculite and a regular Leopard, both are stunning.

[BigDaddy]

I have a 26" zebra moray, it's been perfect, except for eating one urchin. Zebra's don't bother fish, mainly crabs and shrimp.

My cleaners have not been bothered. The secret has been to keep him fed.

Their danger is w/ knocking over coral. But that has not been a problem. He stays around the base of my large pieces of live rock in each of the corners. He comes out all the way when being fed.

Great Addition.

[KDodds]

Originally posted by JENnKerry
No butterfly is reef safe.

Not true. This is the same "argument" that has kept people from keeping all Butterflies and large Angels in reefs. All of the Butterflies mentioned are AT LEAST as "reef safe" as Tangs. Many Tangs, for instance, especially Zebrasoma, take a liking to consuming, or at least picking at, LPS like Trachyphyllia. Yet, there is no wholesale warning as to the "reef safe" status of Tangs. Chelmon and Forcipiger are, IME, and the experiences of many, MORE reef safe than Tangs, actually, although they will eat FD worms and such. Heniochus diphreutes (ONLY) is in the same boat. I think what it comes down to is that Butterflies, at least the vast majority of them, are corallivores to some extent, which has lead many to exclude the entire Family. Currently, I am even keeping a large Scribbled Angel (Chaetodontoplus douboulayi) without any problems with soft corals. Angels, tho, are more browsers. Given the appropriate diets, tho, they are, again IME and in the increasing experiences of those willing to try, are far less likely to detroy corals. Some Angels being kept in reefs successfully are Scribbled, Conspiculatus, Pomas, Goldflakes, Trimacs, Asfurs, Emperors, Regals, and Majestics, as well as all of the Genicanthus, with the exception of G. personatus, which prefers more temperate waters.

[JENnKerry]

You learn something new everyday :)

[BigDaddy]

I have an emperor angel, majestic angel, a copperband butterflyfish and a zebra moray in my reef.

The only thing I've found so far that I can't keep in my tank are the meaty LPS' like an open brain. I currently keep clams, sps, softies and one LPS a cup coral.

[SilverOne]

A few different angels.


The Japanese Swallowtail, Watanabei or the Lamarck's.

[KDodds]

Originally posted by To-Arbitrate
So you don't know any who has tried this fish in a reef tank. Still a good choice for a yellow fish rather than a yellow tang - IMO.

MY GF has always complained that I need something bright swimming around - She wanted a yellow tang! Go figure.

Sorry for jumping on the thread:rolleye1: .

No. In fact, I posted a thread, unanswered, here a few days ago looking for opinions/experiences. From all I have read on them, however, the indications would be that they are worth a shot for someone willing to risk it. Keep in mind my caveat above as well, every report, and IME, every one kept in a FO or FOWLR, has a tendency to lose the yellow. For some individuals the loss is complete, for other, the yellow in the unpaired fins remains, and remains bright. For a few, the yellow stays, but in a much faded comparison to it's former glory. My guess is that, like so many other species, if they're kept in a reef, they'll be more likely to retain some of their glorious coloration. But then, no one with a reef, that I know of, has them.

[StinkinTuna]

For the angels that you have kept, have any bothered any small shrimps or snails?

[StinkinTuna]

Great info on this thread, I actually had no idea there was success for some of the popular Large Angels and Butterflies out there...

If they are truly more reef safe than previously thought, this opens alot of doors for the large reef fish selection!

Thanks All! Keep the suggestions coming...very interesting!

[centipededesign]

I have a copper band butterfly. He is an awesome fish. I have caught him eating nassarius snails and some polyps off my nepthia but i just got him eating clams (from the grocery store) so hopefully he will be more attentive to those then my poor nassarius snails. I would try one, if it gets that fin fungi, ignore it and keep your water quality up. It will go away.

[KDodds]

Angels generally do not bother snails or hermits, at least not the ones I've seen in reefs. I would suspect a more bellgerent, aggressive, larger one MIGHT, like a French, Gray, or Passer maybe.

[Madoktopus]

my dad has a white ribbon eel ans a virgate rabbitfish in one of his tanks. id say some large wrasses are good like birdmouths or moons but watch out crabs!