fish problems

[rygar126]

i have had the tank for about a month now. several problems came along. first of all, some of my trochus snails died. second, my six line wrasse, bangaii cardinal and twin spotted goby died. my false perc is still tickin tho but has not accepted the rose anemone yet. the problems came after i added more live rock to the cycled tank. i added about 4 lbs to the system. is it true that it will cause another spike in the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate? so i thought the fish died of unknown causes until i checked my nitrate. it was at 80 ppm via mardel test strips. so im not sure if the LR caused the nitrate spikes or fish that i have in there. right now i have seachem purigen in there and i poured a small bag of biospira in there as well. i want to get a seaclone 100 to aid in my water filtration but i was told i didnt need to for a 10 gall. so, in the long run i want to have in my tank 1 false perc, 1 six line wrasse, a sifter goby, and a bangaii cardinal. reef-wise i still want to add some blue striped mushrooms, ricordea, more button polyps and favia/favites. i know its a lot but i was told that 4 small fish with regular water changes is ok. as for the corals, im not sure. so please give me as much feedback as you possibly can.


__________________
10 gallon w/ aquaclear 70.
current dual satellite 80 watts.
rio 90 powerhead
10 lbs live rock
17 lbs live sand
rose anemone, star polyps, feather duster, frogspawn, candy cane coral, tree coral, button polyps, red kelp
1 false perc, 1 cleaner shrimp, several snails and hermits, 1 porcelain crab, 1 strawberry crab

[moggyhill]

too many fish too fast. slow down alot, take a big breath because it is a marathon, not a sprint. The tank needs time to develop good bacteria. I am sorry to tell you this but someone gave you really bad advice. 10 gallons might support a couple of shrimp and one small fish but that is it for livestock. You can put small corals in it if you want. The live rock should have been properly cured before adding to the tank. This way you should not get any spikes. Anemones do not do well in most tanks and do better under mh. They also get too big.

[tanker]

1) Adding LR to an extabished tank will almost always start another cycle.

2) A 10gal is realy small, so you have to be very careful because any little thing will upset balance (water chem).

3) IMO a 10 gal is too small for any anemone--they produce a lot of waste.

[rygar126]

most lfs' told me 3 SMALL fish is the limit in a 10 gall. i already have a false perc so would be a good second fish and a good goby? how many snails/hermits should i have? i know everything sounds irrational but i just want to get the most out of a 10 gall. my assumption was that when the nitrites hit zero then the cycle is finished. i guess that isnt the case. and a lot of is due to my stupid impatience. i get too excited and just want to put everything in. how about the nitrate problem. do you think the purigen and biospira will fix it for now?

[tanker]

Originally posted by rygar126
a lot of is due to my stupid impatience. i get too excited and just want to put everything in. how about the nitrate problem. do you think the purigen and biospira will fix it for now?

Yep--You moving too fast. The nitrate problem will fix itself--patients.

Biospira will help but still need time for it to establish. Follow instructions on back and then wait another week or two before adding fish.

[rygar126]

can i add mushrooms and some buttons?

[tanker]

Originally posted by rygar126
can i add mushrooms and some buttons?

Should be OK after the cycle. Be slow.

[rygar126]

ok....i just have to control myself....hehe

[moggyhill]

no more fish.:(

[rygar126]

i only have 1 false perc. thats the only one i can put in there? i want to add a goby and either a six line or another false perc

[tanker]

Originally posted by rygar126
i only have 1 false perc. thats the only one i can put in there? i want to add a goby and either a six line or another false perc

The anemone will produce more waste then your 10gal may handle. If just 2 fishes, I think it is OK, but not with an anemone.

[Gargausius]

You want too many fish and too many corals in that little 10 gallon tank of yours. The system in the long run, if you keep this up will fail. Granted the slowest growing corals you want are the Moon Corals and Moonstone Corals (Favia and Favites), but you've also got a Frogspawn and a Tree Coral (don't know what genus of coral you're referring to here), and a Rose Anemone.

First off, Frogspawns are fast growing corals. I don't know how familiar you are with the growth rate of certain corals, but they grow just as fast as a Bubble Coral. Bubbles are fast growing LPS corals. Not all LPS corals are super slow growing. More over, they're highly aggressive. If you haven't already noticed the looong sweeper tentacles they can whip out, you will, when they start feeling threatened. These guys have potent stings and can cause massive damage to other corals. Frogspawns are related to Hammer Corals (corals known for their powerful sting and long sweepers).

Second, most soft corals are fairly large to begin with. And even if you managed to buy a frag or a small specimen, some grow very fast. Now, by Tree Corals, you're referring to Colt Corals (Cladiella sp.) or Kenya Trees (Nephthya sp.), these grow pretty quickly given the right conditions. They also sway around a lot, which means they are defending their territory.

As far as you wanting Favia and Favites, unless you get way stronger lighting, those corals will not thrive under your care. They can handle metal halide lighting just fine. In fact, the growth of Favia and Favites are very noticeable under halides versus other kinds of lighting, (but they're still very slow growing). I used to grow one under a pair of 400W 10,000K metal halide bulbs that were held 1 feet above a 40 or 60 gallon tank, (not exactly sure which it was), at the bottom half of the tank. It looked nice under the lighting regimen I gave it. I grew it for a year, and lost it due to inexperience.

Rose Anemones are mobile. They have stinging tentacles. They don't mix with corals. It's either corals or anemones in that one tank. You're putting your animals at risk when you mix anemone and corals together. If you go with an anemone tank, keep the same species of anemone in one tank please! Different species will kill each other. I've personally witnessed this at a pet store I worked at. I couldn't do anything about it because the owner was ignorant about what I had to say.

Lastly, check the adult sizes of your fish. All the fish you mentioned, if properly quarantined, pre-treated, and cared for, are very easy to keep. They WILL live a long life, you can count on that. So that means, no cramming!

[rygar126]

do you think a seaclone 100 will benefit my tank?

[moggyhill]

you just don't get it do you?:hammer: :hammer: :hammer:
you want a blessing for the catastrophe you have or will soon have and thats not going to happen. :(

[rygar126]

what are you talking about......i just want to know if a skimmer will help my tank right now. geez calm down.

[fishman805]

Originally posted by rygar126
what are you talking about......i just want to know if a skimmer will help my tank right now. geez calm down.

You're getting very sound advice here.... Listen to it... You have more going on in that little 10 gal. in one month than I have in my 150gal after 7 weeks!.... That rose BTA alone can get to over 1' in diameter when opened up.... Everyone is trying to save you the heartache that you are already experiencing and the lives of the critters....

[rygar126]

i didnt say i was not going to listen to you guys. obviously if everybody is telling me the samething, its probably true. i really appreciate the advice too. about the anemone, there is no way i can get it out of my tank. so any suggestions? and again......i just want to know if a skimmer will benefit my tank given the fact that i take everybodys advice. i dont see why me asking about a skimmer would cause these reactions.

[fishman805]

Yes .... a skimmer will help..

[MarcGrant]

You can also increase the number of fish kept by increasing system size by adding a sump. A larger tank would be the way to go but there are ways to increase fish load safely, provided they can all co-exist.

Marc

[rygar126]

ill look more into sumps because i dont know much about them. thank you everybody for your advice. it is greatly appreciated.

[tanker]

With such a small tank --IMO--you do not need a skimmer. Just do some huge ( in relation to your tank) water changes. About 2-3 gals per week. This changing of 20%-30% --again IMO-- is better then a skimmer. With a 20%-30% water change there is nothing to skim. If you stay the course and keep-up with the weekly water changes you "MAY NOT" even need to test water.

Again JMHO. :)

[rygar126]

random question.....whats IMO and JMHO?

[tanker]

Originally posted by rygar126
random question.....whats IMO and JMHO?

IMO== In My Opinion.

JMHO== Just My Humble Opinion.

[speedracer0010]

Originally posted by fishman805
Yes .... a skimmer will help..

On a 10 gallon, I wouldn't bother with a skimmer just do 50% water changes twice a week or so.

[fishman805]

Originally posted by speedracer0010
On a 10 gallon, I wouldn't bother with a skimmer just do 50% water changes twice a week or so.

Water changes like that are a bit much.... If you don't like the skimmer idea, then go with the fuge or sump.... That will effectively increase your tank capacity and will also hold chemical balance ( nitrification I mean ) better....But I still believe the skimmer would not hurt things at all...

[tanker]

Originally posted by fishman805
Water changes like that are a bit much.... If you don't like the skimmer idea, then go with the fuge or sump.... That will effectively increase your tank capacity and will also hold chemical balance ( nitrification I mean ) better....But I still believe the skimmer would not hurt things at all...

On a 10gal a 20% water changes is only 2 gals. :)

I have to changes over 70gals of water per month!! Of course this includes my VERY heavily stocked FW tank too. :(

[fishman805]

Originally posted by tanker
On a 10gal a 20% water changes is only 2 gals. :)

I have to changes over 70gals of water per month!! Of course this includes my VERY heavily stocked FW tank too. :(

My point was that if the original poster was to follow the advise of 50% changes twice a week he would effectively be in a perpetual cycle period.... IMO, 5% weekly would be the max.... if you stick to it and don't get lax....:)