anyone ever see or have a sea turtle in a home tank???

[agoutihead]

im sure if you get them as a baby they would work... obviously you would have to get rid of it when it gets too big... but has anyone ever seen or had themselves a sea turtle??


if i can remmeber like 15 years ago i was a little kid and i think i remember someone in my family in florida having a bunch of them in a tank. i was little though... but i still kinda remember.

and i know im going to hear all of the "its illegal" i know that, but people still get baby sea turtles. so no need to tell me its illegal. thanks!!

[Andrew]

Never have and Never plan to.

[onecrzyboi4u]

why get a baby sea turtle and get attached when it's best to leave it in nature.. come one lets think about it.. let nature have that one..

[sinkingbeach]

My son's first grade has three, they were given to the class to be released this spring. They are doing quite well, eating, getting stronger, and larger. It's part of a local conservation program, the eggs were hatched at the Brigatine Mammal Stranding Center, classes throughout South Jersey care for them throughout the winter and then release them.
Thier requirements are different then a reef enviroment, they need a place to occasionally rest(floating plastic). I'm pretty sure my son's teacher is using back bay water(heated)for water changes. I'm not sure what they are eating. :cool:

[bngowe]

haha.. sea turtles are endangered and grow HUGE. ..

i guess you can snatch an egg off the beach if u can find it. .but personally. . i wouldn't. .taht's kinda immoral to me..

raising it in your tank then getting rid of it when its tooo big and becomes a burden..

i mean .if ya really want one. . .why not get a baby red eared slider or something...for a freshwater tank.

[Leviathan]

I read this thread, and cant help to think aside from the moral/legal issues,,LEGAL being key here.

IF, you were able to pull off having one for a prioed of time, only to release it back to its abducted from habitate, would it even know how to survive? I mean I realize there is natural instinct, but still I think there may be some long term effects that are unavoidable in doing something like this.

JMO

[onecrzyboi4u]

come to think about it.. where would it go to breedin time? there would be one horny turtle on ur hands....ouch!

[Bullredchaser]

I dont think a sea turtle would survive beig released in New Jersey.I see them here off Miami and the Keys when the water temps are in the mid 80's.They seem to migrate south when the water temps drop below 78.And the ones here average between 36" and 48" inches.

[agoutihead]

i dont see how you guys say taking one thing from the ocean is worse or immoral compared to every other thing we take out. isnt that a bit hypocrtical?

[Leviathan]

Originally posted by agoutihead
i dont see how you guys say taking one thing from the ocean is worse or immoral compared to every other thing we take out. isnt that a bit hypocrtical?

I can understand what you are trying to say,but!

Taking a sessile invertebrate ( aquacultured in a system ) and having it in your tank and taking a mobile ( endagered ) animal and putting it into captivity are two completely different things.

I know some will say,,well fish are mobile and are not all raised in farms ( true ) but I think as home aquarists we are much better suited for long term HEALTY survial of wild caught fish. ( at least thoses who are responsible and actually research the needs of each animal they choose to take care of )

This may have been better suited for the responsible reefkeeing forum,,,though its not really reef related at all,,,hmmm time for a new forum I guess.:D

[phil519]

Originally posted by agoutihead
i dont see how you guys say taking one thing from the ocean is worse or immoral compared to every other thing we take out. isnt that a bit hypocrtical?

Well first of all, all the sea turtles that are near US waters are considered threatened (T) or endangered (E):

E,T Sea turtle, green ( Chelonia mydas)
E Sea turtle, hawksbill ( Eretmochelys imbricata)
E Sea turtle, Kemp's ridley ( Lepidochelys kempii)
E Sea turtle, leatherback ( Dermochelys coriacea)
T Sea turtle, loggerhead ( Caretta caretta)
T Sea turtle, olive ridley ( Lepidochelys olivacea)

Full list can be found here:
US List Threatened/Endangered Reptiles (http://ecos.fws.gov/tess_public/TESSWebpageVipListed?code=V&listings=0#C)

Furthermore - what does any reefer actually know about a sea turtle? Much is unknown about them even with satellite observation. Some species live on a diet of jellyfish (sidebar: never ever toss clear plastic bags into the ocean) - is that something readily available in your neck of the woods to feed? The smallest (ridley) grows to 2 feet in length, with the largest (leatherback) growing to 6 feet and over 1000 pounds.

Yes they are cute when born - so are baby alligators/crocodiles and baby anacondas. I think most large reptiles (no matter how small as a baby) shouldn't be kept. In ny here some one released a Caiman crocodilus into the pond! Can you imagine someone with a sea turtle releasing it into Lake michigan or something! Btw the caiman would have never survived. It lives in a zoo now in ny.

It's not because I'm being hypocritical - it's because the success rate is likely to be very bad because of our inability to understand behavior and diet. Let alone if we were successful how do you keep such a large reptile in a tank?

So that is my long winded way of saying - I agree with both posts from Leviathan!

[Putawaywet]

Phil,

Thanks for saying what I've been thinking because I've pretty much just been at a complete loss for words since this thread was started.

I've been working with Olive Ridley's and Greens for nearly 7 years now and I can honestly say that if you have even the slightest hint that you want to get involved with these animals you need to get in touch with a conservation group and go work with the pros. There are lot's of groups that have operations in neighboring countries that offer working vacations for hard working marine oriented types. A week or two collecting eggs or helping with the needs of captive animals on a Mexican beach might offer a unique alternative to your next vacation.

Or, you can even apply for a volunteer position at your local public aquarium and get you fill caring for them there.

Either way, these guys need to be left to those who can meet their needs, not stuck in some home tank because someone thinks they'd make a "cool" pet.

Brett

[ozadars]

My lfs has a Chelonia mydas in a pond looking tank which is connected to their biggest tank with a black tip shark and few tangs. The turtle let you pet him and they feed him with land plants. They have the turtle for around 2 years I guess. His tank is quite small and I not a fan of keeping these animals in close systems. Not only because most of them die but also these animals spend almost whole their life travelling.

Btw here is a picture of the sea turtle in my lfs. It was caught by fisherman in Cyprus and it was injured. Its brought to my lfs and they healed him.
http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/download.php?id=13974

[vince R]

All that aside don't sea turtles live a hundred years or more? That isn't a pet that's a family heirloom. To take something that could live that long and stick it in an aquarium to live maybe 20 years tops just isn't right. With most aquatic animals they dont reach potential age because of predation. The sea turtle doesn't have many predators. Big sharks and whales are about all that eats them and they usually don't because much easier meals are to be had elswhere. With most anything we buy, to ease the guilt of having it you can at least say well I saved it from being eaten in nature. With these creatures thats simply not true.

[CH]

Never heard of it in a home tank, but the zoo here (Henry Doorly in Omaha) recently added two to the shark display tank (about 900,000 gallons total)
They are very cool to watch, and since there is a 70ft long tunnel, you can see them as they swim over the top of you - pretty cool. They are two different types that were added, one was a "green sea turtle, and I don't remember the other.

[efeeley]

Federal violation would be similar to possessing cocaine.

[Inferno]

Originally posted by ozadars
My lfs has a Chelonia mydas in a pond looking tank which is connected to their biggest tank with a black tip shark and few tangs. The turtle let you pet him and they feed him with land plants. They have the turtle for around 2 years I guess. His tank is quite small and I not a fan of keeping these animals in close systems. Not only because most of them die but also these animals spend almost whole their life travelling.

Btw here is a picture of the sea turtle in my lfs. It was caught by fisherman in Cyprus and it was injured. Its brought to my lfs and they healed him.
http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/download.php?id=13974

What size tank does your LFS have that has a black tip reef shark?

[Dolfan0925]

I know fer sure that if you keep a freshwater turtle for a while it will no longer be able to make it on it's own and will certainly die. I wouldn't imagine it would be that much different with a sea turtle. You may be condemning the sea turtles to death by keeping them like that and releasing them.

[Warnberg]

You can not legally get them as a baby or even poses one without the proper authority.... they catch you with one, here is the penelty:
Sea turtles in Florida are protected through Florida Statutes, Chapter 370, and by the United States Endangered Species Act of 1973. Of those species that nest on Broward's beaches, green and leatherback sea turtles are listed officially as endangered and the Florida population of loggerhead sea turtles are considered threatened. Briefly, these laws state that: "No person may take, harass, harm, pursue, hunt, shoot, wound, kill, trap, capture or attempt to engage in any such conduct to marine turtles, turtle nests, and/or turtle eggs." Any person who knowingly violates any provision of the act may be assessed civil penalties up to $25,000 or a criminal penalty up to $50,000 and up to one year imprisonment.

http://www.co.broward.fl.us/bri00600.htm

Here in Florida they take the sea turtle population very seriously as they are decling rapidly.....
So why would you want to attempt to keep such an animal?

[bswedenburg]

it's amazing the questions people entertain, isn't it?

[Dolfan0925]

lol, what's wrong with answering questions bswedenburg? That's what RC is for.

[Warnberg]

It's not the answering of the question... sometimes it's the lack of thought behind the question it self. I mean I can understand if you don't know something..... but keeping a sea turtle? that's like asking if it is possible to keep a porpoise in a home tank?

JMO

[Dolfan0925]

I'd rather someone ask a stupid question than just going and doing it.

[Warnberg]

I completely agree.

[moggyhill]

Illegal, immoral, unethical, question answered and on to other questions please. Perhaps we can change the subject to blue ring octopus and keeping them:D

[Paul B]

They used to sell them in Aquarium Stock Co. in Manhattan in the late sixtees. I really don't know why though. Cute little suckers. They also used to sell live adults in the Fulton Fish market in NY.
I used to see them lying on their backs waiting to be made into soup. Of course, they do not do that anymore. Diamond backed terripins are salt water turtles that I swim with all the time locally in NY. They get about 9" long but they are probably also illegal to collect.
Here is a hawksbill named Clemintine that I dove with in Tahiti in November.
Paul
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/13094butterfly_turtle_tahiti-med.jpg

[moggyhill]

In Lexington Market in Baltimore City, Maryland they used to sell live Diamondback terrapins to make soup out of. You used to be able to get the soup at the Johns Hopkins alumna club too.

[browardreefer]

i shoot people who take sea turtle eggs illigaly ( usualy they mark off teh egg areas with yellow tape and throw u in jail if u pass the yellow line.)

i know there are licences to gt them since we had them at the musium i volenteered at. and some big public aquariums. but for a home take. NO WAY

[crazyfishlady]

My mother worked for the federal prison system for years - there were inmates there for killing endangered animals. . . since it is a federal offense. Seems like a no brainer to me.:rolleyes:

[Mr.Lloyd]

The LFS in Turkey does not have the USFWS to bust down their door and be big time pain in the butt.Being permitted by them and knowing how Feds act my advice is play by the rules no matter how well you could keep one.Remember these guys play for keeps and they have alot of input on the rules.Being an old paratrooper I can tell you that jumping out of good planes is quite safe compared with messing with critters on "THE LIST".

[browardreefer]

paratrooper. thatr eminds me I MISSED BAND OF BROTHERS tonight :(( cry cry( I GUES ILL BUY THE DVD :P

[jetmechG550]

All I can add is that I was on vacation in Cancun Mexico a few years ago, it was early Sept and my wife and I were able to witness a large female come up on the beach one night, dig a hole, lay eggs, and cover them up and back to sea she went. It really was amazing to see. The Mexican authorities (DNR) was there to collect the eggs and whatever hotel's beach the eggs were on the hotel was given the eggs. They all had pens on the beach setup and the eggs were burried there where they were watched after and when they hatched they were collected up. In the early evenings just before it got dark the hatchlings were released and if you were a hotel guest they would let you hold one and they had people there explaining the lives of sea turtles. It had to be done quick to beat the seagulls. I think one of the "experts" said that of the 50 or so turtles that were released the night we did it, one might survive. It was a pretty cool and plan to head back to do again once my daughter gets a little older. It is illegal there too if you try to keep one since they are a protected species, but after seeing these things in the wild, who would want to remove one from their natural environment.

[swims withthe fishes]

All that aside don't sea turtles live a hundred years or more? That isn't a pet that's a family heirloom. To take something that could live that long and stick it in an aquarium to live maybe 20 years tops just isn't right.

along with all of your anemones that live for 500 years + in the wild. but don't feel bad for them. :rolleye1:

Big sharks and whales are about all that eats them and they usually don't because much easier meals are to be had elswhere
Whales are not predatory on turtles.

that aside, i think people need to focus more on the long term of their "Pets". these animals in your tank are no more dispensible than your dog or cat. "So what if your cat eats garbage food and only lives for 5 years instead of 15, there are tons more cats you can buy right? Hell there's tons of free ones." Come on people. you want to keep a baby sea turtle in a pond or tank, hand feed it iceburg lettuce and goldfish, then cut it loose when you are done gawking at it, to be devoured or starved in the ocean....... Forget the legality issue, it is your responsibilty to present common sense as the higher being on this planet when selecting an animal to keep in captivity.

[ebacon]

I think some of you are missing the point here. The question wasnt is it possible or moral or ethical or even legal. We ALREADY know the answers to those questions. The question as posed was does anyone know of it occuring and if so with what if any success. Lets not confuse the issue here folks ;-)

[xian]

I know fer sure that if you keep a freshwater turtle for a while it will no longer be able to make it on it's own and will certainly die. I wouldn't imagine it would be that much different with a sea turtle. You may be condemning the sea turtles to death by keeping them like that and releasing them.

How do you know that a freshwater turtle cannot survive in the wild after being kept in captivity. I used to keep freshwater turtle that I found in the road for a couple of weeks then let them go. I'm fairly sure they were fine. I'm also having trouble with the idea that helping baby sea turtles get a head start before releasing them into the ocean is "condemning them to death."

Overproduction is part of the sea turtle life history most of them are "condemned to death" by their own mothers by being left to the mercy of predators. Regardless of how many we help into the water most of them are going to die anyway. Thats plain old natural selection. They are turtles. Not Dogs. and not people They are not taught to survive by their parents and can certainly find food on their own just as if they had crawled down the beach themselves.

By the way I am not advocating keeping one in captivty just trying to bring a bit of prespective. That said does anyone know what their track record in captivity is? I know the New England Aquarium had some when I was a kid. I haven't been there since 1987



along with all of your anemones that live for 500 years + in the wild. but don't feel bad for them.


Swims with...: I don't want you to think I'm picking at you tonight but that's a bit unfair. An anemone doesn't have a brain. It can't suffer. That's important to remember. Trees can live for thousands of years but I don't feel that fact makes keeping a bonsai immoral. I'm quite attached to my anemone, I even named it, but I don't treat it the same as my dog.

Just my $.02

[swims withthe fishes]

I understand you are not picking, we are all here for discussion.
it is a bad thing to compare to a turtle but we are already there so.....
i feel, whether or not an animal feels or has a brain does not exempt it as being Alive. because something cannot suffer doesn't mean it's ok for us to allow it to die. don't get me wrong, i have one too. one of the most captivating things in the world to watch is a clown wriggling around in his host, and i see that at home every day. but the fact is we are at the point where we can keep anemones in captivity happily and healthy, and the only way we will get better at it is by more of us doing it. we are not at the point however where anyone shy of a masters in marine biology and animal husbandry should attempt to keep a sea turtle. if they are condemned to death by nature, then that is nature. if they are condemned to death by the human nature to posess, then that is sad.

[xian]

if they are condemned to death by nature, then that is nature. if they are condemned to death by the human nature to posess, then that is sad.

I agree but I don't think that hatching eggs in a classroom for release is harmful.

My anemone is a curley cue so I just enjoy it for its appearence the clown lives in the Anthellia coral.:D

[WaterKeeper]

Wow, I'm at Loggerheads with this one, How did I miss this post?

Just leave the turtles alone PLEASE. Even returning them to the ocean would be a problem as their migration is finely orchestrated and you'd never duplicate the timing. Stick with Polar Bears if you want unusual creatures in your tank. ;)

[swims withthe fishes]

LOL... i was watching discovery channel the other night and saw them feeding the 2 cutest little white puppies i had ever seen... i watched the program for 20 minutes to find out what kinda pup it was.....

yup. polarbears. i rushed right out and bought one on sale for 24.99 at petsmart.

[FreakRDog]

Did the ever say, "I want a sea turtle"? Give the guy a break!

[WaterKeeper]

Hi FreakRDog
[welcome]

One of the things you'll find out about RC is we champion responsible reefkeeping. For our hobby to grow without outside restrictions we need to be careful in out posts not to promote practices that can harm wildlife. Keeping sea turtles, be it planned or merely imagined, does not foster those goals. That is why the somewhat heated responses to this thread.

[avshockey311]

WaterKeeper, is a Polar Bear reef safe? Ive been thinking...........

[acroconut]

Chris, For sake of argument you kill or eat nothing to stay alive? So how do we deal with cattle and chickens? Are they grown under the plastic in the supermarket refridg bins? Or are they grown on farms, and do they not suffer when we kill them for consumption? Let you in on this.... I live on a working farm. Ok, you'll say that's humane. If it were you being slaughtered for consumption would you consider any means humane? I laugh here because I'm not a Greenie. Is a boneless ham a process of breeding? Does that thinking (humane killing) apply to vegetabales? Do we know whether grass feels anything when we chop it down with our mowers? Who appoints themselves as knowing?.... as most of our science has been built on experimentation. How many anemones and corals were lost in our getting to where we are today in reefkeeping....how many have considered this????? I don't advocate what has happened here by any means, but the advances in this hobby have been made over more losses than most would care to consider, and I've been at it for quite some time now. Maybe some of you oldsters would care to chime in here? Maybe I'm out on a limb by myself...so be it! Wouldn't be the first time. Feet first here I go again.

[FreakRDog]

I understand that.......It would be a very lame idea to try to captivate a sea turtle! But watching people get into some kind of hate mob, then start to criticize spelling, grammer, etc. over a simple question makes everyone want to post a message on this board, right?

[acroconut]

Sorry Waterkeeper...have to agree with what you posted. Was formulating my post prior to yours. Still I hold to my opinion as sure many others do.

[WaterKeeper]

Mad, Do I look MAD!!!




<--------- :D

[acroconut]

You look like Moe...Larry, Cheese ...Woooooobbhhhhhwaaahhhh....Moe...Larry.....Cheese ......Woooobbbbwaaaahhhhhh. Spinning on the matt. Sorry but you asked. OOOOOpppppss? It took me a bit to get it right.

[acroconut]

Folllowed only by Niagara Falls.....Slowly I turn...step by step...inch by inch.

[Putawaywet]

Originally posted by xian
By the way I am not advocating keeping one in captivty just trying to bring a bit of prespective. That said does anyone know what their track record in captivity is? I know the New England Aquarium had some when I was a kid. I haven't been there since 1987

To answer your question they fair quite well in captivity. At least from the standpoint of physical well-being. The Greens down at LBAOP were aquired from another institution that had them for quite some time. They have actually been in captivity longer than the Feds have required documentation so their original history is kinda sketchy. Out best guess is they have been out of the wild for over 25 years.

Aditionally, sea turtles have such strong survival instincts that they have shown to be quite capable of making a go of it in the wild even after years of captivity. Mother nature seems to have equipped them with some high end survival skills.

Adult Greens can average anywhere from 200-350lbs and consume multiple Kg's of various meaty foods per week. To keep one you'll be looking at a tank with 10's of thousands of gallons of water volume, access to a vet skilled in marine animals, a large supply of fresh sea food, as well as large quanities of quality seawater. And you will also need the proper permits as well as allowing Fish and Game periodic visits to access the health and well-being of the animals.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/23770DSCF0002.jpg

Brett

[acroconut]

Tom, I'm a BIG Stooge fan, so hope you understand I meant no offense. I agree that you're right. I think there is a line between experimentation and propagation. My opinion is that most experimentation is best left in the hands of those who are on the cutting edge of new scientific developments. Also I believe that people need to get back in touch with reality....the advancement didn't get here without losses. And that is fact not JMHO. Let's move on so that the next generation of reefkeepers won't have to face the losses we have had to face, and maybe this hobby won't have to depend on the ocean (so heavily) for its sustenance.

[Dannyboy17]

I keep 4 baby sea turtles in a 10g tank. Will they survive in there for life?














Joke. MY sister said she wanted a sea turtle, so I bought her a freshwater turtle, and told her it was a sea turtle!



--Dan

[davidryder]

Originally posted by agoutihead
i dont see how you guys say taking one thing from the ocean is worse or immoral compared to every other thing we take out. isnt that a bit hypocrtical?

they are endangered!

http://www.co.broward.fl.us/bri00600.htm


but good job for not caring!!

jerk.

[davidryder]

Originally posted by FreakRDog
I understand that.......It would be a very lame idea to try to captivate a sea turtle! But watching people get into some kind of hate mob, then start to criticize spelling, grammer, etc. over a simple question makes everyone want to post a message on this board, right?

"you know what napoleon? you can leave!"
-Uncle Rico, Napoleon Dynamite


If you feel you have been wronged, or someone has been wronged, don't go about your resolution by attacking the community. It is completey absurd to consider any sort of interaction with an endangered species in the comfort of your home. It is a simple question, and there is AND was a simple answer, but the member kept insisting that it is not immoral. So, a lot of people got upset. And now we are here, not there.

I suggest this thread be closed.

[Dolfan0925]

Wow, this thread is still goin on? Wasn't the answer given like 2 weeks ago or something?

[WaterKeeper]

As long as everyone is civil to each other an exchange of opinions is always good at RC. We preach not to keep sharks or throw tangs into a 10 gallon nano but I know some of you (darn newbies ;) ) do it. I think this thread shows that we do care at RC on making sensible decisions in what we allow in out tanks. However, anymore name calling and I pull the plug, OK.

[Warnberg]

PULL IT...

[ebacon]

I disagree. I think this thread should stay as an answer to the "newbies" who for whatever reason or another may be considering this and just don't know better.

IMO the only reason to pull it is because some people may be offended at the very thought of someone trying to keep sea turtles. But I belive the opposite is true. Rather than offending someone delicate sensibilities wouldn't we as responsible reef keepers and wouldn't RC as a responsible forum be more satisfied in educating someone who is considering doing something ecologically unsound as a means of prevention rather than allowing them to go forth ignorant and uneducated.

In other words if someone is considering keeping turtles they will do a search and this thread will appear. They will then begin to understand that it is a bad idea.

The original question was an honest one. What has derived from that question is wealth of invaluable information including a perfect example of what not to do. That is why it should stay.

[speckled trout]

Jeesh! It was just a question. It never fails to amaze me how some people take some things so personally.

[WaterKeeper]

People who love turtle soup perhaps. :eek1:

I don't think it is a personal thing. It is just a lot of concerned people here on RC.

[acroconut]

I think a thread serves a purpose if it gives someone food for thought before they act on a whim, or do something because they just don't know any better. Sea Turtles are protected by law, and rightfully so. I think that a day will come for us as hobbyists when SOME of the fish and creatures we see in our reef tanks today.....will no longer be available. That due to environmental impact, and there are groups of people out there that advocate banning reefkeeping altogether. So when we help someone learn WHY they should or shouldn't do something, we also help send a positive message that reefkeeping should continue as a legally allowed hobby.

[sinkingbeach]

I'm so glad to see this thread again I previously incorrectly stated that my son's first grade class is raising sea turtles to be released in the spring. They are not sea turtles but regional slider turtles that reside in the back bays of NJ. south to Florida. Kindly exuse my ignorance:)

[dark_stranger]

I'm sorry but this has got the be the most pointless use of forum resources ever. Mods, please lock this thread as it has well & truely reached its protentail, unlike a turtle in a tank.

[FreakRDog]

"Kept insisting".......Keep digging, I dont want to stop your hobby horse.

[ebacon]

I have to agree I don't see what additional information could be added of any real value. It sort of reminds me of the "proof oceanic salt is bad!!!!!!" thread. I'm not suggesting the thread should be removed, just that it be "cleaned up a little" and turned into a sticky or
locked against further posting.

[xian]

Even returning them to the ocean would be a problem as their migration is finely orchestrated and you'd never duplicate the timing

Tom,
That is a point I hadn't considered and you're probably right. However I was under the impression that there were conservation efforts taking place to help increase hatchling survival rates. It didn't seem too far fetched for a school to get involved with an institution conducting such a project. However seeing as this was a case of misinformation the point is moot.

Once again I'm not advocating sea turtle capture.

Brett

Thanks both for the information and backing up my point about survival instinct.

[WaterKeeper]

Well Gang, I think I agree that this thread has run its course and no longer serves a purpose. I think we all agree that sea turtles are not proper creatures for the home aquarist. Therefore thread http://reefcentral.com/forums/images/threadclosed.gif.

You can always PM me if you disagree.