testing Joe's Juice

[bertoni]

Well, it seems to kill Aiptasia.:)

I noticed that my pH meter reading skyrocketed (over 12) when I added some to a cup of water. I was also considering doing an alkalinity test. Seems likely this product is a strong base, but I wanted to see what you had to say about the possibility of fooling a pH meter and perhaps an alkalinity test. I'm not trying to characterize the juice much; just wanted to give a warning about possible pH and alkalinity effects.

[jfinch]

My back of the envelope analysis suggests that it's mostly, if not all, kalkwasser. Very high pH and sky high on a calcium test. Also the solids settle to the bottom just like a strong kalk paste would.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That could be it.

You've seen a calcium test result, Jon?

[jfinch]

You've seen a calcium test result

Not quantitative. I added a drop of Joe's Juice to about 5 ml of RO water. Added a couple drops of KOH, Hach calcium indicator and it took LOTS of EDTA to reach the endpoint (I almost filled the cup I was using :D). Also, the pH of the solution is very high. The stuff looks exactly like kalk paste and it has no smell.

From my experience it works about as good as a kalk slurry. It'll more or less kill the aptasia, but a week or two later there are two or three very small remnant anemones sprouting from the ashes :(

[bertoni]

I noticed that the product didn't cause retraction, as kalk solution (not slurry) does. Also, it's formed into fairly uniform balls. I'm just wondering whether it's kalk with something added to convince the anemone not to retract. I can put some under a dissection scope tonight to take a look at the details. No digital camera, though.

[cknowlto]

You know, that's funny. I have never had that experience. (though I have heard it a lot) In both my tanks, it has killed them absolutely. To the point that I went through a lot of new introductions of new stuff (livestock, rock) before I ever saw one again. I DID have a peppermint shrimp in the soft tank, but in the 150... Nada. Dead, no regrowth, no natural controls (That I know of)

I gotta wonder if it is a species thing.

For those who have had the re-emergence thing... Where is the majority of your live-rock from?

Mine is almost all tank cultured (or cured) live rock with a smattering of Tonga branch. I have one or two peices of Fiji as well in both tanks, so I am not a good example.

[jfinch]

IME, the aptasia in my tank react the same to both joe's juice and kalk paste. All my rock is pacific, tongan (kaelini) and fiji.

[JHemdal]

The company that makes Joe's Juice did not have an MSDS available, (!) so I tried to "reverse engineer" some. From what I can tell (through very limited comparative testing) it is simply a slurry of calcium hydroxide, water and something that has an odor that reminds me of Elmer's glue. In fact - I wouldn't be suprised if that is what it is. They may be using that, or something similar to get the slurry to adhere better. I published an article in FAMA back in 1992 about using a calcium hydroxide slurry to control Aiptasia, but I proposed the injection method because the slurry kept slipping off the top of the anemones. To think - if I had a keener business sense it could have been called "Jay's Juice"....

Jay Hemdal

[simonh]

The bottle says "patent pending". Although, I couldn't find anything of the US patent search.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The bottle says "patent pending". Although, I couldn't find anything of the US patent search.

Patents can 'pend' for quite a while before being published. :)

[bertoni]

So the Aiptasia will ingest kalk slurry chunks? Thats interesting. I'll experiment some.

[Hobster]

I took them up on their "free shipping" and got a small bottle to try. To my untrained eye, it works, looks and acts just like my mix of 2 tsp lime with 2 tsp vinegar. With either mixture the little buggers retract so I just smothered them. Both mixtures killed them. With the Joe's you do get a very nice little box to assemble and a product application device (syringe):D

[thrlride]

Will this stuff work for anthelia? This stuff is growning like crazy in my tank and I want to get rid of some.

[bertoni]

I sprayed some on Xenia and it stunned the coral for a bit, but didn't damage it.

[thrlride]

I might just have to take that rock out and 'cook' it. Or offer a nice 6 pound rock with anthelia and mushrooms growing on it. Or, continue to cut it back and make it more of a nutrient export.