Is This Typical?

[TCC]

Hi guys,

I'm an extreme newby and stocking my 29gal reef. I went by O Street Aquarium today and am not quite sure what kind of experience I had, so I thought I'd ask you guys.

I wanted a good "beginner" coral, so I went for a mushroom anemone. Anyway, they had a lot in the display tank that clearly said "Red Mushroom Anemone $34.99". I found a nice looking one with about 6-8 'shrooms. Anyway, the guy said that one was $50. I asked about the next nicest one, and he said that one was $50 too. There were no signs saying some were $50, some were $34.99. There were only 2 in the tank he said he would sell me for $40, but he'd do me a favor and give me either one for $35.

I know this is a dumb question, but is that how it usually works, or was a just a newby with a sign on my back?

I really wanted one, so I bought the one of two he would sell me for that price that has about 4 mushrooms on the rock.

Am I feeling bad for nothing, or is this how it works?

Thanks in advance for the input.

(I feel like a dork for asking....) :confused:

[thedude]

That isn't very cool. You can't put a price on something and then switch it later. So no, that isn't how it works. Imagine if you went to Walmart and wanted a TV that had a price tag of 100, but when you got to the checkout it was suddenly 150.

I believe the tech term would be bait and switch. If it happens again, call them on it.

[duec22]

Sounds like the guy was a formor used car salseman. I will never buy a coral agian if I get the feeling that I'm being taken. If I don't trust a price I will look at the other stores for a comparison. I do sometimes buy corals when I know I'm paying too much....like when I really wanted some blood red blasto from Capitol..

[thereefgeek]

You should have called him on it right then!! Point to the sign w/the price and say "what's up?". If he argues, walk out (or ask to talk to Peggy the owner). If you're a MARS member, show them your i.d. card. It'll get you 10% off your purchases!

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=290290&highlight=Nemo

Read this thread about a store that has different prices for different people.

[TCC]

Thank you all for the feedback. I guess I got took.!:mad2: Too bad too, because I really like the look of the livestock there. I may shop again, but thanks to your feedback, I can be more confident when shopping and feel better about questioning them if they try to pull that on me again.

I'll probably go back to Aqualife or AquaWorld first next time though. They're not perfect either, but I'm learning what to look for and how to shop. Maybe I will check out that Nemo place. (I have kids though and they LOVE to go to the LFS with me.)

Thank you!

[user48953]

That sounds strange for O street.. although i think they went through a few staff changes recently.. who was the guy that you talked too? gotta watch my own back next time i'm there ;)

[TCC]

Sorry, didn't get the guys name. He was a young asian guy probably in his early twentys.

[thereefgeek]

I hope you read the WHOLE Nemo thread. I'd reconsider taking the kids to his store!

[TCC]

Yes, I read the whole thread. That's why I made the caveat..."I have kids though....". They're a little bit older though so the whole stroller thing doesn't apply to me. Anyway, if I do go in, at least I'll be prepared.

I think there are flaws with each and every store. Some have really great people, but crummy livestock. Some have the reverse and some have great people and great livestock, but are waaaay too pricey. The ones that want to rip you off, like my recent experience, are the bottom of the heap in my opinion. They guy knew I didn't have much experience. I TOLD him that so he would help me, not take advantage of me.

I just really appreciate having a great resource like Reef Central and MARS to learn from people who have been doing this awhile. If I didn't have you guys, I might have been a sucker on my next purchase too. But no more!! :thumbsup:

[wombat2]

Just to play devil's advocate, it's probably very difficult for them to keep their prices and actual available livestock updated consistently. Many stores have prices for fish that aren't even in the tank posted, and no prices for the ones that are in there! Other times I've asked for prices at several different LFSs in Sac, and the guys all sort of huddle around and decide on a price after looking me up and down.

It's pretty common practice, and the best way to defend yourself from it is know what you're buying, know how much you can get it for (shop around), and don't act like you NEED it. Chances are you can find whatever it is somewhere else, so if you feel you're getting taken just walk out. It cracked me up how RBTAs (a previously very expensive anemone that used to sell for $150-200) were still being sold at premium prices months after the prices had gone down drastically at wholesalers (like down to $10-15) and other retailers (like down to $30). Some retailers responded instantly, some kept their prices high and counted on selling them to folks who didn't know any better. That's business.

Just me 2 cents...

[thereefgeek]

Well said Matt! The good thing about being a member is the frag swaps we have from time to time. You can walk out with a ton of frags for free or real cheap, and most members work personal deals and trades as well, just ask one of us!

[thedude]

Sorry, but I disagree on the updating of prices. I own several computer stores, and I can guarantee that my prices/inventory change just as frequently. We all know that about computers!

How hard would it be when you get a shipment in to write the prices on the tank with a grease pencil, or create a printout of the current prices?

Sorry, but that is bait and switch. Remember all the trouble the supermarkets got into when the price displayed on the shelf didn't match the price at the register?

It isn't that hard, and it's necessary for the employees to have accurate prices so they don't undercharge as well.

[wombat2]

double post...:D

[wombat2]

Apples to oranges. Do computers die on you? Do they hide in the shelves and make you not sure if they've been sold or died? Do they come in an almost infinite range of sizes, colors, and quality that can't be judged by scanning its bar code? Do the manufacturers send you random laptops sometimes without any brand or label on them and expect you to figure out how much you should sell them for?

I'm contending that keeping track of, and putting a value on livestock is an order of magnitude more difficult than any non-live inventory. We've all probably seen 'scratch and dent' corals being sold for cheaper, or clams with commensal shrimp being sold for a bit more, or Emperor angels with orange tails going for a bit more, etc. It's the nature of the hobby, in my opinion.

[BoomerD]

Nah, not buyin it...I worked for McCloud's Pet Emporium (for all you oldsters out there) for a few years. Every fish that came in got a price assigned to it. If the fish didn't sell, or die, it was presumed to still be in a tank, and the price remained posted until it's status could be verified. ON OCCASION, a price would get removed improperly, and the fish room staff had a copy of the last several price lists on hand in the fish room...Corals, inverts, fish, all had a standing price, and it didn't vary according to who you were. That's a rip-off plain & simple, UNLESS there was something special about the shroom rocks and noted in the pricing on the tank...Many newer stores have gone to putting up pictures of a fish or coral with a marked price. ALA Petco...Works fairly well, and helps to reduce the "What's this?" kind of questions...Anytime some LFS employee tries to charge more than is marked, go find someone else, or a manager and see if they give you the same price...Don't take getting ripped of just because you're a newbie...

[late2wake]

Depends on who you talk to, not everyone knows the prices of corals. Instead of admitting to not knowing, its possible they start off higher to save their own hide if it ends up being too low. Perhaps the employee you speak of is new to the establishment and hobby as well. Unfortunately, you will have to protect yourself from such accidental ignorance, and fight for the price. To have the employee drop the price that far down as a "inconvenience discount" is suspicious, as it seems obvious that he was unaware of the price tag himself. Dont be coy, yet maintain respect, with salespersonnel. It's only a question and matter of price. It's entirely up to them on how s/he wants to answer it and up to you on how you'll react to that.
-Derek

edit: To answer the actual question; no it is not common for a switch and bait to be practiced. Instead, you'll often have to ask for the price, and bargain from there. But in this case, the tag was clearly posted, and should have been honored for any particuar rock you found as it did not indicate small, med., or large. Oh well... :(

[jdy22]

really depend on who is selling the item, if they know you are going to buy they're charge as much as possible and hope that you buy, but when they saw that you might not buy they lower the price to make it seem like it cheaper so you will buy it. Trust me mushroom are mushroom are mushroom...unless it a different kind of mushroom if they're all the same...they're all the same price..that just my 2 cents

[thedude]

Wombat,
My point was that it is the responsibility of the store to keep accurate price lists. It doesn't matter that things change, disappear or whatever. It is part of the job and business. It is simply unacceptable and illegal to post one price yet charge another. B&P code 17500-17509

And do I have inventory disappear? We sure do, it's called shoplifting. My inventory changes in price, type, manufacturer all the time.

[wombat2]

...and my point is that I feel it's more difficult to keep accurate price lists for coral and fish whose availability is constantly changing, and to put a set value on them in the first place. How do you quantify the difference between mushroom rocks with 4 or 8 polyps? Hell, my corner liquor store can't even post the prices of beer on a consistent basis, and their selection never even changes. ;) But if you'd like clearly posted prices that can't ever be bargained down, you can always throw away your money at Capitol Aquarium :D

FWIW, and for future reference, I would never pay that much for a mushroom rock. A lot of SPS keepers can't get rid of them fast enough, and will probably give them to you for free if you ask nicely :D

[thereefgeek]

Aqualife posts "$29.95 all softies in this tank", or "frags $19.95". If you know the price of what you're looking at, you can decide for yourself if it's worth it BEFORE talking to an employee.

[Undergrad]

My point was that it is the responsibility of the store to keep accurate price lists.

Yes, they should keep an updated accurate price list of all their livestock and drygoods on hand. But I'm going to have to agree with Matt I'm contending that keeping track of, and putting a value on livestock is an order of magnitude more difficult than any non-live inventory. We've all probably seen 'scratch and dent' corals being sold for cheaper, or clams with commensal shrimp being sold for a bit more, or Emperor angels with orange tails going for a bit more, etc. It's the nature of the hobby, in my opinion..
All of these fish stores are way understaffed in terms of all the things they "should" be doing. Honestly, do you have to feed your computer equipment, check the water parameters, or acclimate your newly arrived computers? I'm sure most of these store's have the intention of keeping updated prices (seems like it would save them tons of time by not having to answer those questions all day long), but I'm sure its probably at the bottom of to do list.
I think your argument would be more founded if the dry goods section of these stores was run the way their livestock section is handled, but most places I've been to have these areas pretty well under control (there are exceptions, though). And of course, as always, this is JMO.

Arlan

[thedude]

But they do have set values for the items in their tank. They get a bill from their distributor that gives the prices for each type of thing sent to them. You then base your retail price on that wholesale price.

Changes in the availability of inventory is part of any sales oriented business. Part of the business' obligation to the customer is to keep up with that inventory. It's not hard to walk by a tank and write down/check off what you see. It might take 15 minutes once or twice a day.

I get new shipments of stuff in practically every day, and items are sold, stolen, etc.. O St may get one or two a week, but I manage to keep prices on things. Sorry, putting prices on things or maintaining an inventory/price list isn't that difficult.

I don't even walk through the doors at capitol. And I wouldn't pay $50 for a mushroom rock either, that was either a mistake or they were trying to rip TCC off.

[thedude]

Arlan,
Nope I don't feed or acclimate my computer equipment, but I do have to assemble many things (new computers), install windows, get drivers for hardware, learn about new equipment, new software (compatible with this, not with this, has these requirements). I have to do all of this nearly every day.

Sure live inventory has its challenges, but it isn't anymore difficult than any other inventory based store. I've worked in an LFS and we got wholesale price lists with new inventory, it was the job of the person stocking the new stuff to write the retail prices on the tanks while they looked at the wholesale price list.

It really doesn't matter if it is or isn't more difficult to put a price on certain types of inventory, it is their legal obligation to maintain consistent pricing. Check out the business and professions code I posted above, you'll see that it is a misdemeanor with a $2500 fine attached to it.

[wombat2]

Agreed on most of your points, except this one...

"But they do have set values for the items in their tank. They get a bill from their distributor that gives the prices for each type of thing sent to them. You then base your retail price on that wholesale price."

Not quite that simple, see my example of RBTAs above.

[Undergrad]

Nope I don't feed or acclimate my computer equipment, but I do have to assemble many things (new computers), install windows, get drivers for hardware, learn about new equipment, new software (compatible with this, not with this, has these requirements). I have to do all of this nearly every day.

Got a good point there. Computers seem to need as much TLC as fish sometimes. I guess it all boils down to how dedicated you are to every detail in your store. Some people settle for what works while others won't settle for anything less than perfection.

Arlan

[wombat2]

Hey Chris, do you fix Macs? :D

[jdy22]

Like what I was saying a MUSHROOM IS A MUSHROOM IS A MUSHROOM........if they're all mushroom the price is the same regardless........UNLEss they're different mushroom...the wholesaler only sell it different if ONE it a different mushroom or TWO there is a size difference.

[thedude]

Funny you should ask that, we may be moving into the mac domain.

We had considered it years ago, but mac made it very difficult to get replacement hardware, etc. And, troubleshooting the OS sucked.

Now that they have OSX which is a unix based OS (I like unix!) I am more inclined to go to the trouble of learning yet another OS (Windows, Windows Server editions, Linux - redhat, mandrake).

Yes, I am a true propeller head!

As for the RBTA's, I don't have a problem with a store charging whatever they want for a product, as long as it is posted. If the price is a total ripoff and the customer buys it, then that is their fault for not shopping around. But at least they knew what the price was.

In this case the posted price was lower than what was later quoted. I have a problem with that. Imagine if you were looking for some nice Blastomossa, and had shopped around to several different stores and found this to be the best price on Blasto's, only to find that the price you relied on wasn't really the price. Unhappy customer.

[wombat2]

Hmm, so what you're saying is the only difference between mushroom rocks is species, size, and color? I don't know if anyone is arguing against that...

[jdy22]

exactlly that is why i'm putting out the statement that they're were trying to rip him off

[wombat2]

I would be really careful saying such things on a public bulletin board where anyone is reading, especially if accusing a store of impropriety or even breaking the law. Saying "LFSs suck" is one thing, libel is another. If you'd like an example, research the domain name petswarehouse.com...

Also, none of us were there, and none of us know the full story. There could have been honest confusion by the employee, or the buyer (sorry, forgot your name!) could have simply not seen a price tag that was there.

[TCC]

I know what your saying about the whole PetsWarehouse thing. I followed that for a long time.

Anyway, just for clarification. I wasn't confuse about the signs and neither was he. If there was a $50 sign somewhere, he would have pointed it out.

My question was really about whether this was a common occurance when it came to purchasing corals and such. If it was "known" to most people that the nicer corals would be more than a posted price, I can accept that. (IF it is a common practice).

I see that it is not.

[wombat2]

...done with being the devil's advocate...

TCC,
It isn't, fortunately. I think Rich has provided some great advice about how to handle these kinds of things in the future.

Thanks for sharing your story with us!

Matt

[duec22]

I would have to agree with thedude. If there was a price posted on the tank and they decide to change the price when asked abou the coral, I would consider that false advertising. There are some shops in this town have the absolute worst ways of selling corals. They set up their sales tanks like show tanks all full of rock and what not. Then there are the stores with more intelligent people working there that set it up with eggcrate. The corals are in rows and columns with prices written on the glass in grease pens over the actual coral. I prefer buying like this. No question about the price or what they think the name of the coral is.

[jdy22]

I don't think it about intelligent, I think they just don't sell that much so it sits there longer. That how they can actually sell it there and price it and be so precise