Why slow growth rate?

[WmTasker]

A friend of mine and I have the same 75 gallon setup for aquariums. We add the same additives, I make RO for him, we use the same salt, same fitler, both have a fuge, we both feed the same food, and we both have good water movement controlled by wavemakers.

The only difference is: he set his up with TB live rock (I have fiji), he has MMud in his fuge(I have sand), he spent the $$$ for a neptune system, and for lights I have 440w of VHO and he has one 175w MH 10k and 4 65w PC's. I do water changes on mine every 2 weeks and he does one every 2 months.

We went to a frag trade and got 4 corals that were the same size and type. In two months, his corals are 3-5 times larger than mine. On the tree corals we got, his has great plolyp extension and mine has just a few. I can't figure out why his grow so fast. He thinks that it is the organic waste in his aquaiurm that helps the corals to grow, since he is not as frequent as me on water changes. Any Ideas?

[sorenb]

Do you have the same water parameters?
Maybe the answer lie there. Could be very interesting to know!

Oh, and - do you feed the same _amount_ of food?
Light-schedule, are the lights on for the same amount of time?

sorenb

[StinkyNappy]

so i take it his stuff is growing faster.....??

[jaden1]

There is a difference in his lighting to yours which I would say is a part (but only a part) of the equation. You should both test your water with the same test kits and compare. I would like to see the params that you both have. The differences in the fuge could certainly provide some clues. I have not used mud but have heard good things of them. Please keep this thread going...

[WmTasker]

Here are my readings:
Ammonia=0
nitrite=0
nitrate=0
phosphate= < than .25
pH = 8.4
cal= 450
alk= 1.5
temp= 78 F
salinity 1.022

Here are his readings:
Ammonia=0
nitrite=0
nitrate=0
phosphate= < than .25
pH = 8.0
cal= 500
alk= 1.0
temp= 80 F
salinity 1.021

[EricHugo]

Well, first of all I can't believe the corals are growign at all in alkalinities of 1.0 and 1.5 and with sg that low.

Second, you say the tanks are the same, but they are not at all the same. You have many different variables just with what you listed, and I assume the stocking of the tanks is entirely different, too. What about placement in the tank? I can have places in my tank that receive anywhere from near sunlight to near darkness, from extremely high flow to extremely low flow.

The answer is there are too many variables, but I doubt organics would be one of them.

[WmTasker]

Alkalinity .... I have been using Randy's DIY 2 part calcium addatives. I've been trying for the last 2 weeks to bring it up, but no matter how much of the part2 (baking soda) i put in; it stays around 1.5.

Salinity .... I was kind of surprised when I checked it today. I hadn't checked it in a while. I already started to add salt to my topoff water today. I'll get it up in the next few weeks.

Placement ..... we have tried moving the corals around. No matter where he puts them at, they expand out and look great. We've put them high and low, in low current and higher current. Over all, I think I have more flow in mine. I have a larger powheads than him.

Stocking ... I have alot more variety of corals and about 1.5 to every 1 lb of live rock over him. He has fewer corals, but they are huge compared to mine. I would think pound for pound we are about even. We keep pretty much the same type of corals.

Do you think that the nutrients that are provided by the miracle mud is helping the growth in his aquarium.

This is about 6 months growth for me.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/32115Reef_Pic_SM_.jpg

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/32115ReefPhotoWeb.jpg

Its not that things don't grow for me, the corals just have better extension and polyps in his.

[jaden1]

Those look like the same tank with some minor changes to it in subsequent pics?!?

[WmTasker]

It is the same aquarium. Its the growth rate of my aquarium after about 6 months. Im waiting for my friend to email me pics of his.

[EricHugo]

I look forward to seeing the other photos. I'll comment more later.

[WmTasker]

Here is a pic of his aquarium 6 months ago, and a pic of the tree coral. My tree coral is 1/3rd this size and has about 5 polyps on each branch. And the polyps just look like litte bumps on it.



http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/32115JamesPicsm.jpg

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/32115DSC02372.jpg

[WmTasker]

This is a pic of my largest tree coral. You can see that the polyps are not out. And they are never out. But the coral is growing. I did discover that he runs his lights about 3 hours more that I do. Could this have something to do about it? He is 13 hours and I am 10 hours.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/32115GrnSin.jpg

[EricHugo]

I can't say that one tank looks really any "better" than the other, although from what I see, yours might look a little healthier as a whole. As to growth rates, growth is a factor of energy surplus, and this can come in many forms and may depend on the species - how much do they get from light? From feeding? Water flow is a big factor. The conditions within a tank can vary greatly. And, as I mentioned, your tanks are really not very similar.

[WmTasker]

I was reading the thread on your coral food. Do you think this is a food that would benifit my aquarium with as many softies as I have? I've been thinking about making it for a while now, but just didin't know if it would be good in my type of reef.

Thanks

[WmTasker]

Well just to update this .... I have had my new reef up and running for about 3 weeks and I have noticed no or little difference in the corals and the polyps extention. Everything was still testing like earlier stated. The only thing different is that I know have my salinity up to 1.026 and Alk is 4.0. My caulerpa in my fuge usually doubles in size in 1-2 weeks. I mean it completely fills the 15 gallons of space it has to grow.

After talking with a few friends, posting on RC and trying to figure out what was going on, I decided to buy a new test kit. Everything tested the same except for nitrates. And the new test kit tested nitrates at 40ppm. :eek: So I had my friend bring his test kit over and his tested it at around 40ppm. :eek: Over the past week I have done three 25 gallon water changes on my 120 reef, this brought the nitrates down to some where around 20ppm. Even with 20ppm of nitrates in the reef the corals are starting to look great. I can't wait to get down to 0-5ppm. Hopefully if I get it down to 5 the fuge can help with the rest.

Question time. I used baking soda to raise the Alk over a few days, does baking soda have any nitrates in it? When I moved the reef from the 75 to 120, I scraped all the coraline off the side of the 75 tank. I then put it in a tupperware container with water for about 5 days. When I went to put it in the 120, it had a smell to it, so I dumped out the water and rinsed it with new salt water. Could this had helped my nitrates when I put it in the 120?

Here's what I think happen to the nitrates. Since my test kit has been showing low nitrates, I have only been doing about 15 gallon changes on the 75 about every 2 months. I had a junky skimmer on the 75 that would only pull out about a cup of stuff every month. My fuge was doing great, better than it has ever done (now I know why). So about 10% can be tributed to the bad test kit. The other 90% is just plain lazy, bad reef keeping on my part. Which will not happen again.

My last thought. I brought about 60 gallons of the 75 to setup the 120. So after adding 60 or so gallons of new water to the reef, the nitrates were still at 40ppm. I wonder how high the nitrates where in the orginal 75 :eek: :eek: :eek:

Hope this helps someone to learn from my stupidity: Always replace test kits every so often. And even though things test ok, it not an excuse to be lazy and not do the normal reef maintanence.