My levels need your help

[Schism]

I have a 60 reef that has been set up for 8+ months. I recently a month ago tested KH for the first time. It was at well 0. At that time my Ph was 8.1 and CA was at 350. I started then using a buffer to raise the KH to an acceptable level. Ive been doing this for about 3 weeks or so. I hadn't tested the KH again till today when I got a test kit of my own. It is still unreadable, or at least below .11. Now however my ph is about 8.5 or higher and ca is at 150. I am dosing Kalk as a nearly full time drip, calcium when I'm not using kalk and also still using the buffer. All other levels are in good shape. I also in the last three days lost all of the shrimp that were in my tank. 8 total, 6 peppermints, first, then two skunk cleaners. I don't know if the levels and this are related. All my fish, snails, hermits and corals are just fine. Of course not polyping out all the way because of these screwy levels, but eating, even some growth I've noticed in the last few weeks.
I'm planning on doing a series of water changes, but I need to know what to do so I can get these levels under control.
Thanks!

[Schism]

Anyone?

[Mako]

Wow! I would suspect there is something wrong with your test kit. Which one are you using? You are talking dKH here right? (degree of carbonate hardness) I can't see how your PH would be at 8.1 with a 0 dkh level. With a 0 dkh you would have some pretty hectic PH swings.

Here (http://www.ozreef.org/reference/alkalinity.html) is an excellent article about alkalinity. Digest this article and get a new test kit. In the meantime I would do a couple of 25% water changes in the next week to restore some stability to your buffering system. IMO

HTH

[NorthCoast]

I agree with Mako and would like to add the point:

If the test kit is suspect, then stop the addition of buffers, etc... Just do water changes until you know the measurements are accurate. The take the corrective actions needed.

Later,
NorthCoast

[gas4544]

I agree - its time for some new, reliable test kits. I use and like the Salifert test kits. They are about as accurate as we need them to be, fairly easy to use, cost-effective, and readily available.

You should be testing regularly for the following parameters - alkilinity, calcium, and occasionally pH. Also keep an eye daily on temperature and specific gravity until your tank parameters stabilize. If you haven't tested for nitrate lately, check that out, too.

Start mixing some new saltwater and be ready if you have to do some big water changes.

[Schism]

Well I just ran over to the LFS and they tested my Dkh at 2.2. Maybe I'm a moron and can't use my kit, but I suspect its bad. Its a brand new Salifert kh/alk test kit. Got it from premiumaquatics yesterday. I use 4 ml water, 2 drops, then I can add the entire 1.00 ml of solution two and it never changes. I tested straight tap water and it changes at 5.6 .98 ml of solution 2. I have kept a close eye on temp and specific gravity and they seem very stable. The ph seems a pretty stable 8.5. Nitrates hover around 5-10. What should I do about the test kit? Also anyone have any guesses on the shrimp deaths? It acts almost like poisoning, but I doubt that. Unless a screw in there for a day or two starting to rust could do it? I found on in there a few days ago, but it must have just fallen in. Just out of curiousity what does rust do to a marine tank?
Thanks again

[gas4544]

If your Salifert alkilinity kit is not bad, then your kit is telling you that you have very high alkilinity. I think that using a full syringe of solution equates to a dKH of 16.0. If you do not get a color change in the first filling of the syringe, fill it up again and continue to add solution until you get the color chnage from blue to pink. Then read the value off the table and add 16.0 to get your alkilinity in dKH.

Do you trust the reading your LFS gave you? ANy idea what kit they used? If your kit is indeed bad, Premium Aquatics will likely replace it or give you a refund.

[Schism]

Well I know the kit that they used is a red sea. It said the KDH was 6.25. In the previous posts I didn't make the conversion from meq/l. Yes I know the red sea kits are terrible, but its results seemed a lot more realistic. They also would show an approximate graduation of my DKH from my dosing. They used the same type of kit a month ago that showed 0, with my buffering I figured it to be about normal now, and theres showed that to be almost true. I've used maybe 8-10 doses of the buffer and just less than the recommended amount each time. I wouldn't figure that to put my alk at 16.0+++ Also My tap water here comes out at 8.1 PH. The salifert kit said that the DKH was 15.7, It just changed before the 1ml ran out. I don't understand the alk/ph relationship to well yet, but that doesn't seem to sit right?!? Is there any way to check for sure that the kit is bad?
Thanks

[Schism]

I just did a water change about 25%. Well It has already done wonders. I left the levels of the make up water where I wanted the tank so some of the tank wasn't happy for a few minutes. Xenia shriveled to nothing and my purple tang lost a little color. But 15 minutes later everything is better than its been in days. I added some fighting conches a few days ago and they almost immediately buried not to come out till about 5 minutes ago. Now they are all 3 hobbling along eating. Xenias out, fish seem happy. The ph is now at 8.2, nitrates at 0, Alk 16 DKH if the kits good? I figure I'll do another water change in a few days and hopefully this little problem will go away.

[greenlincoln]

Originally posted by Schism
I left the levels of the make up water where I wanted the tank so some of the tank wasn't happy for a few minutes.

Did you accomplish this by adding buffer to your make-up water? This can be a risky practice. It would make it very easy to accomplish high alkalinity rate by doing this, which eventually will cause your calcium to precipitate out of solution; in other words, your Ca reading will drop drastically.

Doing the water change was the best thing you could do to start to fix the problem. It brings back ionic balance to your seawater. You should then test ALK and Ca again before adding buffer or Ca, and proceed accordingly, but GRADUALLY. A simple explanation to avoid the "see saw" effect of Ca and Alk levels is: Water only has so much "room" for alk and Ca to co-exist. When one overpowers the other, the other will drop. Overuse of Ca will deplete alk, overuse of alk will cause Ca to to deplete. Shoot for between 9 dKH and 12 dKH by doing water changes (16 dKH is too high). Once your alk is stable in this range, add Ca in controlled amounts. And keep testing and re-testing until you get things leveled out. Alk is solely to buffer your water's ability to maintain a stable pH. Once it is depleted, a pH swing can occur, especially in a high nutrient tank or at night, which can be detrimental to your fish. So unless you have a tank packed full of SPS and other Ca-consuming animals, work on getting your dKH within range before thinking about raising Ca. HTH

[gas4544]

Grenlincoln - that's a good explanation. Good advice also to get the alkilinity stable before messing too much with the calcium levels.

Schism - buy another alkilinity test kit to check against the one you suspect may be inaccurate. Testing at home is easier than relying on your LFS, especially when you are trying to get your alkilinity in line. If it turns out that your original Salifert alkilinity test kit is defective, try to get a replacement or credit from Premium Aquatics.