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aquababy
03/20/2004, 07:50 AM
Some time ago I had contacted a scientific group down in Florida about Dino's, Red Tide, and slime algae. I did receive a personal resonse and a excellent web page that explains the causes and how to deal with such problems. Here is a copy of the email they sent me:
Mr. B,

Mike Henry forwarded your message to me for my input. You have asked a
couple of good questions, one about the red tide organism and the other
about dealing with this if you have these organisms in your tank water.

As you know, "dino's" exist in all bodies of water and can be seen very
easily with a microscope; and I would not be surprised to see them in
some number in every water sample I examine. Red Tide organisms are only
known to be free swimming, and have not been associated with substrate.
Since our aquarium is located in an area that experiences red tide
(Karenea brevis) quite often, we have some experience of having this
organism in our tanks.

What we have found is that we only had significant problems in aquariums
where we have used natural, unfiltered sea water in order to produce a
"bloom" within our aquarium. If water is filtered and organisms are
present, then the cells are broken - thereby releasing the toxin. Our
scientists now predict red tide events in our area so well that we do not
operate our sea water system if the cell counts are high (pretty nice for
us now.)

If red tide does indeed exist in a tank in enough concentration to cause a
bloom, then we would take advantage of the free-swimming nature of the
critters by exposing them to a germicidal UV lamp followed by an activated
carbon filter to remove the toxin. I must also say that in the past 10
years that I have not observed a single red tide related mortality in our
aquariums here at the laboratory; but I have seen many rafts of dead fish
in the bay.

I hope this is of help to you.

Kevin Curlee
Aquarum Curator

Mote Marine Laboratory kevin@mote.org
1600 Thompson Parkway Voice: 941-388-4441
Sarasota FL 34236 Fax: 941-388-4312
We are an independent, nonprofit, marine and estuarine
research and education facility.
Opinions expressed here are not MML policy unless so indicated.

On Thu, 5 Feb 2004, Michael Henry wrote:

> Hi Kevin,
>
> Here is the email I told you about. Thanks
> -M
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> Michael S. Henry
> Staff Scientist
> Mote Marine Laboratory
> 1600 Thompson Parkway
> Sarasota, FL 34236-1096
> Phone 941.388.4441 Ext 320
> Fax 941.388.4312
> Web www.mote.org

Here is an excellent page that really discusses algae problems. Note the specific references to nutrients and protien skimming. I am saving this page in my "favorites" folder for future reference and to be able to send it to others who might need this information. Please read it as it is addressed to and written for the hobbyist and is very informative (by A. Thiel).
http://netclub.athiel.com/cyano/cyanos2.htm

Demeter
03/21/2004, 08:39 PM
aquababy,

Thanks for the article and the info. I'm glad you posted this as I'm fighting a "red-slime" breakout. I'll review the article and see how it goes.

Thanks again

aquababy
03/21/2004, 09:17 PM
Demeter,
I hope it can help - please let me know if it did and what you think about the article.
Bob

greenfroggiespawn
03/24/2004, 07:07 PM
so does that mean natural sea water is responsible for it?

some people have used nsw and some have not? but most of the people w/ beautiful clear tanks are using synthetic right?

just a thought.. that's interesting...

aquababy
03/25/2004, 08:00 AM
That is a very good point. I guess there are more people using artificial sea water in my area than natural sea water but the things they add to their tank, for the most part, come from the sea - carrying many possibilities of different organisms that may or may not flourish in a tank. Live rock is an excellent example as it is loaded with bacteria, plants and etc. I would think the conditions in the tank are responsible for supporting it. Like some human ailments - if a person is healthy and his immune system is really cranking, all sorts of ailments can be avoided. Some people hardly ever get sick while others are always running to the doctor for a cure. If the water quality in a tank is excellent - no unwanted nutrients or other poor readings or levels, then the unwanted algaes cannot take over.

Demeter
03/25/2004, 12:09 PM
Is Redox + Liquid available commercially? From the article it seems there may be a few brands in circulation. Is one brand better than the other? Not sure which to try first...

aquababy
03/25/2004, 03:06 PM
I searched around and found an email address on one site that you can use to find out where you can get redox+. I never had to use this product myself and I believe that it is KMnO4 - Potassium Permanganate. Give the address a try: mailto:at@athiel.com..

Demeter
03/25/2004, 08:41 PM
I sent an email to Albert at that address. He replied that Redox + Liquid is no longer available. Is Redox a chemical that you add to the tank to rid cyano? I'm not sure about chemicals to the tank. I'll try to scrape/syphon/remove as much of the cyano as possible, increase the skimmer, do water changes every week and see if that helps.

aquababy
03/25/2004, 09:54 PM
Demeter,
If that Redox+ is no longer available I really wonder why? Perhaps there were some negative side effects when used in a marine tank and that is only a guess on my part. Since 911 there have been severe restrictions on certain chemicals. I had to answer many questions and give a detailed description of my intended use just to get some Glucose (simple sugar) from a chemical supply house. Maybe these restrictions caused Theil to stop making it.
If Redox+ is actually KMnO4 I would be a little hesitant to use it myself only because I have an amount of the crystal left over from the fresh water days. It was used in ponds to cut down on algae - it worked as a dye causing everything to turn deep purple thereby preventing the light to penetrate. It might have had some other chemical reactions as well but I am not aware of them. I still think it was only a bandage treatment - it is work to change water in some of those gigantic ponds.
You should be able to solve your problem with the knowledge found in the rest of the article. I think what you have decided to do will really help. You have to starve the algae any safe way that you can.
If you want to try some of the KMnO4 crystal I can give you some but you should find out the exact amount needed. You might ask Albert if he would help you there. Personally I wouldn't mess with it but you are welocome to some - you only will need a small amount. I just remembered that KMnO4 is also considered a disinfecting agent but this was all years ago before people were keeping Marine Life.