Help with Fish selection

[Blinkgyrl2987]

I plan on getting for my 75 gallon RR Oceanic tank:
2 ocellaris Clowns
2 blue neon gobies
2 purple firefish
1 black cap basslet
and a yellow tang

I would eventually like to a maybe 1 to 2 more fish....but I don't know what else to look at...The Gobies and firfish will be fairly small... and I think the Bassllet and the tang will be the center of attention along with the clowns...But Think I need something else...Give me some reccomendations and show me pics..if you can...
Also what should I be looking at as far as a clean up crew...I have heard so many things...Thats the hermit crabs are bad....that some snails get big and knock things over.. and that shrimp can sometimes become food for certain fish!!!
So I need advice on a cleanup crew.... something also to keep the sand snow white would be nice....
So far I was thinking margarita snails and bumble bee snails....and 2-3 scarlet skunk shrimp....( I like these guys)
What are turbo snails? do they have a special name? or Fighting Conchs? I just need some advice I'm pretty lost

Thanks Megan

[EdKruzel]

Hi Blinky,
It sounds like it's going to be a nice setup. I would personally forget about the tang.
I'm probably the biggest Tang critic after Naesco.

The 75 will hold a Yellow Tang into maturity, however in small confines they have a tendency to become mean.

I would substitute the Yellow Tang with a Flame Angel and add two more Blue Neons and four Yellow Striped Neon Gobies.

As to the clean up crew; I'd pass on the Turbo Snails. They are large and clumsy, and cannot right themselves when they turn over on the sand.
Astrea, nerites, cerith and a host of others are much better.

The Fighting Conchs are good but the Queens are better. I have an arrangement to return my Queen Conch when it begins to outgrow my tank for a smaller one as these do grow large.

Nasarrius & Peppermint snails along with varies worms and a cucumber will keep your sand bed clean and healthy.

Check out this site for further info:
http://www.rshimek.com/reef/sediment.htm

Good Luck,
Ed

[JOSHUAB]

you can get some pretty good clean-up crews though GARF, you can reach them at www.garf.org I have ordered from them and the crew i recieved was great i also got some of their grunge which has all sorts of things to help your DSB.
:D

[Blinkgyrl2987]

Edkruzel:
Hi Thanks for the reply... Now about what you said.... I would love to have a flame angel to replace my tang....actually the flame angel is one of my favorite fish....however I plan on having soft and LPS corals and I wouldn't want to take a chance with a flame angel....LOL Well actually I would want to ...but I don't think I will. I've never seen the yellow gobies....what do they look like?
Well anyways thanks for your opinion on the clean up crew...someone has told me that the mexican turbos get big...but they are the best cleaners....and the queen conch gets to be 12 inches????? Thats Huge! Well anyways Thanks for your help.. I really apreciate it!
Megan

[EdKruzel]

Megan,
The Flame Angel, C. loricula is reef safe. The key to adding one to a tank is to add it after you have placed the corals in the tank.

The LPS and any clams are at highest risk when adding them to a tank containing any fish or invertabrate that feeds on detritus.

A stressed coral creates excess mucus. This is often the case when new and acclimating. This mucus is a type of detritus.

If you set up your system and provide healthy nutritous foods you have a great chance of adding a Flame Angel with no problems.

Now the Mexican Turbos do eat large amounts of algae, however do not do well in tanks around 80 degrees which is ideal for our reef guests (corals).
The Queen's are often available at only one inch in length. Ask your LFS if they're willing to trade large ones for new smaller ones about once a year or so as the Queens are not super fast growers.

The Red Foot snails are probably the best algae eaters, but cost twice as much as Astrea or Turbos.

Take Care,
Ed

[EdKruzel]

Sorry forgot about the gobie.
Just like the blue neon's except instead of blue lines they are yellow.

http://www.graphic.com.br/reef/randalli.JPG

[Blinkgyrl2987]

Okay great this is perfect! you have made my day!... I definitely like the yellow gobies so I will look into those...as far as the flame angel goes...you say I can add him as long as I have already added my corals? even then the LPS are at some risk???? and the soft corals are not? (please correct me if I'm wrong) I would absolutely love to somehow be able to have a flame angel in my reef..(this has always been my fav fish)

Some one else told me against doing this so thats when I started thinking about the tang... Have you had experience with a flame in a reef? B/c I hear so many people talk about the flames destroying their reef.....(prolly just people passing on what they heard from someone else) am I right? Well anyways...would love to hear anything else you have to add!....I will probably go with the turbos....maybe 5 is this too many in your opinion? I know that these guys are excellent cleaners..and I hope that the higher temp...won't cause to much of a problem...
Thanks Again..
Megan

[Blinkgyrl2987]

Oh yeah I forgot to add this...so the angels are more prone to eat the corals...if they are newly added...and "stressed"...(because the angels will pick at the detetris..the corals produce?...Is that how it works...)...and maybe thats why the corals that have been in the tank and doing well... aren't picked on by the flame?...I think thats what you explained but I wasn't sure..... Thanks Again Megan

[ericgreathouse]

Just a warning - both Neon Gobies I've put in my 60g have ended up swimming around in my sump.

[EdKruzel]

Megan,
That is it exactly. Most people that claim they have a problem Flame are actually the problem themselves.

I have Flameback, C. acanthops, which has just as bad of a reputation for nipping.

It is in my 37cube reef with a Purple Firefish & False Percula.
My tank is packed full of Clams, Softies, SPS, & LPS.

This fish is a model citizen. I do keep the tank well fed, and all corals were added before this fish.

The tank has no skimmer, receives no water changes, and is fed the equivilent of two frozen cubes a day of my homemade mixture, (similar to Eric's mix).
My corals are healthy and growing and I have no hair algae or nitrates to report.

http://www.elpmas.com/images/MVC-016S.JPG

[wrasse777]

i keep several types of pygmy's incl. a golden(another pygmy notorious for coral munching) in reefs and they have been saints with the exeption of a brain coral(added after the golden pygmy).edkruzel, i had never heard that info. about pygmy's, and after thinking about it i completely agree with you. thanks, i learned something again today. just for the record, i evicted a yellow tang for chewing on an elegance coral.

[cmiannay]

On the subject of Flame Angels... (and forgive my "noobiness") aren't they really pretty when young, but grow up to be very drab looking? From the pics I've seen, that seems to be the trend for almost all Angels. If that's true, how long do they stay pretty?

[zachfishman]

Flames stay stunningly orange their whole life, and the largest I've seen is about 5.5". The larger angels change color patterns; dwarves (flame, pygmy, coral beauty...) don't. As for eating coral, I haven't had any probs w/mine. Then again, I don't keep the largest variety of coral. They aren't clam safe though, prone to nip the mantels (probably a 50/50 shot) however, if you don't mind limiting your reef a bit, you could buy the angel, get it situated, then add corals/clams and return those that you think will get nipped. (make sure to work this out with your LFS) Watch for a day, a flame angel won't exactly demolish a coral in that short period.