Need the opinions of ALL! My students need some help!

[thebillabong37]

Hello all!

I am a High School Special Education teacher in Grand Rapids, MI. I had my kids set-up my reef tank in our classroom as an extension of a unit on the Great Barrier Reef. The lids really need hands-on/alternative projects to keep them going. They do all of the upkeep on the reef and are very proud of their work (many of the "regular-ed" kids stop in daily and it is good to have that interaction).

We are now to the point of stocking the tank. It has fully cycled and all parameters test-out great. We currently have 3 damsels (2 blue-eye, 1 domino) and 6 turbo snails.

I have tried stocking my tank, but seldom do LFS here provide quality information ("Here, this is cool... Put it in your tank" mentality).

What I need is for everyone that is interested to give my students ideas and info (care, current/lighting likes and dislikes) on what to stock (corals, inverts, other fish). Please keep in mind that ease of care needs to be beginner to intermediate.

My students will be posting pics over the course of the next few months (summer school) and into next year. Please check back to my photo gallery for updates!

Myself, and more importantly my kids, reall appreciate the opinions of all!

Bill

[mocerich]

What size tank?
What kind of lighting and how much?
What equipment do you have?

I would start with some soft corals and mushrooms at any rate - they are easy and require less light and don't really need feedings to grow.

What I like to do is search the online sellers of corals and look at the pictures to see what I like and if they can survive in my type of set up. Then take a trip to the LFS and see what they have, what I like, and how expensive. Have your kids do the same for fish and corals - do you have classroom internet access? Plus if you work with a nice LFS, they can try and get in whatever the kids are interested in that they may not have.

Is the school funding the project?

[helenjc]

Sounds like a great project.

First a few questions.

How long has the tank been cycling? How about a list of the parameters?

What size is the tank? This will be a determining factor on which fish can be introduced into the tank as well as how many.

You mentioned that this will be a full blown reef and not a fish only. Some fish eat coral, so this will also limit which fish you will be keeping. Having a reef as opposed to a fish only tank will be a lot more complicated, but infinately more interesting, IMO. What type of lights have you go on the tank? What type of corals are you looking into purchasing?

Did you cycle the tank using the damsels or did you add them after? Damsels are known to be quite aggressive, and you may need to take them out. Some people have had bad experiences with the aggression, such as myself, but a few have reported that their damsels have not been any problem at all. I guess you can add fish and decide for yourself.

Now for my suggestions on fish, a clown pair. They are relatively hardy and easy to care for, and if you go with an ocellaris pair, since they are pretty small fish, you won't need a huge tank. Also once the tank matures, and everyone gains more experience, and assuming you have ample lighting, you can go for an anemone and see the clownfish/anemone symbiotic relationship. I also am partial to firefish. I think they are beautiful, and they also don't need a huge tank.

I'm sure other's will come along with more suggestions, once you give a little more info. You can check out some online vendors, to see pictures and general care requirements for fish as well as coral. If you aren't familiar with any, you can check out the RC sponsor at this site to start. Of course I wouldn't just go on the word of any vendor of LFS, since some are more honest than others, but it'll still give you a place to start.

Oh, I just checked out the pictures. Looks like your off to a great start!!

[thebillabong37]

Ok... Here are some details...

55gal with 120lbs live rock and a 4" live sand bed.
2 48" vho tubes (one 50/50, one actinic)
red sea skimmer
110gph return

It is not school funded (would be great!)... In MI there are funding cuts across the boards to every school.

Check my photo gallery for visuals!

[Entropy]

First off I think it is very cool that you have brought a tank into your class room for your students. There is NOTHING in the world that will hook kids faster than hands on.

Anyway as far as stocking the tank, for fish I would go with 1 or 2 False Clowns. These are pretty bulletproof IMO..

Clown (http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?siteid=21&pCatId=137)

and maybe a Royal Gramma Basslet

Royal Gramma Basslet (http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?siteid=21&pCatId=53)

That is just personal preference though....

For inverts I would get a bunch of hermits like these...

Scarlet Reef Hermit Crab (http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?siteid=23&pCatId=620)

For corals, that is up to you since there is so many flavors and colors, but I would stick to soft corals and maybe mushrooms.

[thebillabong37]

My tank will eventually be a full-blown reef (once I bring it home ion a year or two).

I cycled it with live rock and live sand for 4 months.
Salinty: 1.025
Temp: 79-81 F
PH: 8.4
Nitrates: 0ppm
Nitrites: 0ppm

Dose kalkwasser with stront/iodine added in.
Add buffer to keep things in check.

[ginntonic74]

I would get rid of the damsels to start with. Some people do fine with them but in your case with the kids it would not be good to chance it with them. It would not be good to come into class one morning to find a dead fish in their tank. I think it would be to traumatic for them.

[Christian Schwalm]

First of all, GET RID OF THE DAMSELS!!!! I'm still trying to catch the damsels in my 75 to get rid of them. They bully, and can kill, anything smaller than them. A real nuissance (sp?).

Also, when I go to a fish shop and see a fish I'm interested in, I always ask them to feed that fish so I can see 1.) if that species of fish even takes flake food, and 2.) whether or not that individual is eating. DO NOT buy a fish that isn't eating!!!!

I personally don't have the time to deal with a fish that has high maintenance feeding requirements. In a class room, this may also be critical.

Christian Schwalm
SkyLab
www.wetdryfilter.com

[helenjc]

Although you might already know this, remember not to add the fish all at once. You'll want to give your biological filter time to catch up with the new load.

[slipknottin]

Just a quick warning- make sure you have a very tight hood, and if possible, find a lock for it.

There are too many kids who think it would be funny to pour windex or something like that into a fish tank. Ive seen it happen.

[thebillabong37]

As far as LFS(s) go... We have one in town. The better of the 2 went under (no pun intended) a year ago. I think the Internet may be a good source for livestock... Also considering coral frags as a way to go (more science for the students!). Any good on-line stores or frag traders?
Bill

[mocerich]

Your profile says you have 5 years reef experience, and by the nice setup you have there (from pics), you obviously know what you're doing. Is there some sort of specific information you are looking for, or were you just hoping for some general stocking tips we think your kids would find most fasinating?

[helenjc]

Sorry for the beginner type advice...I should've taken a closer look at your profile.

[Christian Schwalm]

Am I not supposed to be putting Windex inside my tanks?!!

Have a great day all!

Christian Schwalm
SkyLab
www.wetdryfilter.com

[thebillabong37]

I have been in the hobby for awhile, but never have gotten real reliable information from my LFS. Never have had anything running long term (reef-wise)... Just many attempt strung together. I accept ALL info and ideas, it helps my students a TON.

Perhaps as far as livestock goes, how about ideas organized into a "trading card" format...

Like this:

Fish/Invert/Coral Name (common or scientific):
Ease of care:
Lighting needs:
Current needs:
Feed or not to feed...
Your experience...
Any good suppliers/traders...
PICTURES if possible...

[Emerald]

Hi. Have you looked to see if there is a Marine Aquarium Society near you? There are 2 in MI, Im not sure if they are any where near you but its certainly worth a shot. One of them is in Portage, and the other is in Whitmore Lake. You can go to MASNA.org to get addresses and websites for both. You may find members there that are happy to share frags and shrooms, maybe even have the one of club members come and speak in your class.

As for livestock definately the false percs, they are very fun to watch. Maybe a flame angel, some snails, crabs and even a couple shrimp would make nice a classroom setup.

[thebillabong37]

Thanks, I will surely check into the society. I live about an hour north of the one in portage. Maybe there is one closer...

Thanks too for the ideas! Noted!

[BiG_KiD]

I would like to applaud you on your effort. I think any fish tank in the classroom would be very educational.. espically a reef tank.. Hmm.. You get to spend more time looking at it to.. I applaude You

You Should Look at a Coral Beauty.. I have had one for about a year in my tank. Very healthy and hardy fish.. Very colorful and a good eater..

For a Pic Click Here (http://community.webshots.com/photo/18258648/19614689ueyLfbZScj)

I also love clowns and espically when they host in an anemone
check out the pic below.. That's a Gold Stripe Clown with a Bubble tip Anenome. Fairly popular

Also I also say get the damsels out of there.. I had 4 In my tank and I ripped it all apart to get them out..Very hard to catch even without rock in.. Good Luck

[MaaloX]

Thats sweet, Back in College i used to work with Children with Autism, I read a study that fish tanks were used in relaxation methods with autistic children.
Plus its cool to see the other students get involved with your class and to help intergtate them with the rest of the students.

It takes special people like you to do what you do. Keep up the good work.

I was going into that field, but I just got burned out of it within 3 years. One of the more stressful jobs I have ever had.

[MaaloX]

Thats sweet, Back in College i used to work with Children with Autism, I read a study that fish tanks were used in relaxation methods with autistic children.
Plus its cool to see the other students get involved with your class and to help intergtate them with the rest of the students.

It takes special people like you to do what you do. Keep up the good work.

I was going into that field, but I just got burned out of it within 3 years. One of the more stressful jobs I have ever had.

[thebillabong37]

Thanks alot for all of the kind words! I have shared many of the posts with my students and they are really getting into this online discussion. Its really good for them to interact (even if its on the net) with others. Sometimes talking "behind" a screen allows for them to open-up a little bit more than usual!

Everyone has had great suggestions as far as stocking goes...
Any more livestock ideas?
I think we have enough to go on for fish...
Corals?

[kennny]

I would go with leather corals at first. maybe some Xenia up near the lights. When you get your algae bloom you can get some snails and crabs maybe a conch.

[musashi666]

I just finished Student teaching & I'm looking for a teaching position in Grand Rapids. I live on the SE side of the city. I could probably give you a frag of my green leather coral. Where do you teach thebillabong?

What LFS do you use to get your information & buy sw stuff?

For corals -
- Xenia is hardy, it just wont die.
- Mushrooms
- Green Star Polyps
- Zoanthids (Button Polyps)

These are all easy corals to care for that are quite hardy.

Have fun with your tank!

[uryy4me]

I applaud your effort!

I will assume that you are primarily looking for recommendations on softies and LPS based on your tank setup (although you could keep and maybe even grow some monitis I don't think you would want this to be a focal point).....as I type this out I see musashi666 has just given most of the info you are looking for in terms of softies and it may be nice to add a piece of frogspawn or another LPS (but not a goni). I don't think it was suggested before, but I think you may also find an anemone to be an interesting resident (especially if you do get a clown). As for other inverts, consider an emerald crab, a conch, and cleaner shrimp.

HTH

- scott -

[Flanders]

I bet a pair of coral banded shrimp would really be interesting for the kids to watch. That was the one invert that always caught my eye as a kid. Or how about a shrimp/goby pair? You can teach the kids how symbiotic relationships develop on the reef.

I'm sure you know which corals are suitable for this tank with your experience, but it will be the mobile inverts that really interest the kids, I bet.

Sounds like a fun project. Good luck!

[Bryan Thompson]

That is a great project and Blowfish Aquatics.com (http://www.blowfishaquatics.com) would like to support it. How would you like some nice ricordia and blue mushrooms to get you up and running?

Here are a few photos of ricordia.

http://www.blowfishaquatics.com/photos%20images/MVC-270F.jpg

http://www.blowfishaquatics.com/007.jpg


http://www.blowfishaquatics.com/005.jpg

Send me and email and we will work out the details.

Bryan@blowfishaquatics.com

Bryan

[Reefraff]

Great project, my mom was a special ed teacher and I know where your coming from.

Corals: Mushrooms, colts, leather (particularily toadstools), xenia, and closer to the lights you could probably go with bubble, frogspawn and hammer. Not suggesting you get all of these, but I have had success with these under a similar setup.

I would hope that some people here on RC would send you some frags--especially if they live close. I know that some shroom people out there can donate--they will live through anything. I am about to try and frag my colt for the first time. Once I get a frag to attach, I would be glad to send it to you. Email me with name and address and ph#. It may be awhile before I send it unless you want to try and attach it yourself. Just let me know.

Come on people, step up to the plate.

Jeff

[Kara]

As far as reef inhabitants go, I'm really big on personality and interaction. I would suggest:

FISH
• Cherub Angel (Centropyge argi) - a pretty little angel
• Caribbean Royal Gramma (Gramma loreto) - get 2 juv. they will grow to be a mated pair. Very playful fish and colorful!
• Blenny (various sp.) - comical fish! quite unaffraid! I hand feed mine (Emblemaria pandionis) and the male will allow me to 'pet' his dorsal fin.
• Ocellaris Clownfish (Amphiprion ocellaris) - great color and personality!

INVERTS
• Serpent Star - not the spiny kind. Serpent/Brittle stars come in some amazing colors (bright yellow, oranges, reds, black/white striped) and can be trained to come out when you feed the tank. Mine will readily take food from my hand.
• Flower Anemone - they stay small, are really hardy and tend to stay in one place.
• Anemone Crab - filter feeder, will hang out with the Flower Anemone!
• Skunk Cleaner Shrimp
• Blood or Fire Shrimp - you should have more than 1 of these or they will hide.
• Sexy Shrimp (Thor amboinensis) - highly visable shrimp, totally reef safe, they do a cute butt wiggle dance and will hang out near the anemone and other corals.
• Tiger Tail Cuke (Halathuria hilla)- very cool creature, you should wait a few months after intro of fish and corals so that there is enough detritus in the sand for it to survive on.
• Queen or Fighting Conch
• Feather Dusters
• Spaghetti Worms

CORALS
• Pulsating Xenia - keep isolated on its own rock, good water flow, unique pulsating motion
• Mushrooms
• Zoanthids
• Open Brain or Meat Coral (Trachyphyllia sp.) - hand feedable, very interesting to watch open and eat
• Blastomussa
• Candy Cane or Trumpet Coral (Caulestrea sp.) - higher up in tank near the lights
• Gorgonians are always nice. Make sure you will be able to feed them
• Leathers
• Long Polyp Toadstool
• Colt

all of these corals are easy care, hardy corals. The blasto, brain, caul and some zoos can be hand and/or target fed. Most of these corals are mid lighting requirement corals and would do very well in your tank. Most are fast growers so the kids will be able to see marked differences as the year progresses.

If I were setting up a tank for kids, I would choose livestock that is interactive, hardy and behaviorally interesting which will give it a high 'cool' factor.

HTH!

[thebillabong37]

THANKS SO MUCH FOR ALL OF THE REPLIES!!!

My kids are loving it!
Thanks to for the stocking ideas and OFFERS TOO!!
Way more than I ever expected. I can not thank everyone enough for your responses and for keeping this thread going!

KARA- awesome tank! just went to your website! looks great!
REEFRAFF- will forward you my info... thanks for the support
and encouragement! Your mom is a brave soul!
Bryan at Blowfish Aquatics- Wow, I cant say enough about the
offer! I will contact you shortly!

Will keep checking back!
Bill

[Bryan Thompson]

Bill,

Did you get my email? We are shipping some stuff out this week and can get the kids thier ricordia this week.

Just let us know.

Bryan.

[thebillabong37]

Bryan!
Sent you another email. If it dosent go through, try me at thebillabong37@yahoo.com. That's my other address. I sent something out last week Friday, but it must not have gone through. Thanks again! You and your company are doing a great thing and I would like everyone to know it!
SHOP BLOWFISH AQUATICS!!!