Nitrate level refuses to go down!!!

[sucker4saltwater]

I have tried everything and could not get my nitrate levels to drop. Help PLEASE. I really need some suggestions here. Thanx in advance.

[Nanook]

First,

[welcome]

Can you tell us some more about your 55 gallon setup? How old is it, what are you using for filtration, last water change, bioload, etc.???


Nanook

[jackson6745]

I see your from Brooklyn also--I would also be glad to help you out----but I need some more details about your system

[sucker4saltwater]

Its a 55 gal tank with approx. 65lbs live rockand 60 lbs live sand. live rock was just added about a week ago. As far as filtration goes i am currently using (2) Fluval 404's. I have a brand new Lifereef skimmer and 20 gal sump. But i am waiting for my overflow and return pump to be delivered so i can hook everything up. Last week i did a 14gal water change which didn't seem to do much. I have (2) small yellow tangs, (1) small sailfin tang, (1) percula clown , (3) damsels and a cleaner shrimp which is said to be sensitive to high nitrates but he seems to be doing fine. What do you guys think could be the problem. Is it even possible that my tests are not accurate? PLEASE HELP

[rhino]

Hi, yes there is a chance that the test kit is maybe old and innacurate but u dont state what level of nitrates u have. Also u may be having some die off from the introduction of your live rock, it may have started a small mini cyclying again , maybe u should check ur ammonia and nitrite levels as well as these are more toxic to your livestock. it will still take time to reduce ur nitrate levels once ur sump and over flow are hooked up so the best way is to carry on with water changes on a regular basis until ur parametres reach an acceptable level.

[Nanook]

WOW:eek1: You have a lot of fish in that 55g tank. That is most likely one of the big problems. One yellow tang in a 55g tank is pushing the limit, the Sailfin Tang will get HUGE eventually. I think your nitrates are probably due to the new liverock, high fish load and your skimmer not being hooked up yet. You might do well to get rid of a couple of those tangs for that size tank...they will probably fight in that small of a space. Considering the sizes that Tangs can reach, plus the fact that most of your tank is LR and sand, they will not get cohabitate peacefully for very long.

You could also add a macroalgae refugium to help export nutrients.

Nanook

[lllosingit]

Where to start?
You are moving way to fast.
You should not have put live rock in the tank with fish unless it has been cured by "YOU" first.
You are most likely in the middle of a cycle due to the live rock that you put in the tank.
You have to many fish for a 55.
The tangs will quickly out grow your tank.
Do you know anyone who will hold some of the fish until you get the tank under control.
Between the fish and new live rock you have more waste in the tank than it can handle.
How long have you had it setup?

[kozmo02]

your bioload is too high and you probably overfeed them.

problem solved.

:D

[sucker4saltwater]

You don't have tell me twice i have seen some pretty large tangs. But i purchased them small on purpose. I am planning on purchasing a 125 gal anyday now. Which they will be put in shortly. Just trying to avoid having a problem like this in my next tank. By the way the rock was cured before being put in the tank.

[lllosingit]

If you don't do something to lighten the load on the tank you may not have any fish left over to put in the 125.
don't get upset, if you want help, then follow the advice your getting.
You have to move slowly and stock lightly at first, then add then add slowly.

[jackson6745]

First thing--check your nitrate level with a different test kit just to make sure your current test kit is giving correct readings. How long has this system been setup? You're a little high on the bio load but I feel your problem with high nitrates is due to your shallow sandbed. I had a 30 gal reef setup this way---it sucked! I had to do weekly water changes just to keep the nitrates below 40ppm!! In my opinion you have to change your system by: adding a deep sand bed or a refugium or both (best choice)-----you could even do plenum---they work great (not out dated) but you won't get as much life in the sand because of larger particle size needed.

If I was in your situation---I would give some fish to friends or a LFS to hold for a while, remove everything (including sand) and place in holding bins. Add about 100lbs of southdown then place your old sand on top and put all the rock and crap back. Later down the road convert your sump to a refugium if possible or just make one (do a search on DIY refugium).

Well I think i covered most of the stuff---any questions just ask
BTW---I don't think you need 2 fluvals:)

[lllosingit]

Did you cure the rock?
If you bought it cured you would have to bring it home submerged in water or you will have die off.

[sucker4saltwater]

The tank has been running for almost 2 years now. No ammonia, no nitrite, but nitrates through the roof is that really possible. I cured the rock myself.

[jackson6745]

So your nitrates went up after you added the rock??

[lllosingit]

if the rock was cured by you and you have no nitrite reading, then I would think it was caused by the fish load.

[sucker4saltwater]

According to my tests they have always been high. I am thinking about trying another test kit.

[sucker4saltwater]

What test kits do you guys use?

[jackson6745]

For nitrates I use wardley's dry tab---not the best, but it works and i won a ton of them at a BAS meeting

[Nanook]

I use Lamotte for nitrates...very reliable.

If you haven't plumbed that sump up yet, you might want to just go ahead and get that 125g going now. That will save you some headaches getting the 55g up to PAR with those Tangs. You could use the 55g as a sump and the 20g as a refugium...just a thought since you were going to be buying a 125g tank anyday.


Nanook;)

[Pike]

Aside from what everyone has told you, high bio-load etc, etc., Change the water!.

Acquire a new nitrate test kit in order to confirm your levels, but a 12 gallon water change is woefully inadequate in removing anything from your water. It will take several, maybe 6-7 30% water changes over the course of the next few weeks to bring your nitrate levels under control.

Use common sense: mix the water for 24 hrs before adding, match tank temperatures & so forth. I'd personally perform 3 30% changes in the next 9 days & record your readings.

Again, this is all aside from what you've stocked in your aquarium, which is too much imho, just get that water healthy for now & keep it healthy until you have that 125 cycled & rdy for fish.

j.p.

[Project Reef]

Originally posted by sucker4saltwater
Its a 55 gal tank with approx. 65lbs live rockand 60 lbs live sand. live rock was just added about a week ago. As far as filtration goes i am currently using (2) Fluval 404's. I have a brand new Lifereef skimmer and 20 gal sump. But i am waiting for my overflow and return pump to be delivered so i can hook everything up. Last week i did a 14gal water change which didn't seem to do much. I have (2) small yellow tangs, (1) small sailfin tang, (1) percula clown , (3) damsels and a cleaner shrimp which is said to be sensitive to high nitrates but he seems to be doing fine. What do you guys think could be the problem. Is it even possible that my tests are not accurate? PLEASE HELP

Other than a high bioload and the live rock being in your system for only 1 week, the Fluval 404's are what are causing the nitrates. Remove all the media inside of the Fluvals and run them for only water circulation and perhaps a bag of carbon (which should be changed out at least every 3 weeks). Once you do this I can almost garauntee your Nitrate levels will begin to drop.

See if you can remove two of your Tangs and damsels.

Bottom line, remove the Fluvals - sell them. Or Keep them, and remove all of the internal media and biomaterials and use them strictly for extra water circulation in the tank. These can be nitrate factorys.

[Nanook]

Great advice Ali...I was so caught up in the Tangs that I couldn't see the Fluvals.


Nanook:lol:

[ginntonic74]

Get rid of the 404 and i bet your nitrates will drop in no time.

[Squidman]

Not to be the proverbial wet blanket, but IMO, 2 yellow tangs and a sailfin is still too much even in a 125. I think 2 small to medium sized tangs (kole, yellow, purple, etc.) is as many as a 125 can handle. Remember with these fish it isn't as much a question of bioload as it is about territory.

I'm sure once you get some sort of export or nitrate processing capacity you can get those levels in line. For now, since your skimmer isn't hooked up (as I think you said), no DSB, no macro export, I'm not sure how you expect to remove the nitrates being produced by that high bioload. I would be doing 25% water changes every couple of days until I got nitrates down to 25 ppm or better. The set up the sump and skimmer as soon as you can. Good luck and keep the welfare of your fish at the forefront of your mind. :)

[fish esq.]

Have you tried blowing debris and other junk off of your rocks? Before a water change, take a powerhead or a turkey baster to get the particulates in the water column. There is a suriprising amount of junk which accumulates on the rocks over a short period of time.

You can also use a powerhead with a sponge filter on the intake and run it for a few hours to catch the particles.