carpet anemone ID

[silvercvic]

what kind of carpet anemone is this?

It appeared to have been dying in my tank for a couple of days and now it swelled back up and seems to be okay. I read another thread that said that there were other types of capet and was wondering what I had. I was also wondering about the hardiness of it...seems to be a fighter so to me.

He's a green carpet that rests upon a 2 1/2"stalk like column and occasionally flattens to a 6"-7" disc
Here's a pic

[BonsaiNut]

S. gigantea. No doubt about it (at least to me).

It tends to be one of the most difficult anemones to keep for an extended period of time in captivity, but this photo looks good. Anemones will, on occasion, shrink down totally and then re-expand. They do this to flush wastes out of their system, and to balance water chemistry between their body tissues and the surrounding water, as well as to give hobbyists grey hairs :)

Keep us informed - looking good so far!

[silvercvic]

thanks....
Now I purchased 2 tomato clowns the other day and realized that they don't normally become a host to this particular anemone, correct me if I am wrong, but is there anyway to coax them into this anemone??

[Gary Majchrzak]

I am quite sure {like 99%} this is a green Haddon's Carpet anemone in your pic. {I maintain a Haddon's Carpet.} I'm glad to hear this anemone is going to make it. Remove the Tomato Clowns and get the anemone two small Saddleback {A. polymnus } or Clarkii anemonefish symbionts. {Unwanted clownfish can be easily netted out late at night when asleep.}
I think a pair of Black Clarkii Clowns would look stunning in that electric green Haddon's anemone.

[silvercvic]

ok...now a bit confused, can anyone differeniate the 2 types (S. gigantean and a haddon). What are the characterisitcs of the two, and is it definiate that these won't host a tomato clown (the lfs around here don't let you take back fish for a trade or return)

[Gary Majchrzak]

Stichodactyla gigantea has longer tentacles than the ones your anemones posseses.

[silvercvic]

how hardy are the haddon's...also feeding requirements, water conditions, etc. Thanks

[shez15]

silvercvic-

I also agree you have a S. haddoni. S. haddoni's are one of the more hardier species to keep. They still require pristine water conditions but metal halide lighting is not a necessity. I maintain a 10" haddoni under 380watts of VHO lighting. Feed regularly, at least once a week. Silversides or shimp are your best bet.

[silvercvic]

I am running 4x55watt PC lights all smart lamps (10,000k/actinic blues) with 40watts of actinic blue NO lights on a 55gal...would that be enough light for the anemone if he is settled on the floor

[shez15]

I'm certainly no expert, but I'd guess you are pushing the bare minimum to sustain this type on anemone in a 55gal. It really all depends on how healthy your carpet is and your water parameters. Keep your fish levels low and feed it regularly. You may also want to try Gary Majchrzak's suggestion and remove your tomatos (if they haven't already hosted) and get a pair of Clarkii's or Saddlebacks. Anemone's with host clownfish tend to do better.

Good luck! Keep us posted.

[silvercvic]

will try to do that...I am planning on rearranging all my tank setups at home..I wanna do my 120g piranha tank to marine.

[BonsaiNut]

Can you give us a close-up shot of the tentacles now that it's been in your tank for a bit? Do the tentacles move or are they more or less static? Is the anemone still in folds and piles like in the photo, or has it opened up and spread out a little so that it is lying flatter?

Another couple photos would be great!

[silvercvic]

will take some tonight and post them up...they are tentacles that move...like fresh cut grass that waves in the wind..when it opens up, it sits pretty much on a stalk still (like a mushroom)

Had a question though...when he opens up, he is about 7", but some point in the day, he shrinks down to about 3-4", that normal on a daily basis??

Also, how do you take a real good close up photo of something int the aquarium?? Everytime I get ral close, it gets blurry and wavy due to water movement (even though I turn off all the powerheads)

[Gary Majchrzak]

silvercvic- good aquarium photography is not the easiest thing. There are tips for photo taking on the photgraphy forum. Even using the advice of pros, I find getting a decent shot is hit or miss- usually miss !
The daily shrinkage of your anemone is normal. If I disturb the sandbed around the base of my Haddon's anemone, it can withdraw completely into the sand.
Take your pic to Dr. Ron's forum. I'm sure he can confirm it is a Haddon's carpet anemone from the picture above. Now if the good Doc would only ID my miniature carpet anemones......:rolleyes:

[silvercvic]

here is one pic

[silvercvic]

here is a pic semi-close up

[silvercvic]

here is a pic of his foot/stalk

[silvercvic]

and yet another one

[silvercvic]

and this is what he looked like when I thought he was dying

[BonsaiNut]

Well, I repeat my earlier opinion. I think that is very clearly a S. gigantea. Maybe we should call in some experts :)

That last photo makes my stomache flop. I don't often see anemones look like that and then spring back. However in your case it appears that things are looking up. (I am assuming the other new pictures were taken AFTER the last one?) I am going to keep track of this thread and bug you for photos every week or so :)

[Gary Majchrzak]

BonsaiNut- The bet is on! {No harm in a friendly bet, is there?} I think it's obvious the anemone in question is Stichodactyla haddoni !
Oddly enough, mine went through similar contortions when acclimating. {You can see pics of my blue Haddon's Carpet Anemone in my gallery of pics on page two.}

[delphinus]

That is an amazing recovery. I wouldn't have guessed it possible. Good luck for a continued recovery.

Bonsai -- how come you think it's S. gigantea? I'm kind of thinking S. haddoni on this one too. Although in time maybe the tentacles will come out more, so maybe time will tell.

PS. The reason I think it's S. haddoni ... actually there are two. One, the column is very smooth with no evident verrucae showing. 2) the tentacles are short nubs, but more importantly, clearly arranged in rows. I thought this was a trait of haddoni (although I could be wrong. I have only ever seen S. gigantea myself only two times in many years of looking for one, and the rest I have had to content myself with pictures of others).

[silvercvic]

what are you guys feeding your carpets?? And how big should the pieces be??

[delphinus]

I don't know if it's kosher to post a link to someone else's site, but this is one of my favourite sites that showcase S. gigantea.. Tubs's website, "John's Reef Flat" (http://reef.esmartweb.com/)

http://reef.esmartweb.com/anemone.htm

PS. Silvercvic - I feed my carpet mostly pieces of fish. Either silversides, or maybe a piece of something I bought for myself at the grocery store, like red snapper or something. I cut up a 1"x1" piece and feed that (and cook the rest for myself. :) ). About once per week or so. I find if I don't feed at least that much, that often, the anemone starts to open up less than before and may even go for a walk (I guess she starts looking for her own dinner.) HTH

[ClownFishTycoon]

Her is a pic of my small S. Gigantea

[silvercvic]

i think mine looks like delphinus's carpet...no offense

[Gary Majchrzak]

Initially, my Haddon's Carpet would eat nothing offered. After a week of contorting, expanding and shifting into position, it took 1" x1" chunks of fresh scallop after rejecting frozen silversides. About three weeks after introduction, the anemone made sushi of my spawning Mandarinfish.:( I now feed my Haddon's Carpet Anemone all of the above {except Mandarins!}, but much more sparingly than other reefkeepers seem to do: a morsel every month or so. I have over 1000watts of artificial lighting + natural sunlight + anemonefish, and these are probably contributing factors to my anemones infrequent feeding requirements.
Incidentally, I have a Macrodactyla doreensis in the same aquarium on the same feeding regimen with it's own clownfish. I've maintained the LTA for aprox. six years and the Haddon's for aprox. 8 months. Both are doing very well.:)

[silvercvic]

so now..i believe I asked this question before....but has anyone seen a tomato clown go into a carpet???

I don't know anyone that will take my 2 clowns and I was tempted to buy 2 saddlebacks, but I don't know if 2 different types of clowns can go together in a tank

[Gary Majchrzak]

All of the Tomato Clowns that I have seen go into a Carpet Anemones have never come out.....alive that is! I'm sure there are exceptions.
I would definitely not mix Tomato and Saddleback clowns in the same aquarium. These two species can be vicious. Remove the Tomato Clowns late at night slowly with a net.

[silvercvic]

Been wondering this from you guys...bit of a beginners question, but here goes:

During and after my acclimation period with my carpet..which he look like he was about to go under, I was afraid that we were to starve off and die. So I left a 20watt actinic blue on all day/all night the side he was on. Now I used to turn on (2) actinic blue 20watt (40watts altogether) to stimulate sunrise and sunset, then crank on the 220watt PC lights for the most part of the day, then go completely dark for night (when I sleep, too). But after thinking about the carpet utilizing zooanthellae for living, I figured it would help him recover if I left some sort of light on for him. Is this doing anything for it and zooanthellae or should I go back to going completely dark (lights out). What do you guys do???? Is this what most reefers do for a moonlight effect (keeping actinic blues on all night??) Or do they just turn off the lights??

Also does ICH/ICK affect the carpet and how hardy are these anemone once they are settled in?? I heard that anemones live a very long time

[Gary Majchrzak]

I leave a "plug in the wall nightlight" on by my anemone every night- this is to help drifting sleeping fish see the anemone. I believe leaving the actinics on all night long is not good.
Anemones are apparently immune to ick- I've seen fish covered with ick get eaten by anemones.
The natural lifespan of these carpet anemones is suspected by experts to be close to 100 years, but I have not yet heard of any definitive answer regarding this longevity question. In other words, 100 years is just a guess by those most qualified to speculate.

[Dargon]

Gary, you may want to give this thread from Dr. Ron's forums a quick read.

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=136854&highlight=immortal

The age estimates on anemones may scare you a bit....

D.

[Gary Majchrzak]

Interesting...my Stichodactyla tapetum were mentioned in that thread. Thanks for the link Dargon!

[BonsaiNut]

It is hard for me to tell looking at the photos, maybe I am seeing something that just isn't there :)

To me, it looks like a gigantea because:

1) The way the oral disk lays in folds and lumps - haddonis that I have kept tend to lay much more open and are much more substantial and "firm"

2) The tentacles (albeit they are short right now, but I have seen that in stressed giganteas a lot) In haddonis they have a definite compact "bulb" shape which I think is missing in this specimen

3) General appearance - I have to admit that haddonis are 1,000x easier to keep than giganteas. The way this thing is contorting, etc, it appears to be acting more like an unhappy gigantea than a robust haddoni

However it is very difficult to say with the photos.

I agree that Gary's blue haddoni looks like a perfect blue haddoni :) You won't get me to argue that :)

Also, the presence of verrucae is a genera-defining characteristic -- i.e. all species of anemones within the genera Stichodactyla have verrucae, so that doesn't really help us.

[silvercvic]

you guys/girls has been great for helping...this is important to me as I am in the process of getting rid of the tomatoes (1 died becuase of ICH and the other is ICH crazy...can't get rid ot it) and getting a correct clownfish to go with the anemone. So more in the lines of a saddleback or sebae??? What about a clarkii?? (LFS gets those mixed up that they don't even know what they sell!)

[delphinus]

I'm not really that up on my clownfish ID's beyond the basic complexes, but I don't think I've ever seen a true A. sebae in my area anyways, that wasn't probably A. clarkii.

I dunno ... if you like clarkii's why not that one maybe? They're easy to find captive raised and all that. I find they're a little bit aggressive and big for my taste but that's just me.

Bonsai -- come to think of it, I think I have also seen stressed S. gigantea that had tentacles very similar to S. haddoni. The one thing that really sticks out in memory about the one I saw, thoguh, was that the tentacles were still quite beefy compatively speaking.

So what do you think mine is? K. Lee says he thinks it isn't haddoni but I always thought it was. I've had it for approximately 2.5 years so far. Other than the aggressive feeding response (there's no doubt in my mind it his capable to taking down most fish if they blunder into the anemone by chance ... I don't keep any fish in with it in that tank) ... it has been a very undemanding and fairly easy going animal for me. I have it lit by a single 175W halide but it gets occasional sunlight too depending on the season/time of year.

[silvercvic]

delphinus...how long have you had your anemone with a clownfish??

I find this very interesting...:

Originally posted by rshimek

No. The clown may take them as a host, but if they do, they will literally buffet the anemone so much that it cannot feed or open normally and it will eventually (and in not too long a period) die.

:frog:

This is from that thread from Dr. Ron

[delphinus]

I thought he meant in terms of smaller species particularly non IndoPacific hosting species of anemone.

I actually don't have fish in the tank with my carpet. ..

[BonsaiNut]

Originally posted by delphinus
the tentacles are short nubs, but more importantly, clearly arranged in rows. I thought this was a trait of haddoni (although I could be wrong.

S. gigantea has tentacles in rows (like haddoni). They both have verrucae as well. There are times (like this one) when they are not very easy to tell apart :) We will know more in a week or two when it gets acclimated to the tank -- then it will take on an appearance either more haddoni-like or not :)

Here's a red gigantea with tentacles in rows. In my opinion this looks a lot like the anemone we are discussing here:

http://www.splash-sea.co.jp/zukan/image/251.jpg

Here's a smaller purple gigantea with tentacles in rows:

http://www.splash-sea.co.jp/zukan/image/255.jpg

BTW if I lose the bet what are the stakes? Do I have to give someone a frag or something? :)

[silvercvic]

well, now I can't tell anymore...they are both beautiful but what clownfish host either gig or hadoni??

[delphinus]

I dunno .... I guess I have my own opinion. To me the folds of (what I think of as a S. gigantea) are much more pronounced, and the tentacles much ... beefier (I don't know how else to describe it). I think slight folds are probably a function of water movement and neighbouring subtrate too.

Amazing colours though. I'd take one of those any day if I had the space. :) (But I'd still think they were haddoni :p ;) )

[iceman16238]

Swallop has a real gigantia. I am 99.999999% sure you have a haddoni. Actually it is a haddoni and i have no doubt. The tenticles are way too short.

[Gary Majchrzak]

In the above photos the red anemone is a Haddon's and the blue/purple specimen is a Gigantea. Notice the clear difference in the length of the tentacles on each specimen. The tentacles on healthy Gigantea anemones are always constantly "vibrating".
BonsaiNut- we have a "friendly bet". No payout of frags is necessary.;)
I agree that swaalop has a Gigantea.
I have attached a pic of my Haddon's anemone.
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/521/7144polymnus2.jpg

[silvercvic]

well, my carpet has a look of grass waving in a soft breeze...so you are saying that is a gig??

[BonsaiNut]

All along I've been so stupid!

All we needed to do was turn them over so we could read the label they have on the bottom of their foot! :)

[Gary Majchrzak]

Actually, the size of their foot is also a good indicator of species. Haddon's anemone has a substantially larger foot {column} than Gigantea.
silvercvc- have you confirmed with Dr. Ron in his forum that you have a Haddon's anemone yet?

[delphinus]

Originally posted by BonsaiNut
All we needed to do was turn them over so we could read the label they have on the bottom of their foot! :)
Oh shoot is that the trick? Because I was just trying to ask mine what it was, and all it told me was "hungry." :bum:

Originally posted by silvercvic
well, my carpet has a look of grass waving in a soft breeze...so you are saying that is a gig??

Originally posted by Gary Majchrzak
the blue/purple specimen is a Gigantea. Notice the clear difference in the length of the tentacles on each specimen. The tentacles on healthy Gigantea anemones are always constantly "vibrating".

Mine does that too (was it this thread I posted the pictures in? Or the other one? Already I can't remember! Argh!). But to me mine looks totally different from, say, swaalop's (swaalop's anemone has much fatter tentacles). I've always wondered why my haddoni would sometimes exhibit gigantea-like behaviours. So could we be talking about possible hybrids do you think? In mine, I don't think it can likely be a case of "it hasn't been in my tank long enough for the tentacles to come out" because I've had it for 2.5 years so far, and has grown from about 8" diameter to about 18".

The length of tentacles of the pictured purple anemone don't really look that long to me compared to other pictures of gigantea. I know mine has tentacles that long, when they are not retracted (they "pull in" at night, and sometimes during the day if it's been a while since the last feeding.) If they were to get longer or fatter in time (on the purple carpet I mean), then I guess I would probably lean towards agreeing with your ID.

The one real key difference I see that the purple carpet has, is that the tentacles are arranged in singular rows whereas the haddoni has tentacles in rows of 2 or 3. Could there any significance to that?

Maybe I should be posting pictures of mine in Dr. Ron's forum because now I am totally confused! I am certain mine is haddoni. Other than the slightly longer tentacles and the fact that they vibrate when the anemone is happy, it really bears little similarity to, say for example swaalop's, or Tub's, or Green Lantern's (all of whom have unmistakeably S. gigantea [that is if I am not mistaken, lol].)

[jacobdol]

those are definitely haddonis. Are they dyed? I have never seen red or purple carpets....

[Gary Majchrzak]

Although carpet anemones are sometimes dyed, none of the specimens in this thread appear dyed to me. Naturally pigmented blue, purple, orange and especially red Haddon's command a high price.

[delphinus]

Although the red one is spectacular beyond words as well, that purple carpet above just gives me shivers everytime I look at that picture. Simply amazing. If I could see one like that for real, I'd probably watch it for hours on end.

[silvercvic]

greens aren't that special???

We get purple sometimes, though I heard that the red/pinks ones are the extremely rare ones

[delphinus]

Sure they are! I just meant I really like the purple one, is all...

[showjet98]

100% thats a stich. gigantea, i kept one in a 60 gal. tank for over a year. the tentacles are to long to be a haddoni, and the area around the mouth(with no tentacles) is to large to be a haddoni. It is a gigantea!