Can a False Percula live with a black and white Percula?

[coolcat310]

I was thinking of buying a False Percula with a Black and White Percula. Will this be okay in a 30 gallon tank with no other inhabitants?

[JHardman]

Hi

OK, I am not slamming you or anything, but there are no black and white A. Percula.

http://wish.wodonga.tafe.edu.au/kwaldon/perc.htm

There are however black and white false percs, A. Ocellaris.

http://wish.wodonga.tafe.edu.au/kwaldon/oce.htm

Don't feel bad, I was at a LFS today that labeled just about every clownfish they had in stock as A. Sebae when in fact they had some A. Clarkii and some A. Polymnus and not a single A. Sebae in sight. They had one really nice A. Polymnus labeled as a “black and white Percula�. I had to laugh, the guy working in the department asked what was so funny, I told him that such a big LFS with so many SW fish didn’t know what fish they even had. We spent a few minutes reviewing Joyce Wilkerson’s clownfishes book, he was remarking the tanks as I was leaving. :lol:

So if you add another A. Ocellaris you should be fine. Just get one that is fairly small, at the very least smaller than the one you have now. They may fight a little at first but the new smaller clown should be accepted without too much trouble. If the fighting gets too bad separate them and post here for more advice.

HTH

[jacobdol]

yep, true. Some scientists even consider ocellaris and percula being the same specie. :eek1:

[OscarBeast]

You know, when you have fish that breed well in captivity, you can do what is called "selective breeding". :) Yes, there most definitely is back and white A. perculas.

For example, here is a black and white tank raised percula. Take careful note of the dorsal fin. The shape between a percula and an ocellaris is quite different, though counting of the dorsal spines is usually more accurate. Even in the drawings giving from the previous poster you can see the shape and height difference.

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?siteid=21&pCatId=1114

[coolcat310]

Thank you for your comments.

JHardman

That's what I meant to say. I was talking about black and white false perculas, but I guess there is a black and white A. Percula, which OscarBeast pointed out. I don't know how accurate the website was, but oh well. I will get the Clownfishes book soon because I'm getting my tank soon. This book has been highly recommended by quite a few people in this forum.

I'm not thinking of doing this, but can you interbreed with different species like the A. Ocellaris and the A. Perculas?

Well which ever Clownfish I get, I'm sure I'd be happy with them 'cause they're all so cute. Although, I am kind of hessitant about getting a Maroon Clownfish.

Thanks again...

[JHardman]

Originally posted by coolcat310
Thank you for your comments.

JHardman

That's what I meant to say. I was talking about black and white false perculas, but I guess there is a black and white A. Percula, which OscarBeast pointed out. I don't know how accurate the website was, but oh well. I will get the Clownfishes book soon because I'm getting my tank soon. This book has been highly recommended by quite a few people in this forum.

I'm not thinking of doing this, but can you interbreed with different species like the A. Ocellaris and the A. Perculas?

Well which ever Clownfish I get, I'm sure I'd be happy with them 'cause they're all so cute. Although, I am kind of hessitant about getting a Maroon Clownfish.

Thanks again...

No problem, glad I could help.

I too am not too sure about the liveaquaria link either. It looks like an A. Ocellaris to me, hard to tell for sure without counting the fin ray/spines which is pretty hard to do with that picture. It is possible to selectively breed for a color or pattern in any animal, but I figure if someone was breeding these on mass that Kylie Waldon’s site (the one I linked to in the previous post) would have shown, mentioned this variant.

Hybrid clowns... Humm there is a subject unto it's self. The short answer is yes, clownfish do interbreed in the wild and in captivity. There is some debate but it appears that there are at least two species of clownfish that are considered hybrids, A. Leucokranos and A. Thiellei and maybe others too. Checkout the skicky post at the top of this forum for more information.

HTH

[Squidman]

I am not aware of any scientific documentation that supports the existence of black A. percula's. I'm not saying they don't exist, but that would be, well, rare. The fish sold as "black percula's" in LFS and online are a black variant of A. ocellaris. That pic on the Dr. Foster's & Smith website looks exactly like an ORA tank raised black A. ocellaris. Again, it is extremely difficult to be definitive from that pic, but I am 99.9% sure it is an ocellaris. I believe Eco-tropic had told me that there is no such thing as a black A. percula, but I will search back and find out.

[Squidman]

Here (http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=144251) is a link to a thread regarding that pic a couple of months ago.

[smity1333]

I have a pair of Black A. ocellaris with orange on the bellies and lower fins.
They no doubt were "inbreed".
I think there more stream-line :-)
{Will POST PIC TOMMOROW}

[JHardman]

Originally posted by smity1333
I have a pair of Black A. ocellaris with orange on the bellies and lower fins.
They no doubt were "inbreed".
I think there more stream-line :-)
{Will POST PIC TOMMOROW}

I picked up a pair of black A. Ocellaris last week. The female is about 2.25" and the male about 1.25". The male has a hint of red/orange on his nose.

Now the female had problems during shipping, she got trapped in a corner of the bag and was basically DOA. Her color was more orange than black. She looked like a faded regular A. Ocellaris, orange and white, just a hint of grey in the orange bands. Long story short, many hours of TLC and a week later and she is as good as new. Now that she has recovered from the near death experience, she is all black, not a hint of anything but black and white on her.

It was neat to watch the male as she slowly came back from the dead, he never left her side. He tried several times to get her up off the bottom and swimming. When she started swimming, she had a real hard time keeping buoyant and the male would “bump� her to help keep her a float. That night she was hanging near the surface and did not show any interest in the Formal 1 I fed, but the male brought her piece after piece trying to get her to eat. She finally took a little. I have one heck of pair!

I am betting the male will lose the red/orange nose as he gets bigger. This pair is about 12-18 months old, so they have a little growth in them yet.

[smity1333]

Here's a pic of the pair.

http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/1890367.jpg

They show all the signs of a pair ready to breed.
I was unable to learn they're past, though.
So I don't know if they've ever breed before.
Do I just wait it out?
Also, I have 1 other fish (blue damsel) in the tank, should I remove? He hides alot in the rocks. He's very scared of the clowns, so I left him in. (Plus I can't get him out of the hole)

[JHardman]

If the DAMsel occupies too much of the clowns time, either in running it off or just patrolling for it, then I would remove it if your goal is to get your pair to spawn. If they don't pay attention to it, don't worry about it.

Clowns spawn the best when they do not have other things to occupy their time.

HTH

[coolcat310]

Hey JHardman,

Could I see a pic of your pair? Thanks...

Coolcat310

[smity1333]

Here they are under blue light.

http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/1892308.jpg

The damsel is border line. I think I'll leave it for now.

Maybe I'll put on some Barry White for the clowns...

[JHardman]

Originally posted by coolcat310
Hey JHardman,

Could I see a pic of your pair? Thanks...

Coolcat310

Sure. I took this pic the day after they shipped in. The female was still showing a little red/orange on her lower jaw, which has since gone all black.

http://007excell.com/personalpics/fish/black_ocellaris_pair_small.jpg

[barebottoms]

Nice ones JHardman, your pair is looks looks just like my pair.

Anyone notice that the ORA farms Black Ocellaris are starting to look weirder and weirder lately? Last few times I've been to my LFS, they actaully have had at least 4 in stock, everyone has been misbarred, lots of orange faces and or cubbed gills. I think ORA needs to start diversifiying their gene pool.

[JHardman]

Originally posted by barebottoms
Nice ones JHardman, your pair is looks looks just like my pair.

Anyone notice that the ORA farms Black Ocellaris are starting to look weirder and weirder lately? Last few times I've been to my LFS, they actaully have had at least 4 in stock, everyone has been misbarred, lots of orange faces and or cubbed gills. I think ORA needs to start diversifiying their gene pool.

Thanks.

Yep, I am pretty sure these came out of England. One of the LFS around here has a tank with ORA A. Ocellaris (orange and blacks) and a tank if the English A. Ocellaris blacks. Wow what a difference! Lots of mis-barring in one of those tanks. ;)

Now if I can just get my hands on a pair of A. Mccullochi. :confused:

[coolcat310]

Thanks JHardman...

Those look so nice. I can't wait to get a pair. I still need to setup my tank, hehehe.


So, I was wondering, which of the pairs does everyone favor? The Black and White A. Ocellaris or the regular orange A. Ocellaris...


Thanks,

Coolcat310