Best way to force BTA to split

[TIGER SHARK]

I have read several ways to force BTA's to split and was just wondering what has worked well for you all? Some people force them to split very often and they stay small but I have seen pics of other BTA's that are HUGE! I have heard massive water changes, excessive feeding and even physically cutting the BTA in half can result in clones. As soon as I get one and it seems to be stable in my tank, I will try and get him to split. I know some will not split but I will buy a clone from someone so it will be the right kind.

[barebottoms]

You're serious?

[TIGER SHARK]

Why wouldnt I be?

[barebottoms]

Originally posted by TIGER SHARK
I have heard massive water changes, excessive feeding and even physically cutting the BTA in half can result in clones.

and


As soon as I get one and it seems to be stable in my tank


Do you realize why people theorize those factors cause a split? Its because you're causing stress to the animal, so the statements of that and getting your tank stable is a contradiction.

In my opinion, its one thing to want a split, but to actually try and cause one by stressing an animal out......

[TIGER SHARK]

Im not talkin about getting my tank stable, read my original sentence again... And if the stress doesnt make it plit when its first introducted into my tank then I will let it chill for a while until it looks to be happy/stable in my tank. Then after it seems fine, I will try and force a split. I dont know which way yet so thats why im asking. I know that stress causes them to split and I have read a lot on keeping various anemones. I am not looking for people to attack me in this thread, I am asking for help. If you can help, please do but If you want to point out things people are doing wrong or try and make them look stupid, then there are plenty of other threads of people with only 2 or 3 posts with messages like "Just got new ritteri for my clowns, how do i take care of it? Will my 40Watt NO light be enough? Oh no, why did my anemone go into my powerhead?

[Squidman]

I think the idea of forcing a split is the problem here. There are theories on how to encourage a split, but to say you want to "force" a split makes it sound like you are willing to sacrifice the well being of your animal to make him split. The only theory I have heard that has had repeated success, though nowhere near 100%, is to feed heavily for a week and then do a couple of major water changes. I have never attempted to encourage a split in my BTA's so I have no firsthand knowledge. Just be sure to keep the well being of the animal in mind.

[naso30]

TIGER SHARK- I don't believe barebottoms is trying to make you look stupid or trying to flame you. This type of question makes some people wander why would you want to do this and why would you ask us since most of "us" are going to take it wrong. What you are asking is not in the best interest of your BTA and since it sounds like this does not matter that is why you are finding trouble with this issue. I would not recommend forcing your BTA to split, it will do this on it's own. I am sure you will find trouble finding very many that would recommend it. If you try forcing it, it will most likely die from major stress, which in turn will be exactly the opposite of what you want, right? If you want another BTA go buy another one IMO.

[Anemone]

TS,

I'd say first learn to keep the anemone - by that I mean keep it for 6 months to a year and learn to observe it. Then, if it hasn't split on its own (and it may well have already split), you can experiment with feeding heavily and/or doing major water changes. At least by that time you'll be better prepared to know if something has gone wrong, and take steps to correct it before your anemone expires.

In no case would I ever recommend physically cutting the anemone - I know it can be done because I've accidentally torn a clone on a couple of different occasions resulting in viable splits, but I wouldn't want to try and do it on purpose.

FWIW,
Kevin

[prevyet]

TS-"Have no fear my friend. Have faith in simple division." Anthony Calfo told me that before I cut my 14" monster. I know of some big names that have and are doing this. It has been working great. BTA's have shown a remarkable ability to survive. I saw a friends get ripped apart by a powerhead and the next day he had five BTA's in his tank.

It has been two months since I cut mine and they are eating and living happy. A member from the local club is picking one up this weekend. I feel good because I have done my part to help the wild population. The thread of my pics and directions is somewhere in this forum so do a search.

I know how you feel, RC has lately been more about bashing then information sharing. If more people tried this the price of a Rose would be alot more affordable and the pressure on wild caught would be reduced. If you need anything else please PM me.


A signature of someone in my local club sums it up nice.
"The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person who is doing it."-Chinese Proverb

[TIGER SHARK]

Thank you prevyet! You know what Im talking about. I know lots of people force their rose BTA's to split all the time because they are always for sale on this board. I also know people are making a killing on them and the wild population is continually harvested to keep up with the demand for them. I am asking before I try anything so I will have a better chance of being successful. I think we should share techniques that work in order to make more non wild collected specimens available to everyone. If we dont try how will we ever learn what works? I agree that anemones do require a lot of work and the correct enviroment to thrive and I think I have done a lot of research on the issue. I feel that I can take a lot better care of these animals than a lot of people who buy them and the stores they bought them from. If you can get a BTA to split from heavy feedings, that is what I want to know and that does not seem too stressful. So what would that mean? Feed it as much as it will eat, every day?

[Mac_1962]

This is the first time that I heard of cutting anenome's to get them to split. How big of a cut is required?

[zooqi]

Ok, I'm interested on the cutting methode information. I just want to learn and I do not want anemone to split because I'm running out of space. I thought anemone won't cure if it got hurt :) I learned long time ago if you hurt the base then you have hurt the heart. I have not seen any anemone split except in a friend's tank. Please post your info.:)

[prevyet]

I updated the old thread so go see it for an update pic.

Hurting the base will not really kill it if its healthy.. I have damaged BTAs before when moving tanks and they all healed or split soon after. I started first trying to make a small cut to the foot of this guy but it healed. Then after some advice from someone on this board I tried a big long cut to the side. It healed. Then after several emails with Calfo and others I cut the thing totally in half. Now instead of a 14" monster I now have two 8" monsters. That is why one is leaving. Need the room.

[OscarBeast]

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/inverts/cnidaria/anthozoa/bubbletipanemones.htm

[zooqi]

You cut it from the center and it healed to be two :) Did you cut it like you would cut the shroom from the mouth ? How long did it take to heal ?

[melev]

This thread is just making me sick to my stomach! And I'm sure someone will attack me for saying so, but freedom of speech is just that.

I have always loved anemones, and have lost a few along the way due to inexperience on my part. These creatures live long healhty lives in the wild, and if we can maintain decent conditions, they can "thrive" in our tanks. The idea of cutting them in half (and I'm only talking about anemones, not some other creature like Xenia or Mushrooms) just seems so ... extreme.

Your point about protecting wild caught btas by propagating tank raised ones is an excellent goal, and I applaud that idea. And if an anemone is hurt because of an accident while moving/transfering or due to an encounter with a powerhead, we hope and pray it will be okay. But to surgically separate it into two pieces just seems exceedingly harsh to a beautiful and fascinating creature.

I'm just a hobbiest, not a scientist with a background in biology. Let's succeed in their care and let nature take its course a little more slowly and hopefully successfully.

FWIW, I'm not singling out or attacking anyone in this thread. I'm opposed to this line of thinking. :sad1:

[prevyet]

melev-I respect your oppinion and I applaud you for walking the line without crossing it. If it really bothers you please don't open the thread. It is like a show on TV you don't like. You don't watch it. RC is about knowledge sharing and that is what I am doing here. I am not telling everyone to go cut their BTA in half. I don't now how many times I have seen on this board a post about a new guy getting his BTA in a powerhead or ripped apart by a fish and he throws it out so as not to foul the tank. Hopefully from this thread he would see that they regenerate and can survive. I had cut mine to make room and I feel good to share it with others. I have never lost a BTA and this guy is 10 years old. He had split in the past several times but stopped for about two years. I tried for a year to get it to split via the water changes and heavy feeding method. Just got bigger and bigger.

Anemones are structurally the same as mushrooms. In some coral books they are even labeled as "mushroom anemones." To me if you feel like cutting the shroom then cutting a BTA is no different. They heal and regenerate the same. It would be nice to let nature take its course but unfortunately the wild population is getting smaller and smaller thanks to the hobby. We need to learn to reproduce them like we now do other corals. I could just keep the info to myself and reproduce and sell them like others are doing but I want to share it to others like Mr. Calfo did for me.

zooqi-Lateral dissection starting from the mouth outwards all the way thru. Then the other side from the mouth outwards. It is the best way to try to get an equal part of the mouth and insides for both specimens. I have only seen this and done this out of the water. A day or two later the insides will be pulled back in and the tissue will close around it. It then takes about two weeks for the mouth to be visibly formed.

I bet this is what Noah felt like when building the Ark. :D

[zooqi]

Interesting and thank you and good to know that. I did a pressure fishing line with recordia and it worked. Recordias split fast if you feed them and I wanted to know if they would split with fishing line pressure and it did work. I brought two pieces of small rocks, fishing line and tight the rocks to each end. I put the line in the middle by the mouth and with the pressure of those small rocks the line slowly divided the mouth to two and after that I put the line crossing both mouths and it divided that to two and I had four of them in a short time.
Guys, I do not want to get in argument and that is the last thing I want and I respect your views. If it was not all the incidents and experiments we would've not been where we are in this hobby. This hobby has changed allot in the last decade and thanks to those who observed, experimented, posted information and shared them with us. I don't have any BTA but I learned something today. The power head was not meant to happen and it proved something because somebody shared that info. We all learn and share info and is up to the person to try it or not. If it worked then let us know to confirm and if it didn't work then also let us know.

There are more people here reading this and want to find out "HOW"
:spin1:

[zooqi]

I have lost alot of shrooms in my blender experiment that somebody mentioned in the past about it and I have step by step in RC if you guys remember. I learned alot and now I have 4 systems running and getting ready for another experiment April 7th when I get my shroom shippment. I have done alot of experimens and some worked and some did not. Some experiments worked in different conditions and the first fail did not stop me and I also did some that worked nobody tried it and I'm waiting to put pictures together in a site. I mentioned that to Anthony Calfo about a month ago and I will have pictures for him to share it with the rest.

[Flameangel]

I agree that sharing of information is important - that is why I am here at this site. With that said, this is my experience.

My roses split about every three months. I feed them several times per week. I feed them sliverslides, krill and scallops. The roses live on the right side of the tank. Because they split and move around the rocks on that side are not every stable. So from time to time rocks fall onto them. (I do not do this on purpose, they do it through they activity.) I do notice that when I have rocks fall, sometimes they split in the next day or two. I have not ever noticed cuts or injuries - just stress.

Just a final note - I do cut pieces of my large SPSs on a regular basis. If I did not take that action they would sting the heck out of each others. - Just a thought.

Connie

[zooqi]

Flameangel: so is more stress than cut that makes them split in your tank ? I think that big water change does the same thing as a fallen rock. I'm glad humans are not like that:D or we will be using alot of anti stress pills than BCP. :)

[zooqi]

Well, I got 5 Rose BTAs today and they are my first BTA and have nice colors. :beer: :beer: