Husband kills wife/self

[Jerry W]

This happened not far from us. The wife had advancing Alzheimer's Disease and the husband couldn't bear to see her suffer. Sad.

http://goerie.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071228/NEWS06/824215667

[dkh0331]

Are you in the Franklin area?

I'm just down the road in Kittanning.


The same thing happened with my best friends parents several years ago. His mom had a stroke and could not deal with the limitations that were left upon her. So dad shot his wife and then took his own life.

Very sad to say the least.

[MarkS]

The opposite happened in the house across the street from me several years ago. The husband had advanced Alzheimer's. His wife went to the store and when she came back, she startled him. He, not recognizing her, pull a knife and stabbed the "intruder" to death.

[BigSkyBart]

when we do this for a ailing/failing pet, it's "humane"
but try the same treatment on grandma or grandpa & it's a crime...go figure

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11477104#post11477104 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
when we do this for a ailing/failing pet, it's "humane"
but try the same treatment on grandma or grandpa & it's a crime...go figure

I don't think I am going to go into this much but just say that we are a little bit more important than our pets. And I don't think we put our pets down and then kill ourselves after the fact. Clearly this man had mental problems, and is just a very sad case for the family and all.

[jpfelix]

lots of people are less important to me than my pets.

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11479471#post11479471 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jpfelix
lots of people are less important to me than my pets.

I should have worded the statement better, sorry about that.

I meant to say we are one a different level than our pets.

[pnosko]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11479510#post11479510 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bluerug
I meant to say we are one a different level than our pets. Again, speak for yourself. I don't agree, and know many others that don't either. But, I have heard my sister say about her dog when discussing how far to go with medical care "Well, he's just a dog." So I understand your point, but don't expect universal agreement.

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11479607#post11479607 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by pnosko
Again, speak for yourself. I don't agree, and know many others that don't either. But, I have heard my sister say about her dog when discussing how far to go with medical care "Well, he's just a dog." So I understand your point, but don't expect universal agreement.

I do not really expect universal agreement but in the world we live today, pets are considered to be property. No human I know of is considered to be property. This case is very sad indeed, and if they did have kids I am sure his kids will be outraged. I had a great uncle who I did not know but have heard stories over and over. He was a WW1 veteran and had horrible things done to him while he was in the war ( I think this caused his mental break down and so does everyone else in the family) and when he came home he lead a normal life until my great aunt had a severe stroke which left her with basically no memory but people could still hold a conversation with her but its just that she would forget about that conversation 5 minutes later. Well my great uncle could not put up with her any longer and decided to kill her and kill himself. Everyone in the our family resents my great uncle for doing that and call it selfish. He was not right in the head for a lot of reasons but the majority of our family blame it on the war.

A human life to me and millions of others is far more precious than a dog, cat, etc, etc. This subject really just hit close to me.

[pnosko]

Well, while I find the act of taking a human life in all but a few circumstances unthinkable, I will freely admit that if I had to chose between saving the life of one of my cats and some humans I know, it would be my cat that would live. And while I am very protective of them, I don't think of them at all as property.

I don't value human life over all other on this planet. Humanity has shown too much disregard for other life-- human or not on this planet to deserve such favoritism.

[Scuba_Dave]

I know a few humans I wouldn't even warn if they were about to be hit by a bus

That said, perhaps if we had more humane laws that allowed people tp pass on to the hereafter in a more dignified manner this wouldn't happen. Medical Science has advanced to the point that we can keep people alive in a pathetic state

Hard to judge at what point a person should be allowed to pass on

[TheBimbo]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11481101#post11481101 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Scuba_Dave
I know a few humans I wouldn't even warn if they were about to be hit by a bus

That said, perhaps if we had more humane laws that allowed people tp pass on to the hereafter in a more dignified manner this wouldn't happen. Medical Science has advanced to the point that we can keep people alive in a pathetic state

Hard to judge at what point a person should be allowed to pass on


;) exactly...


Christy...:)

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11481056#post11481056 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by pnosko
Well, while I find the act of taking a human life in all but a few circumstances unthinkable, I will freely admit that if I had to chose between saving the life of one of my cats and some humans I know, it would be my cat that would live. And while I am very protective of them, I don't think of them at all as property.

I don't value human life over all other on this planet. Humanity has shown too much disregard for other life-- human or not on this planet to deserve such favoritism.

Well your pets are considered to be property. My cousin got a full taste of that when her cat became ill because of all the recalls on the pet foods a little while back. She did not have a leg to stand on, because of the fact her cat was considered to be property.

Yes there are some people out there that are horrible and all, but when it comes down to it we are not supposed to treat them like dogs.

[Altpers0na]

i frequently think of the lounge as a cruel, compassionless sort of place...


but on this one i agree with tony, dave and cristy..

i prefer most peoples pets to most people

[BigSkyBart]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11482988#post11482988 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Altpers0na
i frequently think of the lounge as a cruel, compassionless sort of place...


but on this one i agree with tony, dave and cristy..

i prefer most peoples pets to most people

I know almost as many people with ill mannered pets as with ill mannered children

I prefer my own pets to most people

I'm not completely self centered, I'll admit that several of my friends do have GREAT dogs and one or two of them even have good kids

If I could have called hubris or kevorkian to end grandmas or a few other family members last ailing months, I would have

[Scuba_Dave]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11482786#post11482786 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bluerug
Yes there are some people out there that are horrible and all, but when it comes down to it we are not supposed to treat them like dogs.

Of course not!!

I would treat my dog MUCH better!!! :D

[TheBimbo]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11482988#post11482988 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Altpers0na
i frequently think of the lounge as a cruel, compassionless sort of place...


but on this one i agree with tony, dave and cristy..

i prefer most peoples pets to most people



we are not a group of un-compassionate,cruel, or mean people- we just have fun and tell it like it is... I love The Lounge and have a blast in here but I've also gone through at the very least a big box of puffs here and there, oh and coffee outta da' nose well that's not nice on the keyboard :rolleyes: ...

^^^ that being said, when push comes to shove The Lounger's have a lot of love for one another, :) I am sure you didn't mean for that to come off nasty or heartless it's just me saying how I took it, but other than that, thanks for agreeing with me as that doesn't happen a whole lot of the time :lol: ...



Christy :lol:

[crp]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11482988#post11482988 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Altpers0na
i frequently think of the lounge as a cruel, compassionless sort of place...


but on this one i agree with tony, dave and cristy..

i prefer most peoples pets to most people

What lounge have you been in? You most certainly cannot be talking about the people here, who most would give the shirt of their back for anyone who asked.

[BigSkyBart]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11483252#post11483252 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by crp
What lounge have you been in? You most certainly cannot be talking about the people here, who most would give the shirt of their back for anyone who asked.

espescially if the request for said shirt was accompanied a few shots of tequila :D

[crp]

Oh Bart, get with the program, it's winter so I've switched to Baileys. :D

[Freed]

Hey bluerug how about that Michael Vick? Some property he had, huh? Don't think the courts agreed with you or him on his "property".

[TheBimbo]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11483252#post11483252 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by crp
What lounge have you been in? You most certainly cannot be talking about the people here, who most would give the shirt of their back for anyone who asked.


:D Helllooo Carrie :wave:



Christy...

[crp]

:wave:

[JokerGirl]

I would have to agree with the majority of people on this one in saying that I value the life of my pets over most people I've known.

In that, I can honestly say that the way that people are kept in vegetative and diseased states is more inhumane than allowing them to pass with at least some shred of dignity.

Unfortunately, it isn't medical science that keeps these poor people alive, but another world in of itself.

[Altpers0na]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11483252#post11483252 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by crp
What lounge have you been in? You most certainly cannot be talking about the people here, who most would give the shirt of their back for anyone who asked.


not trying to argue... and i dont mean everyone of course..

as for mean or heartless.. sometimes.. but not that time...

but just for reference... as to the shirts off thier backs..

i will point to the thread a few days ago when nina posted something about what she should do with one of 'her boys' request to see their family (or some such) and the lounge response was basically 'let them rot'. so much for good will toward men...

i see threads like that all the time... and thats a good example of what i meant by cruel and compassionless..


again, dont get me wrong, i will get in line to let some people rot... (like my sister in law), but thats someone i know, and not a stranger that i only know by hear say on a forum...

but i also get in line to give the shirt off my back... i'll freely help anyone who actually wants my help... i will not help people that dont actually want my help, or just want another hand out...


ill stop ranting and argueing now..

and end with saying im ok with dying prematurely to avoid suffering... and the OP story is sad, but would have been sadder if it had taken another 20 years to resolve its self otherwise...

and im ok with idiots getting themselves mauled by tigers... (i actually think the only reason to shoot the tiger is that it would have been overly hard to get it back in the cage... it didnt do anything wrong... its a tiger, that what they do, and its why i dont plan on going to india for picture safari)

im also ok with baileys in my coffee. which will happen when i get home
:D

sorry that was more than 5 lines.. my bad..

[Jeffrey Porter]

2

[cwegescheide]

For me, I have a soft spot for the Elderly (because I have a lot of respect for people who have lived and put up with all the crap in the world for 70+ years deserves respect), children because their innocent (for the most part) and everybody else should get whats coming to them one way or the other, 2 fold.

I think most animal lovers treat their pets as a member of the family. I know I think of my dog that way. Anybody who thinks of a dog as "just a dog" shouldn't have a pet. The next time you hear of a dog saving a family from harm you can think oh its "just another dog"

I also think that a lot of animal lovers only treat their pets like they wish they could treat people but can't bring themselves to do it because most are out for themselves.


OK... now I don't think we know all the details of these people that have conditions that leave them with diminished quality of lives. I think it should be a matter of choice and medical science should respect these peoples wishes and not force people to take matters into their own hands.

[JokerGirl]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11483657#post11483657 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by cwegescheide
I think it should be a matter of choice and medical science should respect these peoples wishes and not force people to take matters into their own hands.

But medical science aren't the ones who want to keep them alive... from what I've seen it tends to be people's religious convictions that keep them alive.

[amcarrig]

I might get slammed for this but I will always value the life of a human being over the life of an animal. Yeah, there are alot of bad people in the world but that doesn't affect my overall opinion.

[BigSkyBart]

hopefully you won't get slammed for expressing your value of human life. I'm sure the vast majority of society agrees with you.

I, on the other hand, do not share that opinion.
I know I'm in the minority, but on any given day I meet at least one person who I think could make the world a better place by becoming a bear turd. (or a lion, tiger, wolf, coyote, shark etc... turd)
I expect to be slammed for my lack of compassion for humans

[Freed]

Hehe, I agree with Bart. The love from an animal whether it be dog, cat(can't stand them), pig, horse, etc., is unconditional. Discipline them for some odd reason and they come right back to you no matter what with the same love and forgiveness as before.

[amcarrig]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11484453#post11484453 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
I expect to be slammed for my lack of compassion for humans
I doubt it :D I completely understand how some folks can choose the life of an animal over a human and I have felt the same way myself on more than one occassion, that's for sure.

[BigSkyBart]

I'm not placing a higher value on animal life than human

I love animals, espescially the tasty ones

I am just stating, that in my oninion, many humans are a waste of resources that could be supporting other organisms

there are also many animals I could do without

fortunately for many, it's not Bart's world, so my wishes to thin the herd known as humanity go unheeded

"you, outta the gene pool!"
*end rant*

I believe I'll shut my pie-hole now

[amcarrig]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11484599#post11484599 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
I'm not placing a higher value on animal life than human
Oops, didn't mean to imply that you did. Sorry if I came across that way....my bad :D

[cwegescheide]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11484389#post11484389 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by JokerGirl
But medical science aren't the ones who want to keep them alive... from what I've seen it tends to be people's religious convictions that keep them alive.

Are you talking about the Physicians religious convictions or the patients? I'd bet the majority of people that this sort of thing happens the people wanted out but didn't want to suffer by refusing medical treatment.

[jpfelix]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11482988#post11482988 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Altpers0na
i frequently think of the lounge as a cruel, compassionless sort of place...


but on this one i agree with tony, dave and cristy..

i prefer most peoples pets to most people

omg....have i become compassionate!? :eek1:

we can't have that! i want you to take those words back! :p


as scary as it may be, bart and i are very similar in our opinions of this topic.

[BigSkyBart]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11489265#post11489265 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jpfelix

as scary as it may be, bart and i are very similar in our opinions of this topic.

hmmm, it is time to update my quotes?





























yes, yes it is :D

[bluerug]

Well I think I don't really have to say much else other than the fact that I value a human life over a dog's life or cat's life any day of the week.

[spoiledcats]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11489674#post11489674 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bluerug
Well I think I don't really have to say much else other than the fact that I value a human life over a dog's life or cat's life any day of the week.

That would depend on the human. ;)

[crp]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490347#post11490347 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by spoiledcats
That would depend on the human. ;)

I was thinking the exact same thing.

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490347#post11490347 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by spoiledcats
That would depend on the human. ;)

To me a human is a human.

[BigSkyBart]

ummm, I forgot, is michael vick still innocent?

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490472#post11490472 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
ummm, I forgot, is michael vick still innocent?

:lol:

Very funny. But he is still indeed a human, is he not?

[bluerug]

I can name a lot of people that have done far worse things than Vick and got lesser sentences. But don't worry he will be out before he serves his full sentence for good behaviour. And hopefully the NFL will let him play again for serving his time and doing the punishment.

[BigSkyBart]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490524#post11490524 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bluerug
:lol:

Very funny. But he is still indeed a human, is he not?

I for one, have my doubts

[bluerug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490588#post11490588 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
I for one, have my doubts

How is he not human?

[BigSkyBart]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490540#post11490540 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bluerug
I can name a lot of people that have done far worse things than Vick and got lesser sentences. But don't worry he will be out before he serves his full sentence for good behaviour. And hopefully the NFL will let him play again for serving his time and doing the punishment.


between the greed of the NFL, the short memories & the sheep-like mentality of the NFL fans....you're probably correct :(

[bluerug]

I hope that I am right he will have served his time and then should be allowed back to play the game. It would be a great comeback story just as long as he changes his personal lifestyle and truly does change because of the time he would have served. Being in prison can change a lot of people's outlook at life, ecspecially if you are used to the high life.

[BigSkyBart]

I suppose his outlook could change,
maybe he'll get on the prison baseball team

I hope they make him a catcher

[Sk8r]

I had a great-aunt who had Alzheimer's. She had a live-in companion who took good care of her, she stayed in her own house, and, as our guest on Christmases, she could enjoy Christmas more times than anyone---wrap the presents again, and she'd forget she'd ever opened them. It was very sweet, and we did that for her when she'd get confused about what was going on. COnversely, she could tell us long, involved stories about life in the early 1900's.
But Alzheimer's doesn't stay at that stage. And it eventually gets very, very bad, in which quality of life is non-existent.

There's where there should be a recourse...with that and other problems where the individual's wishes are clear in a will, and where there is no medical [standard set in the will] reason to hope for anything but decline.

That said, darned right I'd do most anything for my cat, while lowlifes who take pleasure in destruction and pain can just enjoy their own pain, thank you, to the end: they don't get any points with me because they share DNA with the rest of humanity. Of all the people who deserve to live and can't---the demise of the lowlifes of the world just makes me wish their lives belonged to somebody who'd use them better.

[BigSkyBart]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y111/BigSkyCichlids/happyhappydance.gif

[crp]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490711#post11490711 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
I hope they make him a catcher

ROTFLMAO!

[dkh0331]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490711#post11490711 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BigSkyBart
I suppose his outlook could change,
maybe he'll get on the prison baseball team

I hope they make him a catcher

I'm thinking the prison football team - wide receiver, cause we all know he ain't gonna have a tight end.

[Freed]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11483322#post11483322 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Freed
Hey bluerug how about that Michael Vick? Some property he had, huh? Don't think the courts agreed with you or him on his "property".

[hubris007]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11490540#post11490540 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bluerug
I can name a lot of people that have done far worse things than Vick and got lesser sentences.


Yah yah. We're still waiting on that list of movies with dog fights in them.