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TheBimbo
12/26/2007, 08:42 PM
Probably already posted but just in case here it is... I just found out myself...



http://www.newsweek.com/id/82067


Over the past 24 hours the San Francisco Zoo has gone from a cheerful tourist attraction to a puzzling crime scene. Investigators are combing the premises for clues, trying to figure out how, on Christmas Day, a 350-pound Siberian tiger named Tatiana escaped from its habitat and attacked three young men, killing one and mauling the others before police shot the animal dead. So far they are turning up little evidence; a tiger overcoming a seemingly solid barrier—a 20-foot-wide moat and an 18-foot-high wall—is baffling to police, zookeepers and visitors alike. "We're not certain why the incident occurred—as result of human action or whether this was an incident where the animal was able to get out of the grotto," San Francisco Police Chief Heather Fong told reporters at a press conference.

The incident is, by any estimate, incredibly rare. "To have an animal escape and kill a visitor is unprecedented," says Ed Hansen, executive director of the American Association of Zookeepers and a 25-year veteran of the industry. But for zookeepers it is not particularly surprising: tigers have naturally aggressive and predatory instincts. So when a flaw in design or human error allows one to escape—two factors likely at play in San Francisco—a death is not altogether shocking. It's the rare but very real consequence of allowing humans to come in close contact with predatory animals.

"The fact is you're keeping a wild animal in the cage that eats things the size of humans, sometimes things larger than humans," says Scott Lope, operations director of Big Cat Rescue, an animal sanctuary in Florida. "That's what they do."

While there is no government agency that tracks tiger attacks, Big Cat Rescues recorded 44 attacks by big cats in 2006, one of which resulted in a fatality. The statistic points to a fact that zookeepers say visitors often overlook: large cats, like tigers and lions, are predators even if they have spent their entire lives in a zoo.

"People have a misconception of animals in a zoo that they are tame animals, they've lost their aggressiveness, think of them as pets," says Hansen. "Nothing could be farther from the truth. These are wild animals who have instinctual behavior."

The tiger involved in the San Francisco attack, for example, had already shown her aggressive nature when she attacked a zookeeper during feeding time in 2006. California's Division of Occupational Safety and Health blamed the zoo for the assault, fining it $18,000. While the zoo was at fault, Diana L. Guerrero, an animal expert who previously worked with another tiger at the San Francisco Zoo, says that attack was not necessarily a warning sign; it did not indicate that this particular tiger was any more aggressive than a zookeeper would expect. "Any animal that is a predator will get very possessive at feeding time," says Guerrero. "They are always wild animals whether or not bred in captivity."

But if zookeepers aren't wondering why the animal attacked, they are still unsure of how. The tiger was separated from the public by a 20-foot-wide moat and a 18-foot-high wall. And the facility had recently been upgraded; after the 2006 attack the zoo installed customized steel mesh over the bars, built in a feeding chute and increased the distance between the public and the cats. The renovated facility opened in September.
Experts have their best guesses: that it was likely a combination of both human and mechanical error that allowed the tiger to break loose. The recent renovation could have played a role. The design itself may have had flaws, or the changed environment could have upset the animals, which had moved in only three months ago, putting them on edge in an unfamiliar environment.

Then there's the possibility of a human error. Multiple experts told NEWSWEEK that the timing of the attack—around 5 p.m., closing time, on Christmas Day—may have had something to do with the animal's escape. "You could speculate it was Christmas Day … it was right before closing time and ask, 'Did [zoo personnel] leave early?'" says Lope of Big Cat Rescue. "There are many things you could speculate on that could all be contributing factors."

But experts are quick to caution that the actual causes will not be clear until the police finish their investigation. The zoo (which is usually open 365 days a year) is expected to reopen Thursday, but its executive director, Manuel Mollinedo, said the big cat exhibits will remain closed "until we get a better understanding of what actually happened." It's an understanding that both the police and zookeepers anxiously await.



Christy...

zhenjw
12/26/2007, 10:12 PM
Yea this comes as a shock as its so close by. Funny how the Oakland zoo is only a few miles away from us. I will never go outside to check the mail at night again.

Minuteman
12/27/2007, 06:55 AM
Much talk that the guys were taunting the animal. Imagine what was going through their mind when the tiger escaped and was headed for them...

Freed
12/27/2007, 07:13 AM
One woman protests the shooting of the cat and says the police officers could have tranquilized the cat instead of shooting it and killing it.

Officers who shot the cat as it was coming toward them:

Oh crap, he's coming right for us. Here let me pull my service tranquilizer out of my holster and I'll just put him to sleep for a little while.

Yeah, k whatever.

Sk8r
12/27/2007, 11:57 AM
News suggests now that the way the tiger got out of the pen in the first place was using one of the people killed [who had part of his body over the tiger's fence] as a human ladder.

Sloth
12/27/2007, 12:15 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11464343#post11464343 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sk8r
News suggests now that the way the tiger got out of the pen in the first place was using one of the people killed [who had part of his body over the tiger's fence] as a human ladder.
So the tiger got out, killed the guy, slung him over the fence, jumped back into the enclosure, and used his body to climb back out again?

Rock Anemone
12/27/2007, 01:53 PM
Horrible to kill an animal for doing what comes naturally to it. We're the ones keeping it in a cage.

It should of been tranquilized.

Satori
12/27/2007, 02:01 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11465119#post11465119 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Rock Anemone
Horrible to kill an animal for doing what comes naturally to it. We're the ones keeping it in a cage.

It should of been tranquilized.

They had no time. People were in immediate danger.

sk8rreefgeek
12/27/2007, 02:12 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11461733#post11461733 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zhenjw
Yea this comes as a shock as its so close by. Funny how the Oakland zoo is only a few miles away from us. I will never go outside to check the mail at night again.

One tiger attack, inside a zoo...and you're never going out at night to check the mail again???? in oakland?

sorry, but lol :rolleye1:

Freed
12/27/2007, 02:48 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11465173#post11465173 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Satori
They had no time. People were in immediate danger.

EXACTLY!!!

Sk8r
12/27/2007, 02:54 PM
Nope. Guy had his leg over. Cat jumps up, snags leg and probably gets pulled over the rim as the guy falls backward and out. Then cat is spooked, landing in wrong place, outside his territory, standing over guy, and freaks, running for any darker lair---which turns out to be the restaurant full of people, apparently. Screams and yells aren't going to calm him in the last. Thorough tragedy. Nothing else to do---but it's a cryin' shame.

anthias_lover
12/27/2007, 03:49 PM
"The fact is you're keeping a wild animal in the cage that eats things the size of humans, sometimes things larger than humans,".... "That's what they do." http://i9.tinypic.com/8alzek9.jpg
Picture taken a crocodile at a zoo in the southern Taiwan city of Kaohsiung holds the forearm of a zoo veterinarian in between its teeth, April 11, 2007. The crocodile bit off the arm of the zoo veterinarian treating it, an official reported.

drauka99
12/27/2007, 04:04 PM
this thread isn't complete without a picture of these two

http://www.vegasretro.com/entertainers/photos/siegfried_roy_tiger_2_r.jpg

jennibee13
12/27/2007, 04:06 PM
id like to say its all our faults this animal is dead, but being this forum is where it is, i guess thats a hypocritical statement

Sk8r
12/27/2007, 04:07 PM
Yep, and they're talking about a comeback. Roy still visits the tiger that got him---swears he had a stroke and the tiger was trying to protect him. Which could happen, I suppose. I've worked with little cats enough to know, too, that when a cat means to do good fangs and claws are the only way they can manipulate the universe, and, much more than dogs, they're only 4000 years from wild---a lot of instinct wound up in those kitty bodies. They literally have physical trouble resisting the urge to bat or strike at a dragged lure when they're 'on'. They're like your twitchy Aunt Matilda that just 'can't take noise.' Their nerves are *strung.*

Satori
12/27/2007, 04:08 PM
I would like to point out that without the captive breeding programs at zoos, many endangered animals would be closer to the brink of extinction. It's not all "ooh and ahh".

Sloth
12/27/2007, 04:15 PM
The take-home lesson - Keep your leg out of the tiger's cage.

sk8rreefgeek
12/27/2007, 04:39 PM
I guess that arm that the croc got was reattached too
It was in the msn "year in pictures" article

hubris007
12/27/2007, 06:48 PM
YES!!! I get to be the first to nominate him for a Darwin award. In your FACE...people who didn't nominate him already! Nanner Nanner!


Seriously, You! Out of the gene pool!

oz
12/27/2007, 09:46 PM
Tigers can fly. See here http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8374963053334725096

oz
12/27/2007, 09:51 PM
Don't watch this one, its really gruesome (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2429364096518433136)

Altpers0na
12/27/2007, 10:00 PM
lol the second one is better...

but the first is cool too


if a 2ft house cat can jump 6 - 10 feet vertical... an 8ft tiger can jump?



onto a camera without much effort at all...

Satori
12/27/2007, 10:00 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11468236#post11468236 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by oz
Don't watch this one, its really gruesome (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2429364096518433136)

Not only did he stop rolling the window up, he actually rolled it back down. :fun4:

billsreef
12/27/2007, 10:04 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11465505#post11465505 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sk8r
Nope. Guy had his leg over. Cat jumps up, snags leg and probably gets pulled over the rim as the guy falls backward and out.

The cage designers forgot to factor in stupid humans :rolleyes:

Scuba_Dave
12/27/2007, 10:13 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11468320#post11468320 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by billsreef
The cage designers forgot to factor in stupid humans :rolleyes:

No they did, survival of the fittest....not stupidististist

If he put his leg over, he got what he deserved
But others didn't if they were not involved

drauka99
12/27/2007, 10:18 PM
and a page 2


http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/drauka99/HAHA.jpg

hubris007
12/27/2007, 10:31 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11468399#post11468399 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Scuba_Dave
But others didn't if they were not involved

They, apparently, were the "Y'all" in "Hey, Y'all, watch this!"

Stoopid is as stoopid hangs out with.

jennibee13
12/28/2007, 11:49 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11468200#post11468200 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by oz
Tigers can fly. See here http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8374963053334725096



heres the full story to this, turns out, that elephant almost took care of that tiger http://www.wildlifetrustofindia.org/html/news/2004/040609_joymala.htm

raddogz
12/28/2007, 03:20 PM
It's actually very unfortunate as a day that does not go by by where it is not in our local news here in San Francisco.

They are still investigating. The department of agriculture is doing it's own investigation and zoo is closed all day today.

I haven't been to zoo in the last ten years or so, but accidents can happen. It is very frightening that such a large cat can and did get out of it's enclosure. This very same cat mauled it's keeper in a feeding demonstration last year - it's keeper is suing the city.

I remember thirty some odd years ago these big cats were housed in what was known as the lion house - nothing more than bars and concrete walls - very sad.

pnosko
12/30/2007, 02:08 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11465942#post11465942 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Satori
I would like to point out that without the captive breeding programs at zoos, many endangered animals would be closer to the brink of extinction. It's not all "ooh and ahh". I would like to point out that captive breeding programs could just be a pitiful attempt at fixing the symptom instead of the problem.

It takes an event like this to learn the dirty hidden secrets behind a zoo. It's the reason I haven't gone to a zoo as an adult and never will. Read the following article and then defend the zoo. I dare ya.

S.F. Zoo's history of mismanagement; morale down under new director (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/12/29/MNNQU63KP.DTL)

Notable quotes:That kind of behavior is no surprise to Mollinedo's current and former employees, as well as those who worked under him at the Los Angeles Zoo, where he was director from 1995 to 2002.

"It would appear that his management style - which downplays the value of staff and the welfare of animals - remains in place," said a former worker from the Los Angeles Zoo.And regardless of the speculation in this thread...And it's not at all clear what might have provoked the attack.

"Animals being taunted was always an issue," an ex-employee said. "But you should be able to walk down there slathered in raw meat and not have them get out."

hubris007
12/30/2007, 02:15 AM
I knew it. They were slathered in raw meat! What idiots.
Thanks for the update pnosko!

jpfelix
12/30/2007, 02:27 AM
now had it been declawed...

pnosko
12/30/2007, 03:48 AM
Don't make me come over there and smack you! :lol:

jennibee13
12/30/2007, 09:49 AM
that zoo is finished

jpfelix
12/31/2007, 03:43 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11482616#post11482616 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by pnosko
Don't make me come over there and smack you! :lol:

just don't scratch! i know people. ;)