What Skimmer Would you Choose? (300 Gal System)

[Creade]

Alright.

The 210 has been running for about a year.
Total Water Volume is just shy of 300gallons now.

Im currently using an ASM G-3, mostly because I had it, and because the tank wasnt overly stocked.


Id like to upgrade to a Skimmer that will handle the Bioload of the tank when fully stocked. It will have big fish, so, a good load of waste.

What Skimmer would you buy for a 300 gallon System.

Im not too concerned with price, but Im not willing to buy a $4,000 bubbleking.

I never ask for advice on buying equipment, but in this case, Im undecided.
Give me some opinions on what you guys have used?

Im mostly familiar with ASM and Euroreefs from personal experience.

[TwistedTiger]

http://www.finsreef.com/product.php?productid=16143&cat=254&page=1

or

http://www.finsreef.com/product.php?productid=16145&cat=254&page=1

[Creade]

I've been looking at the H&S Skimmers.

The way the pumps are mounted, any idea how high the water level has to be in the sump?

[USC-fan]

http://www.reefgeek.com/filtration/Protein_Skimmers/ATI_Bubble_Master/Bubble_Master_250_Protein_Skimmer_by_ATI

8" water level.

[Creade]

The size of the ATI is fantastic, I wouldnt need to move things around to fit a 30+" skimmer.

Feel free to keep the ideas coming guys.

IF anyone has personal experience with these skimmers, sound off!

Thanks.

[kodyboy]

http://www.reefnut.com/reefshop/product_info.php?cPath=47&products_id=114
if you have the space this would work well... and it is far cheaper than the above models.

[USC-fan]

I would get the buddlemaster 250 if it will fit. but there is a waiting list for it. so you might want to post on the reefgeek forum here to see when you could get one. You might want to wait for the bubblemaster 250 gen 4, it should be coming in any day now.

here is the thread about the gen4 250's
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1052492&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

[Creade]

Space isnt really an issue. Some things just need to be reconfigured in the sump if the skimmer is over 30"

[Reef Sponger]

From what I read on RC, if you are looking for the best, everyone recommends Bubbleking, H&S, Deltec or Euro-Reef. There's great promise with the new Bubblemaster, according to the vendor who I am buying my H&S skimmer from and will be getting next week. What I've learned about skimmers is that you want to go a little bit bigger as manufacturers tend to overrate their capacities when they are advertising them.

If you have the budget (according to what I learned from the vendor that I am buying from, kmaintl), the best match for your tank setup is the H&S A250, but it's around $1,700. Equivalent to that is the Deltec AP902, $1,869. Both these are recirculating skimmers that can be installed in sump or outside of sump. If you want to go with an in sump only skimmer, then kmaintl recommends the Bubblemaster 250 $749 and I know that they have plenty of Bubblemasters in stock.

[unclereefer]

If it were me, and the budget allowed it, I like the H&S. I've never heard a bad word about them.

[snorvich]

In order of preference: Bubbleking (they don't cost $4,000, I know I have two of them), H&S, Deltec.

[kodyboy]

that is a lot of money for a plastic tube with a pump and some air, but if you have the cash go for it:)

[kodyboy]

http://www.protein-skimmer.com/gallery.asp?id=446996&page=2&shopperid=33210
have this guy (Spazz?) build you one, I have heard they are phenomenal!

[USC-fan]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9717174#post9717174 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
that is a lot of money for a plastic tube with a pump and some air, but if you have the cash go for it:) well nice pumps cost A LOT.....

[snorvich]

How much have you spent on your fish and corals? If not much, go for the cheapest protein skimmer. If substantial, insure their health.

[Reef Sponger]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9718283#post9718283 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by snorvich
How much have you spent on your fish and corals? If not much, go for the cheapest protein skimmer. If substantial, insure their health. :thumbsup: You're right.

BK300 Int is about $2,499 plus s/h/i

[DeltecRules]

My vote would either be a Deltec AP851 or a AP902. The AP851 is rated 270 gallons heavy and 400 gallons normal stocking. The AP902 which has two eheims is rated for 480 heavy and 600 gallons normal. Doug from deltec USA gives some awesome customer service which has helped me out a few times when I needed a few things.

[Creade]

Im not sure I really agree with the choosing a skimmer based on how much ive spent on livestock, I normally try and keep my equipment as high end as possible regardless of where I am in the setup of a new tank. I just never felt the need for a bigger skimmer until now.


But,I think my wife, would disagree with me on how much Ive spent on Fish/Corals =)

Honestly, theres not that much in the 210 yet compared to what there will be.
Its still awaiting Crosshatch Triggers and Watanabei Angels.

Plus the corals need to grow out, as I transfered almost nothing to the 210 from my other tanks, so lots of space for growout!

Thanks for all the suggestions. Ill try and make a decision!

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9717185#post9717185 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
http://www.protein-skimmer.com/gallery.asp?id=446996&page=2&shopperid=33210
have this guy (Spazz?) build you one, I have heard they are phenomenal!

That would be Shaun at Orca Systems. He can custom build any type skimmer you want...the few on his site are just examples and/or skimmers he built and had to keep because of no pays, or people changing their minds on how they want it built.
He will also use any pump he can get and if he can't get his hands on the pump(s) you want to use, then you can find them, buy them, and ship them to him and he'll use them.
They are built as good as any skimmer on the market-quality/craftmenship wise.

[skwirl]

have you seen the elos skimmer thread? those look realllly nice.

[steve the plumb]

Call ORCA you will get a better skimmer,better quality build then Deltec or H&S and you will pay less for it.I think you will be very happy as to what you can get VS what you can pay to get.Deltec skimmers are nice but now that I see whats out there you can get something better for half the price and better built.

[Creade]

I started talking with Shaun today.
We'll see what he comes up with.

[hahnmeister]

Id get the new Sequence skimmer powered by a needlewheel dart. it looks like a monster. look in the dart needlewheel thread in the ReefFlo/Sequence forums.

[reefsahoy]

i saw this skimmer at a local lfs and it's one mean skimmer. the entire chamber was white with foam and the skimmate was really blackish brown and lots of it. http://www.bermudaaquatics.com/5C.htm

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

Hahn...where did the Orca NW w/dart skimmer originate? With Shaun no?
I know for sure he has those pumps.

[Jeremy B.]

EAGLES-

The new Sequence skimmer was built specifically for Sequence by an OEM. I have been testing it for the last couple of weeks, and so far so good! They should be available through a couple of different vendors by the first of June.

Thanks,
Jeremy

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

Thank you Jeremy. So where does the Orca NW come from?

[Aquaticman74]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9719761#post9719761 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by E-A-G-L-E-S
Thank you Jeremy. So where does the Orca NW come from?

I kind of figured they were associated too when I seen them called Orca NW's. I thought Orca would be making the skimmer bodies.

They look nice though. :)

[hahnmeister]

Ah, I didnt get the confusion before, but now I do. ORCA is both the model name of the new ReefFlo Dart Needlewheel pump, and the business name of the custom skimmer builder from protein-skimmers.com. They are not related despite the name similarity... other than Im sure you can get an ORCA skimmer with an ORCA needlewheel pump... which I am considering (either him or spazz).

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

Ahhhh, thanks for clearing that up for me Hahn. :thumbsup:

[kodyboy]

not the cheapest skimmer, just the most cost effective to do the job. There are many skimmers that can do just as well as a bubbleking and cost a fraction of the price:)

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

Not unless you have that red dragon to start with though from what I've heard/read.
Better cost to performance ratio then maybe I could agree with you.
imo

[kodyboy]

Eagles
Were you responding to me? If so huh?

[palawan]

ATI bubblemaster 250. And make sure you get the sticker too!

[hahnmeister]

Just short of making/modding your own pump with a custom volute, the two best options on the market are the dart and the eheim 1260/1262. The 1262 can do up to about 1800lph... and anyone CAN mod the output on one to be 1"+ like H&S, ATI, and Deltec do. The Deltec/H&S versions run $300, but you can buy a 1260/1262 for just over $100, meshmod the impeller easily, and then mod the output, and you will be rockin at up to 1800lph. Thats pretty great for a $120 pump.

Next is the Dart, double the wattage, double the cost, double the output.

[joncat24]

you could put an ETSS 1000 professional on there for about 1/2 the price for the other skimmers listed and rock that tank.

[johns]

but you can buy a 1260/1262 for just over $100, meshmod the impeller easily, and then mod the output, and you will be rockin at up to 1800lph. Thats pretty great for a $120 pump.

Someone please go through the steps of doing this mod and noting the steps on RC, so I can do something to the extra Eheim I'll have as soon as I tear down my 75G tank.

[gasman059]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9716180#post9716180 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Creade
Space isnt really an issue. Some things just need to be reconfigured in the sump if the skimmer is over 30"
Many many options
Have u considered DD's fro AEtech.- if u dont mind the extra watts from a rated pump,IMO and IME there's just no substitute for a DD (technology)
NW's skimmers are very efficient and all of the above mentioned are great-Deltec-Euroreef. But DD require less tinkering.and really do what they are supposed to do period. My two cents

BTW i've had NW's- and had a 450 display with bout 800 total volume loaded and did use ETSS w excellent results. I'm sure that this post will get tons of quotes b/c there's tons of people that think DD's are old technology-but in reality and this is proven there's no better dwell time and skimmate production than with a DD. Its just not the flavor of the month anymore.;)
1-NW's-Air is drawn directly into the pump and the needle wheel chops the water and air into a fine mixture. The end result is that it works similarly to a Venturi design, it's just a different method of injecting the air into the water.

2-Downdraft Protein Skimmers
The Down-draft protein skimmer operates by using a high pressure stream of water injected downward into a column of plastic media, like bio balls, to suck air into the water stream and break the air up into tiny bubbles.

In many ways, protein skimmers are a lot like automobiles. Some people lust after a two door sportscar, while others might desire a four-wheel drive truck. Although neither automobile is quantitatively better than the other, each fills the needs of a different type of driver best. The fact is, there simply is no such thing as a "best" skimmer.
Protein skimmers benefit water quality by facilitating two major processes - gas exchange and export of organic wastes.

In short, the four main factors which govern a protein skimmer's effectiveness are…

1. Bubble size

2. Bubble quantity

3. Overall flow-thru rate

4. Quality of contact time

First two simple
Last two not so simple.
The overall flow-thru rate and quality of contact time are not as clear cut as the previous two measures. Some have reported that high flow-thru rates (several hundred gallons per hour) yield the best results. Others argue that a slow, leisurely flow-thru rate facilitates the best skimming. Most likely, both schools of thought are correct in their own way. The actual chemistry behind the mechanism of protein skimming tells us that, in order to remove the maximum amount of waste possible per bubble, we want a very, very slow flow-thru rate. This makes perfect sense… If the flow-thru rate is slow, each individual air bubble can react with the water for a longer period of time. Air bubbles, after all, don't become saturated with proteins immediately.
The better needle-wheel skimmers on the market are notorious for building a dense, milky froth. This makes for efficient skimming in a relatively compact package. As a result, this type of skimmer is extremely popular, with new designs popping up every month or two. Although the air and water flow rates in these skimmers are high, they still fall short of the air-induction style skimmer
Downdraft skimmers feature high flow-thru rates. They also inject large amounts of air into the water. A typical downdraft skimmer can cycle the entire volume of a 100 gallon system several times an hour. This makes for excellent oxygenation and ensures that all of the water is treated in a short amount of time.Although this design works well, it is notwithout its disadvantages. These skimmers are notorious for being large… many models stand several feet tall. They also require a very strong pump to run correctly, in many cases a pump which is expensive and energy-thirsty.

[Creade]

Im really amazed at how excited everyone got to post in this thread.
I truly expected a couple opinions of people with tanks the size of mine, "I love my euroreef", ""Go with the H&S, they rock"

But really, theres been alot of thoughts tossed out there, and honestly, some that I hadnt considered.

Currently, I am looking into getting a custom Orca Skimmer for the big system.
However, im looking into something for my smaller Tech Build, so, Im charged up about all the options everyone is throwing out.

[Inflames]

"buy" a skimmer? Does not compute.

[Creade]

Feel free to offer to build one for me if ya want!! =P

[Inflames]

hahn's the diy skimmer mastah :)

[Creade]

I have way too many DIY projects going on at the moment to worry about a skimmer.
Easier to just buy one with the money Im saving from all the other projects =)

[gasman059]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9725449#post9725449 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Inflames
hahn's the diy skimmer mastah :)
LOL DIY r just that IMHO.- DIY skimmer - !?
been there done that .

[Fliger]

I'd also put in a vote for H&S of the ones mentioned here. Great customer service, SOLID build, reasonably priced replacement parts. Brian or Eric will are very helpful in the H&S forum. I'm sure Spazz' skimmers are awesome also. And of course the BK is the best skimmer I've ever used. Deltec's great also - just expensive replacement parts (BK also).

You might be OK with a single 1260 skimmer like the H&S A200 or Deltec 851. I have a new tank coming next week and its close to 200G, I was planning on using my custom shorty A200 based on the performance. I ran a couple 2x1260's (AP702 & A200 2x1260) and they easily kept up with my 340G so I'm fairly confident a single 1260 will be OK. However the tank I got comes with a NS4000 2x1260 so we'll see .....

I'm sure this was no help ... only confusing ... sorry! :)

[StupidsReef]

I have a system close to your in volume, heres the skimmer I have

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a381/Tatttoo/129-2964_IMG.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a381/Tatttoo/129-2965_IMG.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a381/Tatttoo/129-2967_IMG.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a381/Tatttoo/129-2969_IMG.jpg

Heres my thread to follow it

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1092498

And if you want to get it @ a really good price and I mean cheaper than anywhere go this site ( even if it's not on his site this guy can get it for you just shoot him an e-mail I got mine from him great guy to deal with too.)

http://www.thereefstop.com/catalog/index.php?osCsid=2d47d6b60ef4299e74d33c783a2f8ea1

I had an ASM G3 with recirc and Mesh Mod on it on a 90g RR it did ok but not great, I fear what this new skimmer can do. It's built like a brick house or tank and it's heavy too. All fitting were Shed80 with O-rings and threaded. Very soild unit.