Anybody using the Holmes-Farley recipe?

[Crit21]

I've been using the Dr. Randy Holmes-Farley recipe for the past year with exceptional results. There are several people in the C Springs and Pueblo area also using it. I was just wondering if anyone in RMRC is also using it?

Farley recommended Dowflake after testing it and determining the contaminants were below acceptable thresholds. Instead of the Dowflake, we're all using Excel ice melt from Sam's. It's about 20% more pure calcium chloride than the Dowflake, and is only about $18 for a 50# bucket.

One person has mentioned that Excel hasn't been tested for impurities, so they say it could contain some bad things. All I can say is that having used it for over a year, the cumulative effects of any contaminant would have been apparent by now. To the contrary, my SPS, LPS and clams are growing like crazy, and the coloration is phenomenal! Even acros that I purchased as brown frags have actually changed to some very colorful specimens.

[adova]

Can you tell me what this is and what it is used for?

[roguemonk]

It's a recipe for dosing Calcium, Alkalinity, and Magnesium in proportional ratios, using fairly inexpensive products like Dow flake, Mag flake, Epsom salts, and baking soda. Check out twopartsolution.com. If you can't find some ingredients locally (like you're not a Sam's Club member) or you don't trust the purity of substitutes you can find, you can buy for a moderately marked-up price there. And all the instructions are there also.

Thanks,

Brad

[messy1messmer]

i use it and love it. over a year now and have never had a problem.

[Crit21]

It actually makes keeping corals affordable. So much in this hobby is so overpriced that saving a couple hundred bucks a year really makes a difference.

[murfman]

Hmmmmm lets see, B-IONIC $40 for a gallon of concentrate;

$18 for 50# Excel (5 YEARS WORTH)
$2.98 for Baking soda
$2.98 for epsom salts

Happy corals and an even happier wallet? PRICELESS!!!!

[Crit21]

Murf, how long does the b-ionic last? Does that price include both parts?

[murfman]

yes, 1 gallon of each in concentrate. I think I was adding 5ml day. Lasted for about 3 months.

[fishfanatic06]

I use it. Works awesome. Way cheaper, same stuff.

[messy1messmer]

the b-ionic should last the same because they are about the same. except the DIY 2 part only cost like 3.50 for a gaollon of each.

[Crit21]

Actually, not including the RO water, the DIY costs 30 cents for the calcium part if you use Excel (50 pounds makes 60 gallons), and about 33 cents per gallon for baking soda in bulk from Sam's. The magnesium sulfate (Epsom salts) and mag chloride might be a total of 50 cents per gallon, but at 2 1/2 cups of the mixture per month, that one gallon will last 6 months, making the monthly cost less than a dime.

Total monthly cost is around 70 cents, or less than $10 per year--AND you can use the ingredients for other purposes!

[adova]

Well, you've all sold me on this now - I am going to start using it today. I am not quite sure how I should go about dosing it, though.

Right now, my params are a bit low (ca - 360, dKH 8.0, mg - 1020). From what I understand, at the begining, I should dose a large quantity to get my stats up where they need to be based on a calulator in the Randy article.

After that, I am seeing about .5 ml/gallon per day which is about 120 ml per day. Should I put both Calc and Alk on two seperate doser channels and let them dose slowly over the course of the day?

Thanks!

[Crit21]

NO, DON'T dose a lot at once! The Alk recipe #1 will change your pH a lot and kill your livestock. As with any additive, add gradually.

Here's a link to the article about the formula: http://reef.diesyst.com/

Here's a link to the calculator to use: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

If you use the Excel, use 20% LESS calcium chloride than the recipe calls for because it's higher purity than Dowflake.

Regardless, read everything thoroughly before doing anything!

[Crit21]

As far as dosing, try mixing both together and watch what happens. You'll make liquid chalk (calcium carbonate) and sodium chloride (salt) when the calcium chloride and sodium carbonate or sodium bicarbonate combine. That must be how they make those Sealab28 blocks.

Add separately.

[adova]

My plan was to dose on seperate sides of the sump.

When I used the calulator, it claims that I need 50 oz of Randy's Calc Recipe to increase my ca from 360 to 420. It then says:

"Do not dose all at once although it may be ok to do so. It is not recommended. Dose 1/3 to 1/2 and the next day test, check your levels, and dose another portion."

So I am not sure what you mean when you say a lot vs. the calculator - what would you recommend dosing to start with?

[messy1messmer]

on the calculator he tells you how much straight dowflake to add. thats how i would raise it. Thats what i use from time to time. i dose 1/2 cup a day of the 2part, but i do have a heavy load of sps.

[adova]

Maybe we are talking about a different calculator - here is what I am referring to: http://reef.diesyst.com/

Shawn

[messy1messmer]

no under pick the product its like the second one for raising cal. dowflake(cal chloride dyhr) dowflake is written at the end of the product

[freddie40]

Shawn,

If you were to put the 50oz in a jar and use your doser to dose it over a few to 24 hours yoiu will be fine. I would recommend this.

First dose the MG to get that back in line (shoot for 1300). It is hard to raise the ALK and CA when the MG is so low.

Secondly dose the CA over a 24 hour period. This is slow enough so there will be no harmful effects.

Thirdly, check your ALK and try to maintain it at about 10DKH. This too should be done slowly.

Dave

BTW: Thanks again for picking up some MG for me.

[adova]

Will do - Thanks!

[adova]

Man - the baking soda is tough to mix - I threw away the first batch and am starting a new one which I will mix in warm water slowly...

The Mg has started in. Something I found out about my dosing pump that I did not realize - it has only one speed (1500 ml / hour). That makes it tough to dose over 24 hours for sure.

Oh well - we'll see what happens - thanks!

Shawn

[Zooid]

Why is it tough to mix? Doesn't dissolve very easily?

[adova]

yea - it turned into hard rock like substance - I had read where it was recommended to mix with warm water, but I was in a rush to get it mixed before I left and did not follow the advice. It just added another 1.5 hours to the project.

I'll learn one day.

[messy1messmer]

adova if you need to raise your ca from 360 to 420 the calculator says to dose 40tsp(on your 240 gallon) i have same size tank and when i raised mine i did it over 3 days instead of 2. that dose is for dow flake

[adova]

I am choosng Randy's Recipe 1 Calcium Part as the product to reference the dosage, which probably works out to close to the same since I use about 500 grams (your product selection calls for 200 grams) mixed with 1 gallon of water. 48 oz is .375 of the full gallon which is in close ratio to the raw mix you reference.

[messy1messmer]

yes but no. i would get on reef chemistry forum on here and ask randy. when i needed to raise it he told me to dose the dow flake straight. Told me to put in like a poly bag and put it in a high flow area. and do it over 2 days 20tsp per day. he told me it would be better to dose straight dowflake then raising it 2 part. he also suggested dosing kalk as my top off which i was already doing. It is totally your choose but i wanted to share what randy told me to do. the 200 grams says to do it over 2 days. when i had to raise the cal on my new 240 i had to dose like 65tsp over three days and never lost a thing.
I hope either way works for you.

[adova]

Cool - I appreciate it. Randy is no longer a mod for the forum - he retired. But some other mods are giving their input as well, so I will double check.

Shawn

[Crit21]

yea - it turned into hard rock like substance - I had read where it was recommended to mix with warm water, but I was in a rush to get it mixed before I left and did not follow the advice.

I heat my RO water on the stove or in the microwave in an uncoated (no teflon) glass put before adding the alk powder or the magnesium.

Use cold RO water for the calcium. The calcium chloride reacts with the water and produces a lot of heat.

[adova]

I also re-did my Mg mix and mixed the two parts seperately with warm water. - almost no precipitation now. And mg is up to 1200 as of tonight!