wobbling tank question

[sugartooth]

I have a 130 on carpet w/ rubber padding underneath instead of foam.
The stand for the tank has square feet every 8 inches or so, instead of being evenly flat all the way across.
We have shimmed in order to level this tank, but I noticed anytime you walk by with heavy footsteps, or for instance if my dogs are playing within a couple of feet from it....the whole tank wobbles a bit.

Is this because of the rubber padding?
How can you stop it from happening short of ripping it all apart and putting flooring underneath?
Is this going to pop my tank? It rocks front to back.

[whiirly]

I know it would scare me
can you get under it and support the tank from down there?

[sugartooth]

No, I don't think I can get under it because it's on carpet and it has settled in a bit. I was jumping a little ways away from it and I see it wobble a little. Does anyone elses do this? Is there any way to anchor the tank a little better if it's actually the floor/rubber padding that's the problem?

I think it would have been better thinking to rip out the carpet in that spot and llay down hard flooring before setting up the tank.

Anyone have their tanks on carpet and wobble? My main concern is that it would cause the tank to pop from the waves if this keeps on happening?

[DougSupreme]

I'd be willing to bet it is your floor that is moving, not the "tank"

[phil5613]

Yep I would say the floor has got some bounce. can you see underneath the tank from the lower floor? I bet it flexes a bit if someone jumps on it. I would say you have to support the floor underneath and at least tether the tank to the wall so it cant tip.

[sugartooth]

How do you brace from the lower floor? Can you describe how to do it? Do I just nail boards for reinforcement?
The lower floor is the basement and you are right, it is the floor that is bouncing.
I would say there is less of a danger that the tank will tip, but the danger is will there be shearing force from constant wobble if I can't brace from underneath properly?

[anjhof]

I think the answer is exactly what you do not want to hear. I suggest taking the tank down, adding additional floor joists or support posts to the existing joists. It sounds like your floor joists are flexing. Once they start flexing you can't fix the problem with all that weight still on there.
I just set up a 210 tank over a basement. I tore up the carpet, added 6 additional joists, installed tile where the stand sits, and carpeted around the tile. This way, if we have to replace the carpet, I don't have to tear down the tank.
I have zero bouncing in my floor. If I had any, I would be very nervous.

[sugartooth]

Woa! How much did it cost? Did you do it yourself?
This is a new construction home and will this void my warranty? It is almost 3 months old.

[lovereefs1]

Kathy - Don't sweat it! You have a brand new house/tank and it's located in the corner of the room/house (which is one of the strongest locations on the floor). Wood inherently has more flex than steel or concrete, so some bounce is to be expected. Every one of our tanks, including the 24 gal. nano, will wobble some if you start jumping/bouncing in front of it. Your tank will not pop from these little waves (you will make far larger ones with almost any kind of wavemaking device). Torquing is what you should be concerned with. It's never a bad idea to check the tank for level reguarly after it is setup. If the floor is overloaded/sagging or settles some, it will be clearly visible on the level and can then be addressed.

[sugartooth]

Thanks so much! I wasn't sure if I was being really paranoid or if it was something serious to be addressed. I double checked the level and it hasn't changed since the time we set it up. Hopefully we will see you soon and get confirmation first hand!
Thanks again....much appreciated!

[whiirly]

me personally I would add a 4x4 with a couple stands to support the floor above from the basement better safe than sorry

[anjhof]

Hard to say for sure what you should do without seeing it. However, if you are concerned, you may want to do something to give you peace of mind. I know I couldn't sleep at night if I thought there was a chance the stand/floor wasn't sturdy.
As far as options, there are a couple of things you can do - you can add additional joists, you can add boards perpendicular to the existing joists, you can add posts to support the existing joists, etc.
As for my situation, I was getting a room addition put on my house. The carpet was coming up anyways and I have a drop ceiling in my basement with conduit run through it, which made adding additional supports to the ceiling of the basement difficult. I pulled back the carpet, cut two pieces of plywood out with a circular saw, added 6 joists - at $9 each, then put new plywood back down - $15 each I think. Total cost - $84. Well worth it to me.
Again, your situation may not need anything. 130 in a corner location of your room - sounds like an ok mix. How many joists run under your stand? Do they run perpendicular?
I would be nervous though if you are getting flexing out of your floor already - if in fact the floor is flexing. One way to know if you are in trouble is to measure the distance from the floor in the basement to the bottom of the joist in the ceiling. If this changes over a couple of months/years, you'll know that the wood is bending and you will need to do something eventually.

Last thing - I suspect the rubber mat is causing you to feel the bounce and you are probably fine - but I would rather be overly cautious and add some extra support.

[sugartooth]

Thanks whiirly and anjhof- I am nervous, even though it is in a strong spot, and it is a new construction house.

I have to check to see where the joists are, and I do not believe they are perpendicular to the tank.

I have also e-mailed the builder super regarding the bouncy floor to see if it's supposed to be that way. His response was:
This is normal it is call deflection there will always be some give (bounce) on a TJI floor system.

I then replied and asked him if he had any insight to how this affects the tank...given I'm estimating about 2,000lbs. (safe side)
If the motion of the water swishing around would cause the tank to break, I don't know and I asked him if he knew....
He hasn't responded yet, and in the meantime I will look in the basement again for a closer look at how the beams run.
I'm also worried about voiding our homeowners warranty if I do any additional work.

[Fuppets]

What is a TJI floor? I will be relocating soon and want to make sure the new home will handle my 180.
Also, you should ask the builder if he does the modifications will the home warratee remain in tact. I can see that it will void if you do the work, but if they do the work it should remain intact. Might cost you a little more but you will still have the warrantee.

[whiirly]

If all you do is support it from under then you should not hurt your warrenty as you wont be changing any thing only adding support if that make sence

[sugartooth]

Fuppets- This was his response to my e-mail:
A TJI floor system is engineered lumber not conventional like a 2x4 or 2x10. It is actually made.
It is a much better floor system.
if you would like you can have some one build a wall in basement under fish tanks. You would probably be better off hiring a handy man. Unless you are looking to frame out your whole basement.

Whiirly- I see your point, I'm seriously thinking about getting his crew to frame the whole basement....I think that would be better in the long run. Since I have two tanks (130 and 170) upstairs with another 140 on the way, it may be a good idea to do the whole basement.

[Sara B]

Frame out the basement for a fishroom and then you can plumb everything to the basement ... it works sweet as I have a 10 x 21 foot fishroom in mine.

[anjhof]

If you need a handyman, let me know. I have a friend who is great. He helped me add the joists to my floor. He also helped me finish my basement and several others I know.

TGI floors should be much stronger than a 2x10.

[sugartooth]

Thanks for the offer anjof...I will note that offer.

I can't believe it today!!! This morning the site super stopped by to take a look! He told me if I was overly concerned I can build a 30" little wall underneath to further support. But as lovereefs mentioned, it's in a good spot where it won't shake as much. He also did mention that it was top heavy, which adds to the wobble. Also, there will be more compression as the tank settles into the rubber and carpet.
How nice! I have never dealt with a site super that has such follow through, especially since it has nothing to do with him.

What a nice man.