Greenhouse project

[dendronepthya]

I have been talking for quite some time about starting a greenhouse based aquaculture system for my coral farm. We finally broke ground on the greenhouse and after a week, it's finally starting to look like a greenhouse. The greenhouse measures 56' x 24' and is 12' tall at its highest point. I only get to use half of it though, which is about a 500 square foot area on the south side. Still, I think that is plenty of space to fit some tanks in. Enjoy...

[Jimbo327]

Wow, that is very cool. How much does it take to build something like that? Very impressive indeed. What will the other half for?

Jim

[dendronepthya]

The final cost is still up in the air, since we have not yet paid for the gas/water/electrical lines, nor have we paid for the gravel/concrete. If I had to guestimate how much it will all cost, I'd say about the same as a luxury SUV.

The other half is reserved for orchids and other tropical plants.

[dudah]

VERY very cool! That would be a great place to have tanks and a green house. keep us posted on how it goes.

[teevee]

Just a thought, system greenhouses, such as Westbrook , are cheaper and more convenient than glass/solid plastic traditional style greenhouses. If I were building a greenhouse for a tank, I would go with them.

[TippyToeX]

Bloody awesome!

What kind of glazing are you using? What kind of Par readings do you get? Geothermal cooling? Humidity a big issue, if so how will you deal with that? Heehee, sorry for all of the questions.

Good gawd man, more info!

[kentonhq]

Wow, nice. I am going to be homeless once your green house is done. can i move in? i will take care of all the corals for you. Free of charge...just let me have fun with them. :-)

Kenton

[tendar]

Do you get enough sunny days for corals and all or will you have to have supplemental lighting for the cloud days especially in the winter.

[dendronepthya]

Just a thought, system greenhouses, such as Westbrook , are cheaper and more convenient than glass/solid plastic traditional style greenhouses.

Actually, the place I got mine from is the same sort of thing, galvinized steel and choice of polycarbonate cover. The cost of the greenhouse kit is less than half of the actual cost of the greenhouse. Once you factor in labor, utilities, concrete, gravel, shipping, etc. the greenhouse kit itself is almost a second thought.

What kind of glazing are you using?

It's called polycarbonate structural sheet. It is two thin layers of rigid polycarbonate with an air gap in the middle. I believe the air gap is there for insulation. Because of the two layers and the geometry of the sheets, you cannot easily see through the greenhouse. The light is well diffused.

What kind of Par readings do you get?

I have to get back to you on that. I have not taken my meter out to the site yet. Perhaps I will have some numbers by the weekend.

Geothermal cooling? Humidity a big issue, if so how will you deal with that?

Geothermal heating and cooling would have been nice, but it would be cost prohibitive at this point. I thought about running a coil throughout the greenhouse to hopefully maintain the ambient temp around 50 degrees year round, but the cost was too much. Maybe if this greenhouse makes money, I can have geothermal in the plans for an expansion.

As far as humidity goes, I am not terribly concerned about it because the greenhouse is ventilated by a 48" exhaust fan. It is set on a thermostat, and will likely dry up the place quickly.

Do you get enough sunny days for corals

Gosh I hope so. I have a feeling that I will have enough considering many people at this latitude end up white washing their greenhouses to reduce the light transmission of their glazing. I plan on taking PPFD readings month by month to see if I will have to add any lights or shade cloths, but right now, I am not planning on using any for the corals.

As you can probably tell, I'm pretty excited to finally get started on this little project. Any other questions?

[TippyToeX]

Thanks for the answers! Sounds like an wonderful setup. I would be beyond excited to be in your place.

I was in the planning stages of a lean-to greenhouse but with the way my yard is situated I would need much more lighting to supplement.

I would think if you have a tank or two with some SPS's you might need to run a few radiums in the winter just to help keep them colored up. Not for any siginificant duration during the day either I would think. Just for a boost if you will.

How do you plan to tackle nutrient export? About how big do you want to have each growout tank?

[BLUESMAN]

Gotta think that the winters are going to be an experience. I've often thought of turning my in ground pool into an giant reef, but that's alot of LS/LR!!! I would have a lot of available sun light though here in Arizona!! It looks good, good luck!! Blue

[rbaker]

Congratulations Dendro!

What an awesome undertaking... Is it's main purpose to grow and sell plants?


Ryan

[JB NY]

That's just awesome. I wish you the best of luck!!

[dendronepthya]

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I really appreciate it. Now on to some questions...

I would think if you have a tank or two with some SPS's you might need to run a few radiums in the winter just to help keep them colored up.

It is a definite possibility that I may need some supplemental lighting. I am hoping that I will not though. What has me a little hopeful is the location of the greenhouse itself. It is basically in an open, unobstructed space that gets light the entire day. The glazing does not let direct light through(geometry of the sheet), but from what I understand, polycarbonate has a very good index of refraction so light is still quite strong. The lighting will have to be a "wait and see" sort of thing.

How do you plan to tackle nutrient export?

I won't be doing anything too fancy here. A large skimmer will be doing most of the work, and I plan on doing monthly water changes. I also intend on having some rock in the tanks, below the eggcrate coral shelf to provide some biological filtration. The plan right now is to put in a good amount of lace rock and seed it with some liverock from my home aquarium. In a few months, I expect that lace rock to be very nice pieces of aquacultured liverock.

About how big do you want to have each growout tank?

There really were two criteria I had for the tanks. They had to be cheap, and they had to be robust. Right away, pond liner was out of the question. It is inexpensive, but I don't think it will hold up well over time. I was worried about burrowing organisms and UV degredation. On the other end of the spectrum were the 1000-gallon fiberglass raceways from Aquatic Ecosystems. As nice as those were, they were out of my price range. The closest thing I could find to this was the 300-gallon Rubbermaid stock tank. They have a nice sturdy body, and could be had for less than $1 per gallon. I will be starting small in the beginning with only two of these 300 gallon tanks. I mapped out my half of the greenhouse, and figure I can fit another 10 stock tanks at a later date. That would be a grand total of 3,600 gallons. Honestly, I think that is big enough for me. Anything larger than that will take some extra hands to deal with.

Gotta think that the winters are going to be an experience.

You're not kidding. I'm actually more worried about plowing snow just getting to the greenhouse. It's a good 150-200 feet from the house. The greenhouse itself will probably be quite comfy since it has its own heating system (and will have a lot of water acting as a heat sink).

I've often thought of turning my in ground pool into an giant reef

Funny you mention that. Last weekend, I saw an ad in the local paper advertising preformed fiberglass pools. One of them was a neat kidney shaped 35' x 17' pool that was around 40,000 gallons. Man was I tempted to just forget about the aquaculture aspect and get a really big greenhouse reef.

What an awesome undertaking... Is it's main purpose to grow and sell plants?

Thanks Ryan, I like to think the main purpose is to grow corals, but in truth it's literally split down the middle. Half will be for the family to grow some tropical plants and the other will be mine for the reef stuff.

[rbaker]

Once you get established, do you plan on selling your frags locally or are you going to set up a website and ship nationally?

Ryan

[dendronepthya]

Ryan,
I will sell over the internet. I think it is a much more robust business model, but I also don't have much of a choice. The zoning laws prohibit me from selling out of the greenhouse directly, so I cannot have customers driving up for business. Individuals that come and see the greenhouse will pretty much be by invitation only.

[teevee]

It's hard to relate fish to plants, but my dad owns a greenhouse and has to spray his roof with a special biodegradable white paint every spring to keep the sun from burning his crop. I'm about ten degrees north of you.

[dendronepthya]

teevee,
Yeah, Dick Perrin at Tropicorium did the same to his greenhouse. I think it is a give and take. Either you whitewash and supplement with MH for the shallow water species, or you leave the glazing clear and put shade cloth over the tanks when the sun gets too intense. I decided to go with the latter option since it consumes less electricity

[TippyToeX]

Dendro- It sounds like a wonderful greenhouse that is going to be a joy to work in. I wish you the best of luck and I hope you keep posting updates friqeently.

Perhaps one day soon I will have the pleasure I buying a frag from you!

[CRG]

WOW! I must admit...I'm jealous Being a horticulturist by profession, this truly fascinates me.

In terms of light transmission, polycarbonate transmits around 90% percent and is stronger, cheaper and better insulating than glass. Perhaps you could install a small unit heater if you're concerned about temperature. One question...does the house come with any sort of venting system, either on the ridge or sidewalls? Also, in terms of humidity, you may want to invest in concrete flooring to cut down on standing water, which can create disease and pest issues as well.

In terms of shading, I agree that shade cloth is the way to go, as it offers more versatility and is less troublesome than whitewashing. With shade cloth, you will be able to partially or fully shade the corals and plants.

Good luck and keep the updates coming!

Cory

[dendronepthya]

WOW! I must admit...I'm jealous

Gosh, don't be! I might never turn a profit on this thing

Perhaps you could install a small unit heater if you're concerned about temperature.

The greenhouse kit included a gas heater. I don't have the stats of the heater handy, but I am assuming it is the appropriate size for this model greenhouse. After reading Anthony Calfo's book, I may be faced with a gas bill of up to $500 per month in the dead of winter. Our greenhouses are different though, and mine might retain its heat a little better because of the glazing material. I really hope the heating costs will be less.

One question...does the house come with any sort of venting system, either on the ridge or sidewalls?

In the first and second picture you can see the two vents. They are motorized, and open when the exhaust fan turns on. In the third image, you can see where the 48" exhaust fan will be located(right in the middle of the far wall). The fan is operated by a thermostat.

Also, in terms of humidity, you may want to invest in concrete flooring to cut down on standing water, which can create disease and pest issues as well.

We decided to go with a combination of concrete and gravel. We will have a concrete footer all the way around the greenhouse perimeter, and a concrete path going down the center of the greenhouse. Everywhere else will be gravel. We chose to go this route for a combination of cost savings and drainage purposes. The location is unbelievably wet, and we needed to be certain it would drain properly. We are running PVC drainage lines the entire length of the greenhouse and burying them under about 8" of gravel.

[kozmo02]

that is really awesome, make sure to post pics as the progress goes on, i would like to see your greenhouse grow into what you want it to be. nice work, that is really really cool.

[scubadude]

Very Nice Dendro

Dude if you havent poured your flooring you really should consider burying some 55g cheap plastic barrels for geo therm...It would be easy and quick cheap cooling. I think your par rating for the most part will be adequate here are some lux readings I took for my tanks, granite our locales are different.

24" Deep tank mid water column non shaded tank in greenhouse
(readings taken 12noon no clouds)
60,000 Lux

24" Deep tank mid water column under 250w DE HQI ushio 10k
(readings taken 12noon indoors)
9,300 Lux

So even with 50% shade cloth on the brightest days you can get more lux to your tank than some MH's

Rocky

[dendronepthya]

I just took some measurements today at noon with my Apogee Quantum meter. It is a partly cloudy day today, and I was getting the following readings:
Outside:
1000-2000 micro-einsteins depending on cloud cover.

Inside the Greenhouse:
450-950 micro-einsteins depending on cloud cover.

My tank at home:
650-680 micro-einsteins
The lights I have over my tank are 250W DE HQI with 440W or VHO actinic. The MH bulbs are quite old however.

Overall, I am pretty happy with the kind of light I am getting in the greenhouse.

[dendronepthya]

scubadude,
I'd like nothing more than to have a geothermal setup in this greenhouse, but I don't know if I will be able to implement one at this point. You did give me an interesting idea though. It would be cool if I could find tall 100+ gallon containers that I could half bury around the inside perimeter of the greenhouse. I could then plumb them together and run the whole setup with one circulation pump. The exposed portions would essentially act as radiators. It would be cool, but again, I don't know it it can be implemented at this point. Maybe next time.