can't stop my topoff siphoning fresh water

StrategicReef · #1 12/03/2007, 02:08 PM

I am using an Aqualifter to pump from bottom of 5 gallon bucket into my sump. After the aqualifter stops the water still drips out slowly from the 5 gallon, especially when the bucket is full, it's got more power to drain down to the sump. I have lifted the outlet tube higher so it's not as low in the sump, that stopped the issue for now, but I want to get a taller bucket, so I need some kind of way to stop the siphoning.. check valve or something, but it needs to be very reliable. I am using 1/4" ice maker lines

RandyStacyE · #2 12/03/2007, 02:28 PM

My first impression would be to use a check valve because the siphon would not be strong enough to open the valve, but the pump's pressure would be. This should stop this problem.

The kind of check valve that I am referring to is small and has a doo-hickie inside that looks like this:

The siphon should not be strong enough to force open this rubber doo-hickie.

Another solution would be to skip the aqualifter all together. You could just use an elivated reservoir plumbed to a float valve in the sump. The sump will draw fresh water on demand. All you have to do is keep water in the reservoir every few days or so (depending on the size of the reservoir).

NanoReefWanabe · #3 12/03/2007, 02:30 PM

your bucket should be lower then the sump...and the drip end should be higher then the pump end...then there is no way a siphon can occur..weight of the water on the pump side should be enough to siphon back into the 5 gallon pail..

not sure what else i can say...i am sure you already knew what i did say..

NanoReefWanabe · #4 12/03/2007, 02:31 PM

oh boy Randy...that is just wrong...LOL...

please excuse my incredibly vulgar mind...

kgross · #5 12/03/2007, 02:38 PM

You can also use a air break at the top of the hose that feeds into the sump, as long as it is after the pump that is. Just put a T in your hose where it reaches the highest spot after the pump, and from the T run a hose up another 6 inches or so. This will allow air to go into the line breaking the siphon.

Kim

StrategicReef · #6 12/03/2007, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kgross
You can also use a air break at the top of the hose that feeds into the sump, as long as it is after the pump that is. Just put a T in your hose where it reaches the highest spot after the pump, and from the T run a hose up another 6 inches or so. This will allow air to go into the line breaking the siphon.

Kim

Thanks this is more practical than trying to place the bucket lower than the sump which is harder to do without excavating a hole below the house..

spreston · #7 12/03/2007, 03:11 PM

Stick the 1/4" RO line a couple inches into a 1/2"-3/4" pipe that is higher than the f/w resevoir.

hebygb · #8 12/03/2007, 03:18 PM

My resevoir is the same level as my sump... the drip end needs to be above the supply end as well as no chance of it being submerged in the sump. As Nano said, the air and weight of the water remaining in hose will stop the drip immediately. I also have my aqualifter above the sump level. Unless you love to tinker and stare at the mechanics, there is no need to over engineer the solution. However I must say I was a bit turned on by Randys checkvalve.

RandyStacyE · #9 12/03/2007, 05:35 PM

Hey now guys ... quit looking at my rubber that way

Matt Rise · #10 12/03/2007, 08:30 PM

Wow...that really looks like a ......... well, you know.

stugray · #11 12/03/2007, 09:30 PM

My first thought was:

"doo-hickie, Oh so that's what they call them in Indiana!"

But really, any pump you use will have a siphon effect that want to dump one way or the other.

I use a gravity feed RO/DI reservoir with a float valve in the sump one floor below.

Stu

flounderfish · #12 12/03/2007, 11:29 PM

I had a similar problem, but rather than raising the bucket, just have the ATO kinda drop it into the tank. You know where the level is, just have the tube into the sump stop an inch before the water level.

medic29 · #13 12/03/2007, 11:43 PM

use a float valve...

brian@sen · #14 12/04/2007, 08:19 AM

You could just run the ATO to the main tank overflow this will allow more water to be added before the pump shuts off. Or get a piece of 1/2" PVC or hose and run it from your sump up behind your stand so it is higher than your reservoir then take your 1/4" hose and stick it in the top of the PVC or hose and your done. The 1/2" PVC or hose will act like a funnel so your 1/4" line will not syphon. HTH

JeffKirk · #15 12/04/2007, 04:01 PM

I have a gravity feed ATO so I bought a Shut Off valve for the GE Icemaker (in the refrigerator). It costs about $17.00, runs off 120v, takes the 1/4" line in & out, and has a bracket to mount it with.
You have to make the cord to plug it in with but after that it works well.
It does have metal parts (Stainless Steel) so you only want to use it with fresh (Top Off) water.

Fishboy93 · #16 12/04/2007, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by flounderfish
I had a similar problem, but rather than raising the bucket, just have the ATO kinda drop it into the tank. You know where the level is, just have the tube into the sump stop an inch before the water level.

I do the same exact thing, seems to be the simplest solution, the end of my ATO line is about 2" above the water line and simply falls into the sump, never had a problem.

bhbell · #17 12/04/2007, 10:05 PM

Piece of 1/2" ridgid airline tubingvertical into sump with top above level of top of bucket. Feed linefrom pump into top of ridgid tube. As long as you alow an air break between the ridgid tube and 1/4" tubing you'll loose the siphoning and get the better control of having it run into the sump directly to be measured by the float switch.

FishTruck · #18 12/05/2007, 01:01 AM

I did what kgross said.

I first used a peristaltic pump and tubing. This was problematic due to siphoning, failure of my peri pump to prime, etc... I switched over to PVC and a little power head.

Here is how my old sump and ATO worked. Never had a problem.

I also drilled a few holes along the resevoir side of plumbing to create many air breaks, just to be sure.

Obviously, some of the water just ciruculates through your bucket.
You can use this to your advantage to control how fast the ATO fills your tank. This can vary depending on what type of controller you are using.

Ryan.

Siffy · #19 12/05/2007, 07:25 PM

Like brian@sen, I have my peristaltic pump refill topoff RO/DI into my overflow. Not only to prevent siphoning, but also to let the water better equilibrate before re-entering the tank.

walkerbrody · #20 12/05/2007, 07:52 PM

I use an aqualifter for my ato. I forgot to put a syphon break in mine and leaked 10gal of water on the floor. Then I put a T inline above the water level of the storage bucket with one end going into the sump and the other end about 12" pointing up. Same as kgross suggested. It cost me arround $2 and I haven't had the problem again.