Can Kalk be used to fully supplement Ca and Alk? - Page 2

wojo · #26 02/10/2007, 02:08 PM

after 2 days after i unplugged the kalk reactor my ph dropped to 8.2 today. today i bought up the Ca to 420 and Alk to 3.5 meq/l, the ph is at 8.4 right now. i dont have any kalkwasser mix handy at the moment so i cant do the test you mentioned Randy.

what should i do now, should i plug in the Kalk reactor and watch the values daily?

i would like to get away from dosing 2part every day and only use Kalk to supplement both but i dont know if its possible.

if it comes to that, why would i ever need Kalk reactor then?

thanks

Randy Holmes-Farley · #27 02/10/2007, 06:54 PM

Yes, restarting the reactor sounds like a fine plan.
If you use a two part, the only time you'd 'need" limewater (reactor or not) would be if the pH was still too low.

cmart28 · #28 02/12/2007, 12:31 PM

I was reading the directions for Kent Kalk and it says that you should only make enough to last 7 days. I am going to start using Kalk to top off my tank similiar to what you described, I have a 32 gallon brute. So it is ok to make more than 7 days worth?

Quote:

Originally posted by 1SickReefer
Well not a pump in it, but above it, you can see my kalk container here and the yellow IKS peri pump that "pulls" the solution from the Brute.

I fill the 44g full, dump in 3 cups of kalk stir for a few minutes into a nice whirlpool cover it and leave it., what does not dissolve settles to the bottom.

The mix remains undisturbed till it is gone which is about 3 - 4 weeks depending on the weather and the amount of evap.

Randy Holmes-Farley · #29 02/12/2007, 01:22 PM

I was reading the directions for Kent Kalk and it says that you should only make enough to last 7 days. I am going to start using Kalk to top off my tank similiar to what you described, I have a 32 gallon brute. So it is ok to make more than 7 days worth?

Yes. I expect their advice is not supported by any real data.

cmart28 · #30 02/12/2007, 01:32 PM

Thank you Randy. Just wanted to double check.

thirst · #31 02/12/2007, 01:55 PM

how can you tell if you are making saturated lime water? how much kalkwasser powder would make say 10 gallons of saturated lime water?

Randy Holmes-Farley · #32 02/12/2007, 01:57 PM

2 level teaspoons will about saturate a gallon of limewater, although it depends a bit on temperature. The best way to gauge saturation is via conductivity. pH can be used, but is fairly crude and insensitive to small changes.

Rhodesholar · #33 02/12/2007, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cmart28
I was reading the directions for Kent Kalk and it says that you should only make enough to last 7 days. I am going to start using Kalk to top off my tank similiar to what you described, I have a 32 gallon brute. So it is ok to make more than 7 days worth?

I was under the impression the reason for the 7 day limit is that after that amount of time too much CO2 has entered the solution making it in-effective. I have read that if mixing to aggressively you can weaken the solution.

Is this information not correct?

Randy Holmes-Farley · #34 02/12/2007, 05:39 PM

The mechanism is correct, but the extent of the effect is not. I've measured it here:

The Degradation of Limewater (Kalkwasser) in Air
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-0...ture/index.htm

FWIW, you should not stir limewater after it has initially been dissolved. That can accelerate the entry of CO2 and the conversion to calcium carbonate.

zooboy74 · #35 02/16/2007, 02:40 AM

Randy:

You say:"The best way to gauge saturation is via conductivity."

How can this be done with say my craftsman digital multi meter? How many ohms should fully saturated lime water be?

Randy Holmes-Farley · #36 02/16/2007, 07:03 AM

It cannot, except in the most crude way. You need a conductivity meter designed to measure the conductivity of water solutions. The electrode surfaces (size, shape, chemistry, etc, are very important. The best meters actually use 4 electrodes on them.

shikhyung · #37 02/17/2007, 01:20 AM

Hi Randy,
If I top off with lime water, do I still need to dose the 2 part everyday. thanks, shin.

bertoni · #38 02/17/2007, 05:07 AM

Maybe. That depends on on how much calcium and alkalinity the tank consumes, and how much water evaporation occurs. Many tanks can't get along with just limewater, many can.

shikhyung · #39 02/17/2007, 10:42 AM

Thanks, I've been dosing well with the 2 parts, kind of very stable. Only one draw back, lately I keep forgeting, and hate to dose double the next day. Dosing lime seems less work, doesn't it? I hope :-). Shin.

wojo · #40 02/17/2007, 12:07 PM

shikhyung, that is my problem, i have to dose 2 part everyday, kalk will not do it for me, i might sell my reactor....

mattboy · #41 02/17/2007, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by shikhyung
Thanks, I've been dosing well with the 2 parts, kind of very stable. Only one draw back, lately I keep forgeting, and hate to dose double the next day. Dosing lime seems less work, doesn't it? I hope :-). Shin.

If you have the right equipment, dosing lime is hardly any work. You need a vessel to keep freshwater in, and a dosing pump of some sort to slowly get the water into your aquarium. You can do the same with a KW reactor, also very little work once it's set up.

On the other end of spectrum, you could stand by your tank all day and drip limewater in with an eydropper. That's alot of work!

There are other methods somewhere in the middle, like mixing up a few days' worth and using a gravity dripper to dose.

shikhyung · #42 02/17/2007, 02:59 PM

"There are other methods somewhere in the middle, like mixing up a few days' worth and using a gravity dripper to dose."
I was thinking doing this way, ...wonder how much trouble I am going to get. I top off about 1 1/4 gallon a day, and I dose 65ml each part everyday. How much lime I need to dose for 1 1/4 gallon? Is there any formula for this? Thanks, Shin.

Randy Holmes-Farley · #43 02/17/2007, 03:36 PM

If you are prone to forgetfulness, using a dosing pump on the two part or for limewater are good options.

Limewater can be made with any amount of lime up to about 2 level teaspoons per gallon of fresh water, beyond which it will not dissolve.

jspot · #44 02/17/2007, 09:46 PM

Would using a maxijet 1200 to move the top off water to the tank from the holding vessel add the kalk mix too fast? My ato only adds a little at a time, usually only running a couple of secs at a time every 3 or 4 hours. Would this be adding too much at a time? Should I look into a different pump before I start replacing evaporated water with limewater?

mattboy · #45 02/17/2007, 10:43 PM

So the mj 1200 would be submerged in the limewater, come on for a few seconds, then turn off? It's possible, but eventually it might stick on, or something could happen to your auto-top off, in which case you could have a big problem. I don't know for sure, but it's my guess that the powerhead is not going to enjoy living in the high ph limewater.

The best, safest solution is to use a dosing pump, in which case the high-ph limewater only touches the inside of the tubing.

bertoni · #46 02/18/2007, 02:13 AM

I use a peristaltic pump, which delivers a stream of drops. Any pump with similar capabilities would be fine. Faster dosing can be okay, but it's riskier.

jspot · #47 02/18/2007, 10:19 AM

Yes the mj would is submerged in my holding vessel for top off water. My ato is controlled by 2 float switches. One is for normal running, the other is a safety measure incase the first happens to stick in the on position. Would this not be the same as others topping off with limewater, only using a different pump? This feeds into my overflow so there should be time for the high ph to come down before any creature comes in contact.

Randy Holmes-Farley · #48 02/18/2007, 02:14 PM

The concern is how much will get added by that pump between when it is turned on and when it triggers off, and what effect that has on the sump pH. It may get so high due to the fast addition rate that you precipitate calcium carbonate.

sigster500 · #49 02/18/2007, 03:24 PM

Hello, Can i just explain how i dose my system with kalk and can you spot anything i'm doing wrong.

At the moment i have a plastic container filled with 5 litres of RO water iv'e put 3 tablespoons of kalk in i mix this for a few seconds each day before i use it.
I leave it settle and then siphon off the clear mix and add to a kent dosing bottle which is above my sump i dose at 1 drip per second and dose around 2 and a half litres a day in top off.

Having read this thread it seems i might be adding too much kalk to 5 litres uk litres that is.

Its not entirely keeping up with calcium levels and i have to add some tropic marin bio calcium once or twice a week.

Ive read some threads of uk forums that kalkwasser isnt the best way to add calc to tanks is this true, some have said it absorbs phosphate into rocks then at a later date gets leeched back into the tank is this true at all.
Or is good old fashioned scaremongering?
Cheers.

jspot · #50 02/18/2007, 03:46 PM

So what is a safe amount to add to a 90 gallon with a 30 gallon sump underneath? If I were to guess the total amount of water in the system, it would be around 105 to 110. Maybe I should just ask what would be the safest way to add limewater with my ato?