Budget Greenhouse Project

[samtheman]

There is a guy in Bowling Green Kentucky who makes cylindedrical rotating tanks. They rotate one way for a while and then reverse. He has a magnetic cleaner hooked up to an arm that slowly moves up and down. Between the moving tank and magnetic cleaner, the tank stays clean automatically. All the plumbing comes up a small central shaft and the rock work is stacked around it.
You can watch the corals sway when the tank changes direction

[reneeccrn]

Originally posted by hamburglar
It's time for someone (hint hint) else to start a thread about a greenhouse and break the 20521 views that this one has

I welcome everyone to post if they have something going on.

Well, I cannot even come close to the documentation you did on your greenhouse, hamburglar, especially since I type so slowly. But I, too, started a greenhouse, the exact one you had. In March 2006. I thought it was budget, but I spend WAYYY too much money on it with heating and cooling it. I live in NJ. I would love to start a new "thread" (is it called?) or posting. I dont even know the lingo. If I do, and I just might, I would call it PSEUTObudget Greenhouse Project. It will continue where you left off, I guess. I learned from all of your mistakes, and then I was able to create all of my own mistakes. And there are MANY!!! So.....let me know if anyone is interested in my continuing endeavor, the tiny 6x8 greenhouse.
ReneeCCRN

[raaden]

Renee,

I for one am very interested in what you have done and are doing. I am sure you will hear from Ham soon, as well.

[RedSonja]

Renee, I'd like to hear it too. Thanks.

-Sonja

[BallaBooyeaH]

Share it round Renee ...

[hamburglar]

Arrrrrrrrr! Ye scallywags have once again beckoned me from my watery grave Arrrrrrrrrr! If it is the wrath of the 8x6 greenhouse ye seek, then it the plank ye shall walk. As the nor’easters blow and the nights grow long, ye shall batten down yer hatches and have second reckonings about yer meager heat sinks. Arrrrrrrr!

-Pirate Hamburglar

[hamburglar]

Ok, I think I just lost any respect I may have once had. Luckily my pirate lingo is weak and I get board with it quickly.

Post Away! I would love to see a thread about the same greenhouse size! There are so many different ways to do this stuff. I’m sure everyone would love to see a second or even third version.

As for me, I’m pretty much in house mode. I want to build next year, so I’m not going to do any reef projects until that is done. Currently my greenhouse has some lovely tomato and peppers growing in it. As for longevity…..the harbor freight is still in great shape. No surface rust or panel cracking yet. I will be devoting most of my “reef efforts” to Raaden for a little while, so you will catch me most often on his thread.

-Hamburglar

[raaden]

I thought Talk Like a Pirate Day was sometime in September... if thats the case I fear that Ham has finally made the long walk off the short plank

[reneeccrn]

OH MY!
OK, well I will just continue here, since you started this madness. First off, I had to make mine a little taller, since it is such a short little greenhouse. I added a frame around the foundation, and cemented posts to attach the framework of the GH to it. It added 18" to the height, using pressure treated lumber. The floor is insulated with exterior house Styrofoam, with pressure treated planks on a 2x4 frame. Had to dig a hole to make the floor deep enough. Now I have to step over the 18 inch threshold, tripping sometimes. But it is tall enough inside. I didn't use a pool, but that was a cool concept. I built a bunch of acrylic tanks. Using loop circulation. The tanks are shallow and hold about 20 gal. This was a bad idea, and I am currently changing over to bigger acrylic tanks I am building. The smaller volume tanks were subject to drastic change of temp, too quickly. All of these tanks (7 tanks as we speak) are plumbed thru my basement window, and into larger sumps in the basement. Cooler in the summer and warmed by the house heat in the winter. I will post photos tomorrow.
This idea was the best so far. (indoor plumbed) I couldn't, however, cool or heat sufficiently with those resources alone. Although it was very helpful. I bought a chiller, I think overkill, really. The tanks are allowed to get to 83 degrees before the chiller turns on. I bought a 2 hp chiller by Pacific Coast Imports. This thing arrived by crated, forklift truck. OH BOY>> I think I overestimated. To my dismay it was not only as big as one of our central air units, but it was 220 electric. Darn. So I had to beg my husband to help me route 220 wire thru the basement, to a new outlet. That was finally expedited. This monster chiller would be horrible to install in the house, loud and HOT. I created a little platform and put it outside, right next to the pool plumbing. I made a little acrylic roof and whalah! Chilly water. That thing cools so fast. It only turns on maybe 4 times per day. The cooling fans just didn't work, although an exhaust fan is a must. During the summer, here in New Jersey, we get a few weeks of 80 percent humidity or more. So there is no way to achieve evaporative cooling via fans blowing on the tanks. WOW my electric bill is bad in the summer. I will be building a tiny geothermal loop for my tiny greenhouse, this summer. The winter, is another story. I have been heating the greenhouse with propane and a tiny heater. The wind whips thru the crappy door so badly, that I built a little vestibule to hold in more heat and also so that I enter, not letting all of the heat out. The greenhouse is close to my house on the south side, so I only had to insulate 8 foot of pipes to and from the house. The chiller was drained for the winter.
I learned from your mistake in this one issue. UV. I know from reading Calfo's documentation, that UV is an asset. I read how the polycarbonate is UV stable. Oh no. Yellow/brown acros for me if I don't fix this. I ripped most of it out, except for the north side. I read how plain glass is very UV transmitting. So I measured and went to the local glass shop, dropped another ton of money and installed glass everywhere. Using silicone to seal and cushion the glass. UV GALORE>>> All of my acros, even green ones turn purple or blue. So it seems. No, but really, the colors are vibrant. The winter takes a toll on the color and my corals are just starting to color up again. As far as cooling and heating, I added a few 55 gal drums of plain water just below the shelf holding a tank, thinking that the volume of water heating during the day, would keep the greenhouse warm in the night. WRONG. What Calfo meant was, HUGE volumes of water, not a petty 150 gal. Well, that took up too much room anyway.
YOU WERE SO RIGHT ABOUT THE RAINOUT> it gets so humid in the winter with the temp variance betw inside and outside of the greenhouse, that it rains. I took your experience and covered my electrical with a plastic box I made. KUDOS to you. The rain bothered me, always dripping on my head, so I then installed GH poly on top of the glass, leaving 1/2 inch space of air. It was like double insulation. I could not figure out how to use that wiggle wire to save my life. I finally had to go up to a farm and ask how he installed his poly on his massive greenhouses. I used KLERKS UV transmitting poly. Advise by A.Calfo, of course. I felt silly after he showed me the wiggle wire technique used to attach poly to a frame. But that insulation worked great all fall/winter. I used five 30 gal propane tanks total for the entire winter (25 bucks a refill), night heat only necessary. So that was like one tank per month. That is where I am right now. Double insulated and about to de-winterize the tiny greenhouse. (rip off the vestibule and poly) First, I need to get the tiny 20 gal tanks out of there, and put a larger one in to replace it. Everything I do, is stupid or a mistake. I built an awesome 1/2 inch thick tank, for the GH. I then went to measure for a new stand to build for it, discovered that the tank is several inches bigger than the door opening. UUUGGH I have to disassemble the frame of the front of the GH to get that tank in. This is one of those times I am contemplating giving up. But on I toil.
I have to clock out soon, so I will post photos when I get home. (sleep first, night shift is a killer)
Thanks for your interest and all of your lessons you had to learn, ham. IIYYYYE Matey
RENEE

[H20ENG]

reneeccrn,
Great story! Keep your head up and thanks for sharing!
Can you tell us what kind of circulation you have? One large pump (you mentioned a loop), airlifts, etc?
GH newbie, here... What is a wiggle wire? I'm guessing its a wire loop you poke through the poly to hang it on the framing?
Thanks,
Chris

[reneeccrn]

I circulate all my water using a crappy ebay 1/2 hp pool pump 350watt. it pumps 2600gph. it was $35 brand new. Huge head pressure. I was so thrilled with it, I bought another as backup. I was using dual gorman rupp pumps, but they weren't as powerful, I also used 2 mag12 also in redundant array, incase one fails. they weren't that powerful. you see, I also pump the same water into my main display in the family room above the basement. and also another tank at the other end of the same room. the entire circulation is about 350 gal. I have an acrylic sump/refug/plenum I built. I think it is 50 gal. two other sumps just 55 gal drums. I have a 50 gal frag tank I built in the basement, most water comes from the GH to that tank, then into sumps. also one little chaeto tank inline. I tried air lift, not enough flow. two tanks did have cont. loops with mag 12's, but one tank split into two, in my basement, leaving my acros high and dry until I smelled them, thus sending me down to the basement to discover a huge flood. the other loop was great too, I tend to use eductors for gentle and better water movement. but that pump, externally leaked. I now use maxijet mods and the new hydor pumps. great cheap flow. I have a dedicated pump for the loop thru the chiller, it required min of 2200gph thru it. like I said, it is a beast of a chiller. anyway I bought a sequence ReefFlo Hammerhead with flow rate of 5800pgh, minus head. it is a great pump, but loud. it circulates if the water temp hits 80, way before the chiller thermostat kicks in.
I have a ton of discarded pumps I need to sell on ebay.\
as far as wiggle wire.. the poly is attached to the GH via channel rails made out of aluminum. the poly is placed on top of the channels that had been screwed onto the frame of the GH. then the poly is attached with a type of zig zag stiff wire that is jammed into the rail, holding the poly in place. kind of like a ziploc bag, there is a channel that the other part of the zip is run thru. I don't know if that makes sense. the wiggle wire is easily removed to open the sides of the GH, not destroying the integrity of the poly material. I skim using a massive diy beckett I made. it is over 5 ft tall. that utilizes a little giant high head pump. I have 2 euroreefs I was using, but the diy is just as great. again, need to sell them on ebay. right now, one is used as backup.
I don't need to supplement lighting outside in the GH, since I have plenty of UV, 400's nm spectrum shining in. as a matter of fact, I need to shade most of the corals this time of year since the sun is so much higher in the sky. just until they get used to that intensity. a few bleached, clueing me in. they lived, and are starting to get a bit of cream pigment. my frag tank inside uses MH, again diy. I have a couple of kole and yellow and purple tangs that pick at the algae. one in each of the bigger growout tanks, and a wrass in each. 6 line and cardinal wrasses. they pick at the tiny pests. I have lots of snails and red legged hermits for the rest of the junk.
I use a Korallin ca reactor, I bought the big one. rated for 1600 gal. I like to grow into my stuff. this calcium reactor holds 22 lbs of reactor media!
I think the way to go is just put your corals out in the GH for spring and summer. forget the winter, our weather in NJ is so extreme, so many days of 6 degrees. winter time is too stressful. my vestibule zipper kept freezing up. and, as ham said, a bigger GH is the way to go. I cannot even let my kids in while I am in there. there is just not enough room to maneuver.
RENEE

[reneeccrn]

Darn. Now you know why I have only 3 posts next to my name. I cannot figure out how to get these photos i took yesterday, onto this thread. I lose patience on my slow internet. I took the pix at low resolution, but i cannot get more than one or two to upload. That is not enough to display my messy little GH. HELP!@
Renee

[reneeccrn]

Nevermind, I just found the "How do I post an image" hyperlink. So silly. I am always in such a rush.
R

[raaden]

Renee,

Excellent posts, it is always good to hear from people who are "Living the Dream"

[reneeccrn]

ok here are some photos. hope they show up.

i tried to explain most items in them. let me know if you want to see more. like the sumps or whatever.

http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o...fVestibule.jpg[/IMG]







[IMG]

[reneeccrn]

more photos

[reneeccrn]

more photos
[/IMG]
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/...ofVestibule.jpg[/IMG]

[TarheelFrag]

ummm by chance have you had the ATF drop by asking to see your backyard meth lab?

[redox]

I hope all your electrical is on a gfci . The humidity is murder on all metal things....like plugs . cool setup by the way. I think you have already gone over Hamburglar's buget. I hope thats not an extension cord I see there powering everything out there. Im no electrician but .......

[Reefbone]

Long thread... Glad your having fun but I must say I'm glad I'm not your neighbor. I'd hate to look out my window and see the the barrels and plastic sheeting. Looks like a hillbillys yard

[BallaBooyeaH]

any stats on growth on the coral in the GH?

How about some pics of the corals in the tanks? How many can you fit in the seven tanks?

[Serioussnaps]

Can I ask why?

[reneeccrn]

hey REDOX, yea i use 4 gfi's, on three different circuits. Everything is protected from moisture as much as possible.

Hey Reefbone, yall is right, but that was temporary, i just wanted to get those photos up asap. Besides, the nearest neighbor is 1/8 mile away, except for the cows on the farm behind us, they might be looking in.

BallaBooyeaH, I dont have any stats. The growth is much more, nothing remarkable. The COLOR on the other hand is VERY REMARKABLE. PURPLE HOT PINK BLUE!!!! I will post more photos of what is in those tanks. Unfortunately, May 21st I cut my thumb with the table saw when I was building another acrylic tank. Tried to make two thumbs on my right hand. Through the bone and all. Thats why I haven't been online.

Serioussnaps, no you cannot. I ask myself daily, and I don't have an answer.

[Kentanner11]

wow this brings alot of hope to me possibly starting a GH out of an old shead! Thanks for all the pages 12 so far of posts I have learned alot!